The Douglas Luiz Thread | Page 33 | Vital Football

The Douglas Luiz Thread

Silhillvilla said:
I don't think the Luiz incident had any bearing on today's result anyway, the second half was piss poor so defeat was inevitable
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Yeah I cant argue, they have quality in all depts, they always had another gear to drop into. We were again ahead against the original traditional top 4 club and bottled it.... leaving the Luiz clusterfuck aside it is a given that they will get a penalty against us the trick is not to give the ref an opportunity to award one.

It is frustrating, no VAR looking at Rashford kicking out at Konsa......
The hand ball, the ref could have stopped the game to await a decision but knew it was never going to be given.... Frustrating that we know the dice is loaded and we still do stupid things. El Ghaz and Barkley could have gone off after 20 minutes and we would have not known, get this season out of the way and hope the big man gets money to spend on at least 3 to 4 top quality players.

Overall I would have settle for where we are before a ball was kicked but ....
Even with this squad it could have been so much better.
 
Melon Donkey said:
I rate him. Always have.

But he needs his arse kicking for that today and I would drop him next game to show him that today was not acceptable. And if he throws his toys out instead of knuckling down to improve then fcuk him off.
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He has to learn from this. He's got the raw materials to be a very good player, but he needs to show more maturity. Given he's still young - (in fact happy 23rd birthday Dougie!) but he should know better by now, especially as the same player did him in the corresponding fixture.... I can accept any young player doing bone-headed things once in a while, but don't repeat it!!
 
Not sure there's such things as DMs and AMs anymore. Good midfielders have a variety of skills which enables them to play as required. Nakamba seems to get overlooked because he's what would be considered a straightforward DM (at which he's very good). I think the trouble with Luiz is that he can play a number of roles but isn't consistently good at any of them.

Early days. Maybe he'll come back a better player next season. But by then he's likely to have competition from summer signings.
 
Man Utd were getting a penalty one way or another. Luiz was stupid to make it easy for them but I wouldn't be too harsh. We were never going to be allowed to win that game.

I get the feeling that we are playing the wrong formation. Our midfield always looks weak and none of them seem to be doing what they are best at.
 
I would like us to try a 4 1 4 1 with Luiz not at DM. Maybe

Martinez
Cash Konsa Mings Targett
Marvelous
Bert SJM Luiz Jack
Watkins.

Luiz appears to not have the nous to play DM at the moment.
 
Yep.
Hard done by Marvellous. Should be a place for him next game either in the same side as Duggie or replacing him.as punishment for his stupidity yesterday.

Luiz says he needs to learn. Getting splinters next game might make him see the consequences of his actions.

He cost us the game.
 
Platypus said:
I don't recall many attacks head on at our CBs, rather almost all down our flanks, so Luiz must have been doing something right. I think his ridiculous decision in that moment is clouding people's judgement of the game he had overall.
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I agree with this, he's a good player that generally has a positive effect on our game, even if it largely goes unnoticed. Mistakes in his game and especially his rash behaviour is an issue, but I think that is in part due to his age. He's still a baby really, especially for a DM type of role.
 
Old Trinity Villan said:
I would like us to try a 4 1 4 1 with Luiz not at DM. Maybe

Martinez
Cash Konsa Mings Targett
Marvelous
Bert SJM Luiz Jack
Watkins.

Luiz appears to not have the nous to play DM at the moment.
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That was basically how we lined up against Man City. Pretty sure we did it a couple of times earlier in the season as well
 
My initial thought when it happened was "here we go again" as he's been giving away stupid fouls like that all season.

Then I started to think "what's the point in having a DM who can't tackle??"

Now I've calmed down, I'm starting to think straighter. 2 of our best dm's of recent times couldn't tackle either.... Barry and Petrov.... The difference was they were clever enough not to try to in dangerous positions in case they gave a silly foul away.

So it's not really a case of teaching Luiz to tackle, but more teaching him not to try in situations like yesterday. He is still young however and hopefully he'll learn.
 
DeanoVilla said:
My initial thought when it happened was "here we go again" as he's been giving away stupid fouls like that all season.

Then I started to think "what's the point in having a DM who can't tackle??"

Now I've calmed down, I'm starting to think straighter. 2 of our best dm's of recent times couldn't tackle either.... Barry and Petrov.... The difference was they were clever enough not to try to in dangerous positions in case they gave a silly foul away.

So it's not really a case of teaching Luiz to tackle, but more teaching him not to try in situations like yesterday. He is still young however and hopefully he'll learn.
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A hard tackling DM isn’t right for today’s game. A DM who can intercept balls to win back possession and use their body to win the ball in tight situations is more what we need.

Luiz plays his best for us when he is doing that intercepting of the balls. I remember a few quality games he had in lockdown last season where he seemed to be nicking everything and then starting the play.

Marv is better at the more physical side of the above, a good 50:50 winner when going shoulder to shoulder with someone, and a decent interceptor of the ball.

I’d like a bit more height, solidity and leadership in our midfield. A sort of McTominay type player, or a clone of Konsa and we play him midfield.

Luiz will go into great things, I just wonder if it’ll be in any other league than the premiership. He’s a quality player, he would love some other leagues in Europe perhaps more suited to how he wants to play. Sometimes the intensity of this league is too much for him.
 
I don't get that Sil, everyone learns on the job particularly footballers it's why they peak at 28 onwards - it's never been any different - Yorkie learnt on the job, as did Bozzie, as did Spink, Barry, Milner, as did God and so on.

I'd agree you don't want 'too many' learning on the job when you apply it strictly to younger players but having experience around them doesn't mean stockpiling 34 yr olds again.

He's clearly not going backwards though, he's just hit a wobble during a period where the entire first team have wobbled and everyone is up in arms over a soft challenge that Pogba cheated on.

I don't think he played too badly at all to be honest from what I saw...his head after Pogba though. With more of the team back at it, he's improved again himself mostly.
 
I think he’s better when he doesn’t have that extra man in midfield sat alongside him. Let Luiz play in that space, and move SJM higher up so that when Luiz has the ball, it’s less congested and secondly, he has another option to pass to a player up the pitch.

I get why players drop for the better teams, but against the likes of West Brom we were too negative with our formation.
 
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