The best way to manage / handle extreme views?

  • Thread starter Villan Of The North
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Villan Of The North

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The rise of the Nazis in 1930s Germany was initially ignored, democratic principles and mature attitudes saying that, if we ignore these people we will marginalise them and they will eventually go away. History shows us that this was a big mistake and that, by the time the President tried to do something they had gained popular support through good publicity and playing on the public's fears and insecurities (I know this is oversimplified but this is not the place for an historical essay analysing the run up to WWII).

On the other hand we have people like GT saying we should ban Islam - this is not a comment on GT but I think it's clear that the concept of banning free thought and speech (which is what banning any religion is actually doing) is an extreme view. GT has not been ignored, his views have been debated....the result, we have given his views a platform, (currently) 7 pages of debate has ensured that far more people have read his views than would have been the case had his initial post been ignored by those opposing his views. We that oppose have given him the publicity needed to spread his views.

The same argument can be made for UKIP, although I do understand that much of UKIP is fairly main-stream, they do tend to attract the right wing nutters that spout extreme right wing views - we (the public, not least on VV) have debated and argued against these views. The net result, they have gained so much attention that they have risen to over 12% of the popular vote, again, playing on the fears of the public.

So do we ignore or debate, or is there a third way?

 
Good thread, Ian.

I don't like the word "argue", so I'm going to have to think of a term for what I propose.

If we are talking Islam, then we have to engage with them. We need to stop making them think we are the enemy, and giving them reasons to hate us. To do this we have to work with the majority, moderate Muslims, much as we are doing now.

The picture is complicated by the fact that each Muslim group also hate each other, so you're not talking to one source.

Also, the reasons Islam is used to gain control and power is a separate issue. These are interested in the wealth that their conquests gain, and I suspect that one day we will have to fight them on the ground, once again.

I'm off out now, but I'll get back tot oyu tonight!!
 
It's all well and good to say "See both sides of the coin but learn each other whats best" Clive but how do we do that. I suspect you mean option 1, argue the point (argue does not mean quarrel, it means to debate and discuss, putting forward your viewpoint in a structured manner) After all, if we are to look at both sides we need to know trheir viewpoint.
 
Trekker - 20/5/2015 10:27

I think name calling, violence, intolerance and beheadings work.
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Well it certainly achieves a resolution, as long as it's done to all on the opposing side.

 
LOL Trekker dude PMSL the man has a point you know lol

We need to be able to talk about anything at all, best always looking both sides of the coin or you will never fully understand what someone is meaning and why they am bringing up such views some think extreme etc,

I am lucky, i have been wrong in life so many times i now accept i am probably going to endup wrong sooner or later about something lol so i try and see why and what makes my views or point wrong and if i feel there is a better way been explained i accept it and call it learning,,,the trouble today is so many people have to be right but we am all learning and can from each other,

So my point is we have to accept each others feelings views and why we feel that way before writing anybody off as a baddie or nuts,,,now GT dude is nuts don't get me wrong ;0) but i don't find him evil nasty or threatening, he says what he feels and a lot iot of his views am from his beliefs and religion he lives for, which i see as to why he may come across as extreme or harsh to some but when looking at his way of life and he says what he see's i put myself in his shoes and can see why he thinks some things,

The thing i relate to is like immigration, i have seen family members and freinds in my area unable to get a home yet within my estate immigrants have started moving into 4 bed houses 3 bed houses so the tension this creates and then the media spouting what they do then religious beliefs all add upto feelings that can seem extreme to some that don't see this in life houses needed by poor familie not being religious then they won't see why people like GT dude say things like they do,

I ay defending GT dude on everything far from it, but i do believe we need to put ourselves in others shoes even when we disagree totally what somebody says
 
I think GT is a little jealous of Islamic extremists. I think he'd love to live in an old testament theocracy.
 
Trekker - 20/5/2015 09:56

Or we could sit down and discuss it with a pint and some pork scratchings.
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Trekker dude you would make a great Prime Minister, this is the best way any debate should be sorted out :8:
 
Now you're talking Trekker and Clive. But don't forget the pork pie and a jar of mustard to soak up some of them pints.....
 
Trekker - 20/5/2015 10:56

Or we could sit down and discuss it with a pint and some pork scratchings.
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So you're planning on inviting Mormons and Jews too then?

 
Pride of Lions - 20/5/2015 10:13

Now you're talking Trekker and Clive. But don't forget the pork pie and a jar of mustard to soak up some of them pints.....
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OH MY McGRAAAATH Pork pie AND mustard,,,,life does not get much better, now that would be a heavenly debate dudes :136:
 
Villan Of The North - 20/5/2015 10:25

Trekker - 20/5/2015 10:56

Or we could sit down and discuss it with a pint and some pork scratchings.
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So you're planning on inviting Mormons and Jews too then?
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Of course. Tea and shellfish available too :14:
(Yes, I do know before anyone jumps in)

 
Trekker - 20/5/2015 11:31

Villan Of The North - 20/5/2015 10:25

Trekker - 20/5/2015 10:56

Or we could sit down and discuss it with a pint and some pork scratchings.
Click to expand...

So you're planning on inviting Mormons and Jews too then?
Click to expand...



Of course. Tea and shellfish available too :14:
(Yes, I do know before anyone jumps in)
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Traditional Hindus and Buddhist too then, just to fill the vegetarian quota.
 
The only difference between virtual life and the debates in the pub is you can't hit someone by virtual. OK you can throw a virtual punch but it isn't going to physically hurt anyone. In many ways that what Vital as other forums are. A virtual pub/dry bar.

What has this got to do with the topic? Hmm! Good question. My own thoughts are it is hard not to debate it. Ignoring things can sometimes make them go away. For instance ignoring a small child tantrums whilst keeping them safe will often make them realize eventually that there is no point. However with stuff like this you can't ignore it
 
Make them support Birmingham City, condem them to life with nothing but drudgery, make they sit next to smelly unwashed fuckers week in week out....

Thats extreme punishment.
 
Villan Of The North - 20/5/2015 11:02

Trekker - 20/5/2015 11:31

Villan Of The North - 20/5/2015 10:25

Trekker - 20/5/2015 10:56

Or we could sit down and discuss it with a pint and some pork scratchings.
Click to expand...

So you're planning on inviting Mormons and Jews too then?
Click to expand...



Of course. Tea and shellfish available too :14:
(Yes, I do know before anyone jumps in)
Click to expand...

Traditional Hindus and Buddhist too then, just to fill the vegetarian quota.
Click to expand...
What about Gay cake?? Would there be any Gay cake? :69:
 
col8 - 20/5/2015 11:16

Make them support Birmingham City, condem them to life with nothing but drudgery, make they sit next to smelly unwashed fuckers week in week out....

Thats extreme punishment.
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If they are good they can get parole to spend the rest fo their time with Carson Yeung in a Hong Kong jail :17:
 
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