Transfers, a real eye opener!

penton

Vital 1st Team Regular
#1
Below is an interesting piece from the Telegraph that is a real eye opener. It shows all the transfers, loans, and movements in League two and proves that far from being unique we are just one of the vast majority that is filled with, freebies, cast offs and no hopers, it appears that some just make a better fist of organising their no hopers.
Surely this blows the argument of 'what do you expect? We are a team of freebies and players no one else wanted' strange that!! So is everyone else!
It's how you craft your silk purse out of the sows ear that counts at this level

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/competitions/league-two/10120678/League-Two-Summer-Transfers-2013.html
 

cornypomp

Vital Squad Member
#2
penton - 17/11/2013 08:59
Surely this blows the argument of 'what do you expect? We are a team of freebies and players no one else wanted' strange that!! So is everyone else!
It's how you craft your silk purse out of the sows ear that counts at this level
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If I remember correctly Penton... Our very own 'Tim' nailed this quite some time back when the 'what do you expect' argument was being put forward for our dismal performances. As you say, its how you shuffle your pack, to use yet another anagram...
 

Chix

Vital Champions League
#3
Pents .. you are right that is an interesting article and it did open my eyes a little ... I knew we weren't the only club like that .. but had no idea how many o the others we the same.... although...

I don't think your 'It's how you craft your silk purse out of the sows ear that counts at this level' is the only consideration to be taken into account.

Rather than me directly oppose our view I'll offer the debate for and against the freebies argument in the hope it sparks further debate..

For ... To add to Pentons point .. You may also remember that Guy was very quick off the mark in securing his squad .. sometimes not even waiting too see who would become available once the premiership squads were announced .. he had his squad in place BEFORE the annual trickle down of players

Against ... It's all very well and good stating that other teams are made up of loan players and freebies but what the list doesn't show is that we are a middling team when it comes to wages ... sure Fleetwood have freebies but they are paying league One wages .. Pompey are not .. Within the context of the league we have an average bunch of freebies and no-hopers .. and we are exactly where we should be ..6 points off relegation zone .. six points off the play offs.... I.e an average position for an average team


 

paultsmouth

Vital 1st Team Regular
#4
One little moot point I feel I should make, after the fans takeover, only a few months ago, most fans spoke of consolidation and stability, we all said we would be happy to sit in league2 for a couple of seasons, get a footing and start building from the very bottom, 7 months on people want the manager replaced and the squad revamped, All short sighted in my view, I for one will take mid table this season, I'll take it next year too, I would rather watch a young Dan Butler make mistakes at left back than a right footed veteran in Devera I admit, but I think us fans are losing all proportion of expectation once more.
 

Chix

Vital Champions League
#5
Paul .. I quite agree but feel that I am now the lone voice when once all were with me ... There is not excuse for lack of commitment though and like you I'd rather see Whatmough Webster and Butler in our back four .. and Wallace Tarbuck Awford and Maloney in our middle and Bird and Harris up front ..We might get beaten but those guys would run their socks off .. If we keep playing the same 16 players we will never find our next Jed Wallace
 

Emsworthianblue

Vital Reserves Team
#6
But it's not just the defeats, it's the manner of them. We expected to have to fight really hard because we expected every team we come up against to look upon the Pompey fixture as a "their cup final", but the fact of the matter is we have been beaten by teams who have not had to rip up any trees to do it. Yes it takes time for a team to gell, but the effort should be in evidence from day 1. In truth, I too would rather Guy was not sacked, but he badly needs help. Whether that is from a sports phsychologist or a defensive guru as his No 2 on the training ground to drill the back four (or both) I do not know but we are all suffering at the moment, the manager, the players, the fans (and most probably the board). Of course stability and survival were the key issues this season, but please let's not use this as an excuse for apathy and lacklustre, effortless displays from the team!"
 
#8
That was a fascinating list penton...

I was so surprised at how little money was paid out for players, well surprised would be wrong as there isnt much money floating about in league two (or one) but literally all moves from all clubs were frees or loan!

There are very few in this league that will have an excessive budget (a couple of notable exceptions) so even at our lowest ebb you would have thought that perhaps some others might have been better options, but hindsight and all that eh!

Lets also not forget that plenty of our signings opted against more money at others clubs, or playing higher so (on paper anyway) its not really been scraped together this season has it?

The players being good enough or not, being played in the right positions, getting the best out of them or not etc. etc. always comes back to the manager and at the end of the day he is the one that brought them in so we can have no excuses really can we...

Midtable, around 10th, remains ok with me.

Problem is I am becoming increasingly concerned that we could quite easily slip backwards and not forward (of course by the same thought we could go forward with a few wins) and have (like I have said previously) more concerns about things going forward, ST numbers will drop off if we are not careful.
 
#9
Chix - 17/11/2013 10:58

Paul .. I quite agree but feel that I am now the lone voice when once all were with me ... There is not excuse for lack of commitment though and like you I'd rather see Whatmough Webster and Butler in our back four .. and Wallace Tarbuck Awford and Maloney in our middle and Bird and Harris up front ..We might get beaten but those guys would run their socks off .. If we keep playing the same 16 players we will never find our next Jed Wallace
Come now Chixy... do you not think thats somewhat unfair and untrue?

How often have many of us (and I can say 100% for myself) been banging on about our disappointment at the likes of Webster, Butler, Maloney etc. being shipped out of the squad, let alone the side and then send out on loan.

They were deemed good enough last season but not so now, despite a step down in division - they probably are battlers, fighters and would be up for the fight, when perhaps others arent?

Lets just say that Whittingham does keep his job, and doesnt move aside, when January gets here the answer is NOT to look to be dipping into the transfer market again it is to start looking at what we have again and USE that.

I say we put an embargo in place.

No one comes in and from those on short-term contracts we either part comany (and a few probably do need to go) or we decide they are worthy and tie them down until the end of the season with an option of another and use the kids that are currently out on loan to not only bulk out squad but do so with a chance in the 1st team being given in place of those that arent cutting it but being allowed chance after chance after chance no matter how many errors they make.

Kids will make mistakes, they can only learn by doing so and playing 1st team football. They have done this elsewhere for a few months so we should have no excuse for not using them shortly and also if those coming through are good enough, as the old saying goes they are old enough...

Fans will also be far more forgiving if its the likes of them playing, being beaten but definitely giving their all as opposed to some of what we are currently seeing.
 

Chix

Vital Champions League
#10
Rug .. you misunderstood my point .. my first sentence was not in relation to youth .. but to becoming a loan voice in the fact that I still believe stability and survival are our primary goals this year ... and although I will be disappointed if that is all we achieve I will be pleased that we at least set out to do was done

Those that want promotion of a play-off place have forgotten what they said in July and August .. hence Pauls point.
 
#11
My bad on that one.

I did kind of thing you meant it more in terms of that - started a bit of a rant (not at you, but in general about youth) so carried on.
 

penton

Vital 1st Team Regular
#12
Chix, I've never said I'm happy to just survive! I want at least a play off place if not promotion, I don't think that's too much to expect of my team!
What's the point in turning up for us as fans or the team if just surviving is all I'm given as an option?! I will accept mid table or lower if they've given me their all, and so far, despite enjoying the whole trip they haven't in general!
Bloody annoying is a phrase I'd use for this season! We are so close sometimes to being a very decent L2 side and yet only a pass away from being relegation crappy fodder!!
 

Chix

Vital Champions League
#13
Andy _ I never said you said you were happy just to survive .. I was commenting on a point made by Paul and both Rug and now you have taken it as it wasn't meant .. So it must be me ! :17:

All I was saying it that I feel that since the summer when most would have all been happy with survival many have now changed there mind and have far greater expectations based on nothing whereas I WILL be OK with survival (as that is what we set out to do) but I do feel we can do better .. but that will be a bonus

I agree completely about commitment and the players giving 100% all of the time - I think that should be a given when wearing a Pompey shirt and what irks me more is that Guy made that quite clear to every player he signed .. you only have to read their opening interviews to see that.

I know you see the season as bloody annoying .. but I would say we are a third of the way through 6 points off relegation and 6 points off the play-offs .. I would however expect better performances in the next two -thirds .. it that bring a higher league position then great .. if it doesn't and we end up mid table or just about relegation then it will be a MUST DO BETTER situation but at least we would have a years experience under our belt and and a lot more knowledge .... and most importantly .. we would have survived ..

All in all I don't think our thinking is too far away .

 

penton

Vital 1st Team Regular
#14
Hey Chix I wasn't having a dig at you in my reply, sorry about that, I replied as if I was talking, never a good thing in txt form!
 

Chix

Vital Champions League
#15
penton - 18/11/2013 17:58

Hey Chix I wasn't having a dig at you in my reply, sorry about that, I replied as if I was talking, never a good thing in txt form!
nah no worries .. it just became one of those I said you said threads but no worries .. as I said .. I think we have differing opinions but basically not that far apart .. and obviously both want the same thing