The (Possible Premature) Official Welcome Back Michael Dawson Thread | Page 5 | Vital Football

The (Possible Premature) Official Welcome Back Michael Dawson Thread

Thank you for the replies about the England team of the time- really interesting. My first game was 93 or 94 against Palace the year we were promoted, but I didn't start really going until 1998. I am 35 in a couple of months, so as you say, a couple of years younger than Those Feet but unfortunately came to football properly at the relatively late age of about 14.

I suppose with Dawson another question you might ask is: were he ten years younger would he be going to the world cup this summer? For me that's a yes. I think Dawson in his prime is better than several of the defenders we are taking, and in that sense he was unlucky to be playing in an era of genuinly great defenders like Terry and Ferdinand.
 
I am not sure whether that makes you lucky or unlucky in a way.

You are unlucky in the sense that you missed out on a 10-15 year period where we were the toast and envy of most sides in Europe, when our players were true club legends.

You are lucky in that you did not have to witness just how steep our decline and fall from grace was. We are constantly accused of living in the past but it is because we were genuinely that good and that memorable to the extent that we had a major say in most England squads of the time.

As for Dawson, he may well have got into more squads and teams now but Walker was the Ferdinand of his time and would have been first choice in every squad over the last 30 years, he was that good.
 
Basha73 said:
I am not sure whether that makes you lucky or unlucky in a way.

You are unlucky in the sense that you missed out on a 10-15 year period where we were the toast and envy of most sides in Europe, when our players were true club legends.

You are lucky in that you did not have to witness just how steep our decline and fall from grace was. We are constantly accused of living in the past but it is because we were genuinely that good and that memorable to the extent that we had a major say in most England squads of the time.

As for Dawson, he may well have got into more squads and teams now but Walker was the Ferdinand of his time and would have been first choice in every squad over the last 30 years, he was that good.
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I can't say it feels very lucky to be honest Basha.

The highlight of my forest watching 20 years has been promotion from League One. I was around for 1998 but to be honest I expected it. At 14 it never occurred to me for one minute we wouldn't be promoted as Champions.

The loss of that expectation is as representative of our decline as anything else. Were we to get into a good position now I would assume we would blow it, because forest no longer seem like an outfit that can hold its nerve and achieve anything.
 
I can understand that. During our pomp we were all just along for the ride, making the most of every minute in the sun. We went into every game knowing we had a chance and a team capable of beating anyone. Our heroes were known throughout the division and coveted.

30 years later and it’s almost heart breaking. Watching players who couldn’t hold a candle up to our former teams, thinking they are God’s gift and then bottling it time after time.

I know that even if our owners take us back up we probably won’t be what we once were but it would be great to have a team to be proud of again, thinking or even knowing we had s chance no matter who we played.
 
Basha73 said:
I can understand that. During our pomp we were all just along for the ride, making the most of every minute in the sun. We went into every game knowing we had a chance and a team capable of beating anyone. Our heroes were known throughout the division and coveted.

30 years later and it’s almost heart breaking. Watching players who couldn’t hold a candle up to our former teams, thinking they are God’s gift and then bottling it time after time.

I know that even if our owners take us back up we probably won’t be what we once were but it would be great to have a team to be proud of again, thinking or even knowing we had s chance no matter who we played.
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I might add (being a good 10 years older) u also saw the players round town a lot more- most of em were pretty cool about lots of young uns coming up all night and saying well played today or that ref was a.git to u.

Different world b4 the money came
 
Apollyon said:
Im 26 and started going in 2004
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Ouch. I am slightly too young to appreciate the European Cup success but I can console myself with Brian Clough, Walker, Pearce and numerous league cups as well as the Frank Clark team with Collymore, Bohinen and Roy...

You have Billy as your highlight.
 
Basha73 said:
Ouch. I am slightly too young to appreciate the European Cup success but I can console myself with Brian Clough, Walker, Pearce and numerous league cups as well as the Frank Clark team with Collymore, Bohinen and Roy...

You have Billy as your highlight.
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Yeah, Billy Walker.
 
It's hard to say if Des was better, but I would put him in the same league as Terry and Ferdinand.

I would have the likes of Adams, Campbell, Wright and Butcher as Tier 2

The likes of Cahill, Jagielka, Keown etc as Tier 3.

Dawson, Pallister as Tier 4.

The rest of the current lot as Tier 5 with the likes of Upson and Lescott.
 
ZedRed said:
It's hard to say if Des was better, but I would put him in the same league as Terry and Ferdinand.

I would have the likes of Adams, Campbell, Wright and Butcher as Tier 2

The likes of Cahill, Jagielka, Keown etc as Tier 3.

Dawson, Pallister as Tier 4.

The rest of the current lot as Tier 5 with the likes of Upson and Lescott.
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I think Dawson was miles better than Jagielka and Cahill, although I think you are doing a disservice to Keown
 
Calvin Plummer said:
Why though? I suspect that's Forest tinted glasses there.
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I'm sure you could say the same about Walker. Ask a Man Utd fan or Chelsea fan and I'm sure they would likely laugh at the equivalency of Walker to Terry or Ferdinand.

And remember that we are talking about Dawson as a Spurs player rather than as a forest player.

In reality there is no reliable comparison. It is all opinions.

I really didnt rate Jagielka though
 
Apollyon said:
Can you remember the war Radford?
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Tbf we've had a few since then. But yes I remember the Falklands war and the various conflicts since.

Sure it must bore to keep hearing how great football was b4 the PL. The downsides of those days was the racism and violence- it wasn't all rose tinted.
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I'm sure you could say the same about Walker. Ask a Man Utd fan or Chelsea fan and I'm sure they would likely laugh at the equivalency of Walker to Terry or Ferdinand.

And remember that we are talking about Dawson as a Spurs player rather than as a forest player.

In reality there is no reliable comparison. It is all opinions.

I really didnt rate Jagielka though
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Terry was probably the best of his generation; Ferdinand was one of the most over rated players at that time.

He had a yard of pace and looked comfortable on the ball but he lacked one facet that is mandatory in all good defenders - courage.

He was very easily bullied by aggressive forwards, sometimes to the extent were he looked scared to death.

He looked a far better player when he had that Serbian nut job along side him doing all of the dirty work
 
Pope John XXIII said:
I'm sure you could say the same about Walker. Ask a Man Utd fan or Chelsea fan and I'm sure they would likely laugh at the equivalency of Walker to Terry or Ferdinand.

And remember that we are talking about Dawson as a Spurs player rather than as a forest player.

In reality there is no reliable comparison. It is all opinions.

I really didnt rate Jagielka though
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Walker was rated up and down the country, he was for years seen as one of the best in the world and played a pivotal roll in us reaching the World Cup semis where we were incredibly unlucky to lose.

Any fan of football in the 80s to early 90s knew he was the very best we had.

You've dug yourself a giant hole and you're just making it worse

Btw Dawson wasn't even beloved at Spurs, they thought he was decent but hardly in the King class.
 
Dawson-heart says he will be great for us but head reminds me he was part of a Hull side near the wrong end of the table. Not sure overall
 
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