Summer transfer thread | Page 31 | Vital Football

Summer transfer thread

HudWiganFan said:
As you say there's no room for sentiment in this game. The squad did a great job getting us up but so did the 15/16 team and we were 15 points or so adrift the following season. The 17/18 team crushed League One a bit more convincingly than we did last season I'd say and we barely stayed up the next season by about 4 or 5 points (even after some strong signings like James, Kipre, the returning Lee Evans and Garner who got us some crucial goals that season.)

I don't think we dominated the league enough for us last season to say our current squad will get the job done alone. The last few games like you mentioned exposed a few flaws that Championship clubs - even the bottom-half ones - will ruthlessly exploit as we well know from the endless late defeats in the last couple of Championship campaigns.

And I'm not a big fan of January either - or the very end of the summer window for that matter. It's all well and good saying the window's open until the end of August, but we saw how long it took Jason Kerr for example to get a look-in joining on the deadline with an already settled team who'd been together through pre-season and into the first 7 or 8 games of the campaign - months! Bennett too although that might've been more injury-related.

Leam made a point of emphasising how important getting players in early for the pre-season trip (in Scotland last year) was for team chemistry but it clearly hasn't worked out that way this season for whatever reason. Maybe it's simply because we can't compete for players but if it's a deliberate choice it seems strange to do a complete a U-turn on the philosophy Leam and co. emphasised the importance of this time last year.
Click to expand...

I think he emphasised the importance of players in last year due to the fact we had only four contracted players and it would have been senseless to have a pre season trip.

This season is different we have a squad of players and do not need to make early signings. I think you are reading too much into this by saying that we can't compete, it is more likely that the club are simply taking their time to get the right players in.

No doubt that when the players are back from training in Spain Leam and the staff will have a clearer idea of were they want to strengthen and the transfer business will commence.
 
There will be additions no doubt however I wouldn’t be surprised if these were more about depth and creating competition for places rather than bringing in players some would class as upgrades on what we have already. Probably loan signings (usually harder to do if their current managers want to see them in training first before making the decision to send out ) or we are after free agents who are potentially holding out for the best deal, who knows.

If Leam is successful in creating an environment where there is good competition for places in all positions then the challenge is for the players to maintain high levels to keep their spot in the team. If the performance levels of the players is good throughout majority of the season then I do think there is enough to be competitive and get results.

Big challenge for Leam and the coaching staff as well this year. No doubt it will be a learning curve for them.

I do think there is an element of damned if you do and damned if you don’t though. We could sign 3/4, still struggle and then fans would be conplaining why we didn’t give the original players a chance. If they don’t sign anyone then they should of made additions. Personally should we fail to stay up this year, I think it will be more down to combination of things rather then just qualities of the players.
 
TRUE BELIEVER said:
I think he emphasised the importance of players in last year due to the fact we had only four contracted players and it would have been senseless to have a pre season trip.

This season is different we have a squad of players and do not need to make early signings. I think you are reading too much into this by saying that we can't compete, it is more likely that the club are simply taking their time to get the right players in.

No doubt that when the players are back from training in Spain Leam and the staff will have a clearer idea of were they want to strengthen and the transfer business will commence.
Click to expand...

To be honest I would hope Leam and his staff would know by now were we need strengthening.
 
Usually loads of rumours floating about players but not a lot this year. Think we will be looking to unload a few if we can first. We have Jones he won’t want to come back from loan and not get game time so he’s one .Edwards could try to unload him. Humphrey could be a surprise out going. Couldn’t command a regular place in a league one team
 
There are advantages in sticking with what we have rather than bringing in more players.
The side have a successful season behind them and should be brimming with confidence and ambition. They have already bonded and are used to playing, training, boozing and living together. We wouldn't upset the applecart with new players earning more money. The present squad will also want to prove a point. Face it at the end of the day there are some cracking players in that squad so let's get behind them and have faith. They could surprise many people this season.
 
NorthernSoul said:
This window is all about quality over quantity. Due to building a squad from scratch we didn't have any senior players apart from Massey out of contract. I'd say our second string is stronger than any second second string we have been promoted from League One in any previous season. We just need to sign a few players to strengthen the starting 11 and add something to this group of players.

I reckon around 5 signings overall probably a couple of loanees amongst that, likely to be much later in pre season once Premier League clubs assess youngsters and who they want to loan out.

Rotherham had several out of contract and just lost Smith. They will need to make a lot more signings than us this window.
Click to expand...


I’d disagree with this. I’d actually say that this is the poorest squad we’ve ever been promoted with.
 
LaticsA said:
I’d disagree with this. I’d actually say that this is the poorest squad we’ve ever been promoted with.
Click to expand...

I agree and disagree, I think as a first 11 I would agree with you in some parts, and style of play, including some poor performances too. But I think the depth was not so bad, The bench we had could all easily start one week (even though the bench was hardly ever utilised)
 
LaticsA said:
I’d disagree with this. I’d actually say that this is the poorest squad we’ve ever been promoted with.
Click to expand...

Just to play devils advocate abit, do you think that’s the squad or could it not potentially be league one was much stronger this time around. Not saying your wrong or anything like.

Caldwell’s team was challenged by Burton, who had good players but other than them, no one else seemed to step up

Cook’s team, Blackburn were obviously challengers and Shrewsbury were very consistent throughout, arguably unlucky in the end to not get through

This season you could argue there was 5/6 teams who could all of been champions in their own right. We still managed to get through and be successful
 
When we went up under Caldwell we had a great spirit in the camp but we signed something like 13 players and offloaded about 10 - ultimately a lot of those new signings weren't any better than what we had and the amount of change lost the togetherness for no benefit.

That season we'd have been far better going with the team that took us up keeping that spirit and signing about a quarter or a third of the players we did. It's obviously easy to say in hindsight but everyone says this group is like a family, it's the best team spirit they've been a part of and how it was a huge part of our success - so it wouldn't at all suprise me if the management is actively trying to avoid a Caldwell like situation.

It's a balancing act where trying to improve your squad you can in fact make you weaker if you don't get it right.
 
Last edited:
Walton
James, Dunkley, Kipre, Robinson
Gibson, Morsy
Massey, Powell, Jacobs
Grigg

That was our starting XI in our first Championship game the last time we were promoted (a 3-2 win against Sheff Wed). Less than a week after that game we sold Max Power and signed Lee Evans, who became first choice over Gibson.

Amos
Darikwa, Whatmough, Tilt, Bennett
Power, Naylor
Lang, Keane, McClean
Magennis

As it stands, I expect that to be the starting XI against PNE unless we either bring in some genuine quality or Wyke is back to full fitness. For me Cook's team comfortably beats the side we have now and that team were in a relegation scrap all season.

I don't buy Richardson's spiel about giving players a chance. I just think we've been unable to secure the targets we've been after and that the owners are learning a harsh lesson regarding the finances of signing Championship players.

For balance, here is the starting line-up of Caldwell's side in our first Championship fixture (a loss against Bristol City). I think this team has a lot of similarities to our team now. Notably weak full/wing backs and central midfield, plus a questionable goalkeeper. That team of course were ultimately relegated.

Bogdan
Buxton, Morgan, Burn
Burke, Gilbey, Power, Perkins, Warnock
Grigg, Yanic
 
C_Latic said:
Walton
James, Dunkley, Kipre, Robinson
Gibson, Morsy
Massey, Powell, Jacobs
Grigg

That was our starting XI in our first Championship game the last time we were promoted (a 3-2 win against Sheff Wed). Less than a week after that game we sold Max Power and signed Lee Evans, who became first choice over Gibson.

Amos
Darikwa, Whatmough, Tilt, Bennett
Power, Naylor
Lang, Keane, McClean
Magennis

As it stands, I expect that to be the starting XI against PNE unless we either bring in some genuine quality or Wyke is back to full fitness. For me Cook's team comfortably beats the side we have now and that team were in a relegation scrap all season.

I don't buy Richardson's spiel about giving players a chance. I just think we've been unable to secure the targets we've been after and that the owners are learning a harsh lesson regarding the finances of signing Championship players.

For balance, here is the starting line-up of Caldwell's side in our first Championship fixture (a loss against Bristol City). I think this team has a lot of similarities to our team now. Notably weak full/wing backs and central midfield, plus a questionable goalkeeper. That team of course were ultimately relegated.

Bogdan
Buxton, Morgan, Burn
Burke, Gilbey, Power, Perkins, Warnock
Grigg, Yanic
Click to expand...
There’s no point comparing teams past and present. I though James and Robinson struggled
defensively and were out of position a lot that season. We really underachieved looking back at the squad we had.

In this league I think it’s all down to the manager and the system. Luton and Huddersfield massively overachieved last season. I don’t think there’s a stand out team like Fulham this time either. If we can still be hard to beat and consistent then we could have a good season. Yes it’s not pretty but we have got good foundations to build on. I do think we need some pace out wide to carry the ball forwards and some legs in midfield though.
 
Th10 said:
There’s no point comparing teams past and present. I though James and Robinson struggled
defensively and were out of position a lot that season. We really underachieved looking back at the squad we had.

In this league I think it’s all down to the manager and the system. Luton and Huddersfield massively overachieved last season. I don’t think there’s a stand out team like Fulham this time either. If we can still be hard to beat and consistent then we could have a good season. Yes it’s not pretty but we have got good foundations to build on. I do think we need some pace out wide to carry the ball forwards and some legs in midfield though.
Click to expand...
We didn't underachieve at all, staying up with players like Dunkley, Jacobs, Massey, Grigg/Vaughan/Clarke as regular starters was a fantastic achievement. You thought Reece James struggled defensively? Clearly the people who know what they are talking about disagree as he was named in the team of the season. As for Robinson, his raw pace provided a vital outlet both at the back and going forward, again something we don't have. He was a ten million pound player by January 2020. We were spoilt having those two as our full backs and the fact that Nathan Byrne couldn't get off the bench until James was moved into midfield says it all.

Luton have something we don't and never will have, a small compact ground which suits their style of play (high press, high voltage) down to a tee. Huddersfield play excellent football and are brilliantly coached regarding set pieces. We play shite football and effectively bullied teams in L1 which you can't do in the division above. Us and Rotherham were virtually identical in terms of style of play and Rotherham have been relegated from this division more times than I've had hot dinners. What does that tell you?

Mark my words, fans will turn on Richardson and the players by the end of October. I won't, because Jurgen Klopp would struggle with this squad of players at this level, a number of whom have previously been relegated from it. Unfortunately the club's hands are tied because everyone is under contract. Our survival will depend as it did in each of our last two Championship seasons on who we sign in the loan market. Simple as that.

As for permanent signings. I find it hard to blame the ownership for not being able to/willing to make significantly financial offers to sign players when only 6k supporters have committed to a season ticket. If I was Mr Al-Jasmi, I'd wonder why I bother at all.
 
Last edited:
Robinson certainly struggled at the start of that season. His game at Preston away was a stinker. Also ripped by U.S supporters for his play for the USA National team.
A player who grew stronger as the season progressed and really impressed towards the end.
Nathan Byrne and Gavin Massey could run just as fast with the ball at their feet (under control) ... Robinson struggled at times but his speed sometimes covered up his defensive mistakes.
How many times did he pull his jersey up over his head that season ?
Luton away was a head in hands "we are going down at this rate" match.
Dunkley and Cedric were iffy at the back together.
The mistakes were (and probably still are) punished much more frequently in the Championship than in League 1.
The best young Premiership, potential Loan players are still with their clubs and teams (including Wigan) are waiting ...methinks.
Older Players, potentially not in their manager's plans will be away during pre season.
 
Last edited:
C_Latic said:
We didn't underachieve at all, staying up with players like Dunkley, Jacobs, Massey, Grigg/Vaughan/Clarke as regular starters was a fantastic achievement. You thought Reece James struggled defensively? Clearly the people who know what they are talking about disagree as he was named in the team of the season. As for Robinson, his raw pace provided a vital outlet both at the back and going forward, again something we don't have. He was a ten million pound player by January 2020. We were spoilt having those two as our full backs and the fact that Nathan Byrne couldn't get off the bench until James was moved into midfield says it all.

Luton have something we don't and never will have, a small compact ground which suits their style of play (high press, high voltage) down to a tee. Huddersfield play excellent football and are brilliantly coached regarding set pieces. We play shite football and effectively bullied teams in L1 which you can't do in the division above. Us and Rotherham were virtually identical in terms of style of play and Rotherham have been relegated from this division more times than I've had hot dinners. What does that tell you?

Mark my words, fans will turn on Richardson and the players by the end of October. I won't, because Jurgen Klopp would struggle with this squad of players at this level, a number of whom have previously been relegated from it. Unfortunately the club's hands are tied because everyone is under contract. Our survival will depend as it did in each of our last two Championship seasons on who we sign in the loan market. Simple as that.

As for permanent signings. I find it hard to blame the ownership for not being able to/willing to make significantly financial offers to sign players when only 6k supporters have committed to a season ticket. If I was Mr Al-Jasmi, I'd wonder why I bother at all.
Click to expand...
Ever the optimist.
 
I find it enlightening that even though the club haven't announced how many season tickets have been purchased the usual suspects now quote 6k as fact! One poster says he's heard a rumour it's that number and suddenly it's fact,! Incredible
 
exiled tic said:
I find it enlightening that even though the club haven't announced how many season tickets have been purchased the usual suspects now quote 6k as fact! One poster says he's heard a rumour it's that number and suddenly it's fact,! Incredible
Click to expand...
If you go on the web site and look at tickets sold you can get a rough idea how many I know 3 that’s not renewed and they say will just pick games
 
FrancosLoveChild said:
true, or maybe that is all what is happening atm, but I’m thinking there will be more pre season fixtures too as 4 is not much at all, maybe there are some in Spain we are not aware of yet, but Spain would have been a good time to have a player in to get to know the squad
Click to expand...
Kendrick said there were "lots of rumours" in his back to training piece

I took this comment to refer to rumours about signings from the WAFC, client journalist.
I am happy with his discretion, by the way he is in a difficult position.
 
Last edited:
ManchesterLatic89 said:
Exactly way im feeling at the moment HudWiganFan. As has been mentioned before, June is a notoriously hard month as players only back in pre season training next week and contracts only just expiring now.

However we have had an idea about which Championship players have been on clubs' released lists for a long time now and i think its disappointing not to have gotten at least one new signing through the door for the senior squad. Some players released by even clubs ranked 7th to 12th in the Championship last season would have been good pick ups for us. I accept focusing on youth should be our target going forward but we need to stabilise in the Championship first and foremost and we will need experienced additions alongside youth to do that.

Like you im concerned at this 'these players got us up last season so we will keep the faith' line. We arguably got promoted a season ahead of schedule as im sure when we were bought that the target was two seasons to get to the Championship. So the plan in a way has changed. Plus at latter end of last season we saw some issues manifest themselves with certain parts of the squad. These issues i fear will be exposed more against an overall much higher calibre of opposition each week next season.

I just hope we get some signings done soon (we dont need loads as alluded to), but we do need some new additions in certain areas (right back, striker, centre back, winger) otherwise im a little fearful going into the new season. Plus im never a fan of deadline day or January window signings. I know we are trying to avoid panic buying now but you panic buy on deadline day or in January.
Click to expand...
We cannot sign them till their contract expires.
We should not announce any potential signings, cause it alerts other clubs
 
Yon Mon said:
To be honest I would hope Leam and his staff would know by now were we need strengthening.
Click to expand...

I have no doubt that you are right, but players develop and during this training camp he may see something different in a player than he did before.

For instance he will have had little time to assess the likes of Shinnie and McGrath as the focus of training after they signed would have been on preparing players for the games whereas in this camp the focus will be on fitness levels and instilling his beliefs into players.

Shinnie has shown he is a very capable player at Championship level before but has had little opportunity to shine, if over the duration of the camp he shows he is still capable then that is one more position less to fill. The same would apply to McGrath and others within the squad such as Aasgard.

I think the club will have targets in their sights but will be holding off on the approach until Leam has made his mind up on the players he has within the squad.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.