They're gonna make me a criminal | Page 2 | Vital Football

They're gonna make me a criminal

ThreeSixes said:
I hope you aren't trying.to pretend this is some Nazi, ethnic cleansing type issue?
Click to expand...

First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

----

One day they might come for you
 
MedwayModernist said:
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a socialist.

Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.

----

One day they might come for you
Click to expand...
Who are "they"?
 
ThreeSixes said:
Who are "they"?
Click to expand...
Jerryattrick said:
you will find out when it's your turn lol.

Watch it happening now with the arrest of people for posting something on social media now or belonging to a certain party or whatever todays interpretation of hate speech is.
Click to expand...

"Song of Choice" (Seeger / Gaughan)
Early every year the seeds are growing Unseen, unheard they lie beneath the ground Would you know before their leaves are showing That with weeds all your garden will abound? If you close your eyes, stop your ears Shut your mouth then how can you know ? For seeds you cannot hear may not be there Seeds you cannot see may never grow In January you've still got the choice You can cut the weeds before they start to bud If you leave them to grow high they'll silence your voice And in December you may pay with your blood So close your eyes, stop your ears, Shut your mouth and take it slow Let others take the lead and you bring up the rear And later you can say you didn't know Every day another vulture takes flight There's another danger born every morning In the darkness of your blindness the beast will learn to bite How can you fight if you can't recognise a warning? Today you may earn a living wage Tomorrow you may be on the dole Though there's millions going hungry you needn't disengage For it's them, not you, that's fallen in the hole It's alright for you if you run with the pack It's alright if you agree with all they do If fascism is slowly climbing back It's not here yet so what's it got to do with you? The weeds are all around us and they're growing It'll soon be too late for the knife If you leave them on the wind that around the world is blowing You may pay for your silence with your life So close your eyes, stop your ears, Shut your mouth and never dare And if it happens here they'll never come for you Because they'll know you really didn't care _

 
Buddha said:
Yes, that's right mate. The debate had been scheduled for Monday January 25th but it has been postponed. It will still happen though.

If the government make trespass illegal it will further threaten my community. We already find it incredibly difficult to sustain our culture and way of life due to a lack of authorised sites, no common land, planning laws and discrimination when making planning applications, and the already existing laws relating to squatting (CJA 1994 made it illegal for us to park in groups containing more than six vehicles).

But it's not just travellers. This law will effect everybody's rights of access to the countryside. Please, please, everybody, I urge you to use this template and contact your local MP. Please also share on social media. Many thanks.

https://www.righttoroam.org.uk/mpletter
Click to expand...
Done my first correspondence with my new MP .Best wishes Buddha. I too enjoy countryside walks often footpaths are badly marked which can lead to walking unincidental trespassing which I know I have done in the past.
 
Buddha said:
But they already do have to deal with travellers if there are complaints that the travellers are being anti-social. And believe me, such complaints are made the moment we arrive anywhere. Not because we are being anti-social, just because people immediately assume that we will be.
Click to expand...

I can only speak from what happens in Medway. Traveller group rocks up, police say it is the landowners responsibility, landowner issues a notice to leave, traveller group leaves the place looking like a shit sty (literally). Council spends tax payers money to clean it up. Traveller group rocks up half a mile away and the process repeats.

People live in fear of increased crime and social nuisance when they are there.

I know this isn't your group Bud but it is many people experience of the travelling community.

The police might have powers but they don't use them - they sit behind its a civil matter for the land owner bollox. Forget the damage to get on site, local crime, etc.

Interestingly most have Irish number plates - shame Brexit migration restrictions don't apply or do they ?
 
Last edited:
markinkent said:
I can only speak from what happens in Medway. Traveller group rocks, police say it is the landowners responsibility, landowner issues a notice to leave, traveller group leaves the place looking like a shit sty (literally). Council spends tax payers money to clean it up. Traveller group rocks up half a mile away and the process repeats.

People live in fear of increased crime and social nuisance when they are there.

I know this isn't your group Bud but it is many people experience of the travelling community.

The police might have powers but they don't use them - they sit behind its a civil matter for the land owner bollox. Forget the damage to get on site, local crime, etc.

Interestingly most have Irish number plates - shame Brexit migration restrictions don't apply or do they ?
Click to expand...

Then the wording of the law must be restricted to where we genuinely have issues and not be a catchall that results in rights being rescinded
.
 
Buddha said:
But not just me, this will effect everybody who lives in the UK.
Click to expand...

Would have made a big difference to my son a couple of years back. He's an urban explorer and likes exploring old abandoned buildings. He takes photos / videos and is good at it, they come out very atmospheric. Long story short he gets nicked coming out (someone phoned the police) but he pointed out to the officer that he hadn't broken in (showed the unsecured door) and pointed out that Trespass was a civil offence only. Copper phoned me up and was very pragmatic about, said that he would need to bring him home (U16) and wanted to read him the riot act to put him off exploring abandoned building in case he got hurt. I was OK with that. The landowner had no interest in pressing charges so that was the end of it. I guess it would have been a criminal offence had this proposal gone through earlier

Similarly we used to explore loads of off road tracks through the woods when I was into mountain biking almost certainly trespassed.

There is a difference to people exploring and doing no harm and travellers shitting in the kids playing fields but I guess there won't be in the eyes of the law.
 
ThreeSixes said:
Yeah, obviously. It's changing trespass from a civil matter (council) to a criminal (police) matter. The last thing the police are going to want to do is deal with travellers, after filling their boots for months dishing out fines to people drinking coffee at reservoirs
Click to expand...

Lot of truth in that. People used to talk about you never saw a bobby on the beat to deter crime. Certainly see loads now stopping people going anywhere.

I fully support lockdown, its the right thing to do. I just hope the police stay out on patrol post COVID.
 
Definitely mountain bikers are complaining more re restrictions on trails and routes as they are much more evident now ....normally under the guise of other excuses.

there is a woodland between boxley and walderslade where a notice went up a while back prohibiting mountain bikers as it was designated an area of natural beauty where rare insects were ....which made me laugh as the same sign was in place on blue bell hill Chatham bound parallel to the golf course and that got dug up by the council !!!!

so we need to be very cautious about these catch all laws as they often have populist headlines to get support then are used for other motives.
 
markinkent said:
Would have made a big difference to my son a couple of years back. He's an urban explorer and likes exploring old abandoned buildings. He takes photos / videos and is good at it, they come out very atmospheric. Long story short he gets nicked coming out (someone phoned the police) but he pointed out to the officer that he hadn't broken in (showed the unsecured door) and pointed out that Trespass was a civil offence only. Copper phoned me up and was very pragmatic about, said that he would need to bring him home (U16) and wanted to read him the riot act to put him off exploring abandoned building in case he got hurt. I was OK with that. The landowner had no interest in pressing charges so that was the end of it. I guess it would have been a criminal offence had this proposal gone through earlier

Similarly we used to explore loads of off road tracks through the woods when I was into mountain biking almost certainly trespassed.

There is a difference to people exploring and doing no harm and travellers shitting in the kids playing fields but I guess there won't be in the eyes of the law.
Click to expand...

There is a huge disused dairy in Torrington in Devon that many youngsters liked to explore but unfortunately one lad died last year, falling through a roof.
Many young people still regularly go there but it quite dangerous to those who don’t know the place.
 
shotshy said:
There is a huge disused dairy in Torrington in Devon that many youngsters liked to explore but unfortunately one lad died last year, falling through a roof.
Many young people still regularly go there but it quite dangerous to those who don’t know the place.
Click to expand...

We used to go down the chalk hole at Berengrave Lane. Always getting warned off about children drowning in the watery bits. I have a feeling we took more chances on our bikes going there and back. I got knocked off my bike by a motor scooter going down there. A pal got his leg run over by a lorry outside our house. We survived the chalk hole. A building can be a different order of danger, true. An in law went through a glass roof when he was a kid (don't ask). Even so, I hope boys and girls continue to explore and, of course, whether I hope or not, they will.
 
shotshy said:
There is a huge disused dairy in Torrington in Devon that many youngsters liked to explore but unfortunately one lad died last year, falling through a roof.
Many young people still regularly go there but it quite dangerous to those who don’t know the place.
Click to expand...

We've made him promise never to go alone so if he had an accident someone would be there to phone for help.

It would be hypocritical of me to forbid it (he would ignore me) given what we got up to as kids. We used to play on the little row boats off strood pier, bailing the water out with buckets and climb under sun pier Chatham. Scares me now to think of it.

I agree with jokerman about exploring. It should be part of their childhood

I did make it clear to my son that if ever broke in to any of the abandoned buildings then I'd get him a new gills season ticket as a punishment so I hope we have an understanding.

He did an old hospital once and in the video blended in old footage of the hospital when it as open i.e. walking through derelict wards and then going through doors and into wards full of footage patients and staff. I wish I was that clever.

To be fair the copper was spot on. Asked for my permission to really lay on the seriousness and what could happen if the owner pressed charges. Almost old school without the clip around the ear.
 
My lads were far more sensible and compliant than I ever was.
In fact they still are.
I’ve always had the’streak’
 
ThreeSixes said:
Who are "they"?
Click to expand...

Those with power over others.

Throughout history, minorities have been blamed and oppressed as "others", as if it's their fault for society's ills.

The point is, when "they" round up X and it doesn't improve things, they then turn to blame Y. When that doesn't improve things, they then turn to blame Z, which will also not solve the problems, as ultimately the problems aren't any minority's faults.

So what happens when you take this to it's natural conclusion? You will eventually be blamed for society's ills.

Society will hate you, and may well be round you up.
 
MedwayModernist said:
Those with power over others.

Throughout history, minorities have been blamed and oppressed as "others", as if it's their fault for society's ills.

The point is, when "they" round up X and it doesn't improve things, they then turn to blame Y. When that doesn't improve things, they then turn to blame Z, which will also not solve the problems, as ultimately the problems aren't any minority's faults.

So what happens when you take this to it's natural conclusion? You will eventually be blamed for society's ills.

Society will hate you, and may well be round you up.
Click to expand...
You know the proposed law is designed to stop ****** camping out in school / doctors surgeries car parks etc. It isn't a human rights issue
 
You must log in or register to reply here.