Sounds like a top signing | Page 2 | Vital Football

Sounds like a top signing

RaggedTrouseredPhil said:
Well said. Most people don't know that. They just want their bwexit and their extra £350m for the NHS.
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No Trouser Mon all I want is one expensive tier of government less leaching money from me plus a government that operates and sets laws from this country and not overseas. Not to mention the ridiculous amounts of cash that it costs us to be in this little club.
I gladly accept the free movement of people from EU and other countries who contribute so much to our country and I am pretty sure most countries in Europe would still like to trade with us. Surely they still want to sell their cars and other products
 
jeffs right said:
I am pretty sure most countries in Europe would still like to trade with us. Surely they still want to sell their cars and other products
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And we will want to trade with them, in order to do so we will need to meet all the EU regulations without having the ability to affect them. As a country I'm fairly sure we'll do OK post Brexit, but we'd do much better without it.
 
jeffs right said:
No Trouser Mon all I want is one expensive tier of government less leaching money from me plus a government that operates and sets laws from this country and not overseas. Not to mention the ridiculous amounts of cash that it costs us to be in this little club.
I gladly accept the free movement of people from EU and other countries who contribute so much to our country and I am pretty sure most countries in Europe would still like to trade with us. Surely they still want to sell their cars and other products
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You think that by leaving the EU that will make European’s more amenable to trading with us?
You’ve been sold a pup!
 
richymac said:
You think that by leaving the EU that will make European’s more amenable to trading with us?
You’ve been sold a pup!
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It's not about the EU comission being amenable it's about individual businesses, money and markets - they will want to sell goods to whoever has money, they will want to buy from whoever is offering the best products at the best price. Thats why the UK sells and buys more from the USA than any other country on WTO terms.

Our massive trade surplus on goods means the EU countries will absolutely want to / need to continue selling to us. Every country in the world outside of the single market trades with the single market, many of them largely tariff free on goods (Canada and Japan and the FTA Tusk already offered) as it's mutually beneficial.

gazlatic said:
And we will want to trade with them, in order to do so we will need to meet all the EU regulations without having the ability to affect them. As a country I'm fairly sure we'll do OK post Brexit, but we'd do much better without it.
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The businesses looking to sell into the EU will of course need to meet EU regulations on such goods, just like as it stands if you want to trade with Japan, India, or America your exports have to conform to their standards even if they are different from domestic standards - the difference is that currently any business not exporting to say India do not have to be concerned about abiding by their regulations. While about 90% of UK businesses don't trade with the EU currently they have to abide by EU regulations even if those regulations are not suitable for them. Giving us the ability to divert from the EU regulations on goods not being sold to the EU means we wouldn't need to worry about having any control over them. As while the EU exporters followed those rules, we'd also be able to more easily negotiate FTAs with the worlds 2 biggest ecnomies in US, China and also free us from EU regulations that dictate other areas of our law - eg there is a concerted effort to get the live export of farm animals banned - this is no possible under EU regulations.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
It's not about the EU comission being amenable it's about individual businesses, money and markets - they will want to sell goods to whoever has money, they will want to buy from whoever is offering the best products at the best price. Thats why the UK sells and buys more from the USA than any other country on WTO terms.

Our massive trade surplus on goods means the EU countries will absolutely want to / need to continue selling to us. Every country in the world outside of the single market trades with the single market, many of them largely tariff free on goods (Canada and Japan and the FTA Tusk already offered) as it's mutually beneficial.”

Why would they want to sell to us? We will have tariffs on trade until we have arranged deals with each country we trade with.
IN 2017
44% of all UK exports went to the EU
53% of all UK imports from the EU
If we leave and just go for WTO terms a large amount of this will simply leave our economy.
So then what we go to some other country to import goods? We would have to pay tariffs set by the other country and we would also have to impose tariffs.
Thanks for destroying my future!
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Apologies this is my reply to KDZ;
Why would they want to sell to us? We will have tariffs on trade until we have arranged deals with each country we trade with.
IN 2017
44% of all UK exports went to the EU
53% of all UK imports from the EU
If we leave and just go for WTO terms a large amount of this will simply leave our economy.
So then what we go to some other country to import goods? We would have to pay tariffs set by the other country and we would also have to impose tariffs.
Thanks for destroying my future!
 
richymac said:
Apologies this is my reply to KDZ;
Why would they want to sell to us? We will have tariffs on trade until we have arranged deals with each country we trade with.
IN 2017
44% of all UK exports went to the EU
53% of all UK imports from the EU
If we leave and just go for WTO terms a large amount of this will simply leave our economy.
So then what we go to some other country to import goods? We would have to pay tariffs set by the other country and we would also have to impose tariffs.
Thanks for destroying my future!
Click to expand...

Only about 10% of the UK economy is exporting to the EU, a larger poriton is exporting to non EU countries with the bulk of our economy being being intenral.

We also very importantly are a services based export economy - the only one in the EU like this and there is no proper free market in services as it is and that is where our massive position of strength is and why we are uniquely placed to make Brexit succesful if we had anyone who actually wanted to leave in charge. We run a trade surplus in services with the USA that we in turn spend that surplus on goods from Europe. London is the financial capital of Europe and no other EU country could even take that from us if they wanted to due to the fact that they completely lack even a fraction of the infrastrucutre to do so and it will take years to build up and a massive concrted effort of so many different organisations - it's not realistically going to happen as there are ways around it as it is with 'brass plating'. And that is not to mention that the regulations, 19% corporation tax rate, personal tax rates and potential financial transaction taxes being suggested by Junker that make the cost of doing business in the UK much cheaper than the vast majority of EU countries. Even Ireland who offer a lower corp tax rate of 13% are already pressured by the EU to bring it in line with the 25-30% tax which would be about a doubling of what it currently is. It would be cheaper for most firms to stay in the UK than moving and then paying the much higher EU tax rates even if there were tariffs.

But there is no way on Gods green earth the EU states wont do a FTA with us as their economies relies on us buying their goods - it would be utterly counter productive for their intersts. We are generally the second biggest customer after the US who are threatening a trade war as it is, are the EU nations really going to want to put additional and needless tariffs on their 2 biggest customers? We buy about 70 billion more than we sell to them. They know that no FTA means the near 100b we pump into the EU economy every year in purchasing power will see all of their good become more expensive and less competative than the rest of the worlds good. If we can buy the same goods cheaper elsehwere then we will and they will be having a massive drop in trade. When you buy so much more than you sell like we do that gives us huge leverage. They've already offered us a FTA that included tariff free access to all sectors about 2 and a half years ago - Baker and Davies were writing the speach to confirm that the destimation of Brexit had been agreed - Theresa May blocked it as her only goal is to Remain by the back door. If we ever managed to get shut of May and her cancerous Withdrawl agreement and left the EU under WTO we would immedietely trigger article 24 of the WTO which locks existing trade conditions for up to 10 years and the previously offered FTA would almost certainly be negotiated. The alternative is that we could remove tariffs on all imports we don't produce in this country or even remove tariffs on all imports and go full Singapore - it's up to us as we'd have control over our tariff scheules. Or Even if we do go along with the EU tariffs the money we would collect in import duties on goods coming in from EU companys the government could subsidise our UK exporters to the EU - not to mention we'd avoid sending 16b to the EU in tariffs we collect on non EU imports on top of the approx 10-12b NET we send in membership fees and another couple of bill in defence and foreign aid spending. So there are plenty of options to avoid hurting our 10% of exporters and massive opportunities to boost everyone else.

Our EU trade balance has shrunk by about 10% over the last 20 years despite it being tariff free while the none EU trade has risen by 10% over the same period despite having tariffs on it. The EU comission itself has admitted that 90% of all future economic growth will come from outside of the EU. If we only care about economics then leaving the EU has the most long term economic prospects.

Don't be so dramatic about 'destorying futures' - it's project fear nonsense - you live in the 5th biggest economy in the world you're future will be fine - we aren't going to leave the EU and turn into Venezuela. The top 3 economies in the world are not in the EU, 6 of the top 10 economies in the world are outside of the EU, 14 of the top 20 ecoomies in the world are outside of the EU. Most of those economies trade succesfully with the EU on WTO terms or have signed FTAs that eliminate most tariffs on goods - like the EU have already offered us. What makes the UK so unique that we can't possibly trade without being part of a political union when the majority of our history we did that and the majority of the world does now?

Our only issue with Brexit is our politicians trying to sabotage it - we have so many levers we can pull economically and so much leverage to make it work for us.
 
That's a lot to take in there KDZ............ it makes one wonder why the Leave campaign chose to focus on "blue passports" and "no forrins" as their key messages.

As for Project Fear, you're probably right..... truths were stretched to the extent that lies were told......... but Leave have absolutely no moral high ground on that point.

One of the biggest shames about this shambles is the resurrection of bloody Farage.
Chancer. Unscrupulous Nonce. Tosser.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Only about 10% of the UK economy is exporting to the EU, a larger poriton is exporting to non EU countries with the bulk of our economy being being intenral.

We also very importantly are a services based export economy - the only one in the EU like this and there is no proper free market in services as it is and that is where our massive position of strength is and why we are uniquely placed to make Brexit succesful if we had anyone who actually wanted to leave in charge. We run a trade surplus in services with the USA that we in turn spend that surplus on goods from Europe. London is the financial capital of Europe and no other EU country could even take that from us if they wanted to due to the fact that they completely lack even a fraction of the infrastrucutre to do so and it will take years to build up and a massive concrted effort of so many different organisations - it's not realistically going to happen as there are ways around it as it is with 'brass plating'. And that is not to mention that the regulations, 19% corporation tax rate, personal tax rates and potential financial transaction taxes being suggested by Junker that make the cost of doing business in the UK much cheaper than the vast majority of EU countries. Even Ireland who offer a lower corp tax rate of 13% are already pressured by the EU to bring it in line with the 25-30% tax which would be about a doubling of what it currently is. It would be cheaper for most firms to stay in the UK than moving and then paying the much higher EU tax rates even if there were tariffs.

But there is no way on Gods green earth the EU states wont do a FTA with us as their economies relies on us buying their goods - it would be utterly counter productive for their intersts. We are generally the second biggest customer after the US who are threatening a trade war as it is, are the EU nations really going to want to put additional and needless tariffs on their 2 biggest customers? We buy about 70 billion more than we sell to them. They know that no FTA means the near 100b we pump into the EU economy every year in purchasing power will see all of their good become more expensive and less competative than the rest of the worlds good. If we can buy the same goods cheaper elsehwere then we will and they will be having a massive drop in trade. When you buy so much more than you sell like we do that gives us huge leverage. They've already offered us a FTA that included tariff free access to all sectors about 2 and a half years ago - Baker and Davies were writing the speach to confirm that the destimation of Brexit had been agreed - Theresa May blocked it as her only goal is to Remain by the back door. If we ever managed to get shut of May and her cancerous Withdrawl agreement and left the EU under WTO we would immedietely trigger article 24 of the WTO which locks existing trade conditions for up to 10 years and the previously offered FTA would almost certainly be negotiated. The alternative is that we could remove tariffs on all imports we don't produce in this country or even remove tariffs on all imports and go full Singapore - it's up to us as we'd have control over our tariff scheules. Or Even if we do go along with the EU tariffs the money we would collect in import duties on goods coming in from EU companys the government could subsidise our UK exporters to the EU - not to mention we'd avoid sending 16b to the EU in tariffs we collect on non EU imports on top of the approx 10-12b NET we send in membership fees and another couple of bill in defence and foreign aid spending. So there are plenty of options to avoid hurting our 10% of exporters and massive opportunities to boost everyone else.

Our EU trade balance has shrunk by about 10% over the last 20 years despite it being tariff free while the none EU trade has risen by 10% over the same period despite having tariffs on it. The EU comission itself has admitted that 90% of all future economic growth will come from outside of the EU. If we only care about economics then leaving the EU has the most long term economic prospects.

Don't be so dramatic about 'destorying futures' - it's project fear nonsense - you live in the 5th biggest economy in the world you're future will be fine - we aren't going to leave the EU and turn into Venezuela. The top 3 economies in the world are not in the EU, 6 of the top 10 economies in the world are outside of the EU, 14 of the top 20 ecoomies in the world are outside of the EU. Most of those economies trade succesfully with the EU on WTO terms or have signed FTAs that eliminate most tariffs on goods - like the EU have already offered us. What makes the UK so unique that we can't possibly trade without being part of a political union when the majority of our history we did that and the majority of the world does now?

Our only issue with Brexit is our politicians trying to sabotage it - we have so many levers we can pull economically and so much leverage to make it work for us.
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Where do you get this information?
You’ve been sold down the river.
Calling for less regulation in the service sector so the rich get richer and the poor get poorer?
EU countries trading with us will stop trading with us. Why would they want to pay import tariffs and slow their production with border checks? That’s why many businesses are going to places like The Netherlands to set up their companies HQ’s there.
You haven’t answered anything despite writing a lot.
Again thanks for destroying my future???
 
richymac said:
Where do you get this information?
You’ve been sold down the river.
Calling for less regulation in the service sector so the rich get richer and the poor get poorer?
EU countries trading with us will stop trading with us. Why would they want to pay import tariffs and slow their production with border checks? That’s why many businesses are going to places like The Netherlands to set up their companies HQ’s there.
You haven’t answered anything despite writing a lot.
Again thanks for destroying my future???
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KDZ wrote alot and as it's factually and legally correct - thats where he got the detail from - all available online on govuk, wto and eu websites if you can be bothered to check.
Pity you clearly didn't read the content or if you did, choose to ignore it as it doesn't suit your viewpoint.
People whinging about "their future" need to get a grip (sic) fact is it will be what you make it.
You can travel, work abroad or stay here, your choice.
Truth is it's a convenient peg to hang "poor me" millenial life hard luck stories on right now.
 
richymac said:
Where do you get this information?
You’ve been sold down the river.
Calling for less regulation in the service sector so the rich get richer and the poor get poorer?
EU countries trading with us will stop trading with us. Why would they want to pay import tariffs and slow their production with border checks? That’s why many businesses are going to places like The Netherlands to set up their companies HQ’s there.
You haven’t answered anything despite writing a lot.
Again thanks for destroying my future???
Click to expand...
Office of national statistics for most data, the 90% of all future trade from EU website and these have arguments regulary been made in articles and in debates and on interviews on things like Andrew Neil - people who are good on the nuts and bolts of this are the likes of the former bank of England Governor Mervyn King, David Bannerman who is a sitting MEP who worked on trade deal for the EU for years and Gerard Lyons who was a former advisor to London Mayorship.

The whole problem there are lots of people making arguments based on feelings and assumptions rather than knowledge of the full picture and as the previous post showed any info that challenges the held narrative can be dismissed as fake rather than argued with valid counter points.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the economic landscape of EU states as explained in the previous post. You are talking as if we are a goods exporting economy with a massive trade deficit with the EU and our share of EU trade is growing - if any of we were true it completely changes the arguement but it's the exact opposite and it's all in our favour. The EU needs our buying power and we want their goods trade will continue after Brexit mutual benefit will see to thank. You're future along with my kids future will not be negatively impacted by Brexit unlike the kids in Greece who's future has been hit by forced EU austerity that they voted against and were forced to endure anyway.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
Office of national statistics for most data, the 90% of all future trade from EU website and these have arguments regulary been made in articles and in debates and on interviews on things like Andrew Neil - people who are good on the nuts and bolts of this are the likes of the former bank of England Governor Mervyn King, David Bannerman who is a sitting MEP who worked on trade deal for the EU for years and Gerard Lyons who was a former advisor to London Mayorship.

The whole problem there are lots of people making arguments based on feelings and assumptions rather than knowledge of the full picture and as the previous post showed any info that challenges the held narrative can be dismissed as fake rather than argued with valid counter points.

You have a fundamental misunderstanding of the economic landscape of EU states as explained in the previous post. You are talking as if we are a goods exporting economy with a massive trade deficit with the EU and our share of EU trade is growing - if any of we were true it completely changes the arguement but it's the exact opposite and it's all in our favour. The EU needs our buying power and we want their goods trade will continue after Brexit mutual benefit will see to thank. You're future along with my kids future will not be negatively impacted by Brexit unlike the kids in Greece who's future has been hit by forced EU austerity that they voted against and were forced to endure anyway.
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https://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/CBP-7851/CBP-7851.pdf
Didn’t take long for me to find it, maybe you should read it before espousing untruths. X
 
moonay said:
That's a lot to take in there KDZ............ it makes one wonder why the Leave campaign chose to focus on "blue passports" and "no forrins" as their key messages.

As for Project Fear, you're probably right..... truths were stretched to the extent that lies were told......... but Leave have absolutely no moral high ground on that point.

One of the biggest shames about this shambles is the resurrection of bloody Farage.
Chancer. Unscrupulous Nonce. Tosser.
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The truth wasn't just stretched by Remain there was manufactured evidence by manipulating economic modelling with blatantly inaccurate metrics to generate utterly unrealistic outcomes about job loses and recessions etc. Some of the supposedly neutral political institutions have behaved shamefully in their deliberate duplicity.

I have been staggered by the amount of ammo the Brexit side of the arguement haven't used - it's like they said 'we'll let remain argue on economics and we'll argue on x and y' and it's crazy as the leave side have a economic arguments the more high profile campaigners just haven't used. The Remain side are just as bad the whole debate has been argued on a tiny portion of the data available. I think both sides are trying to simplify their arguments as they think keeping it very shallow and basic is the way they'll get the most votes.

I think the majority of time politicians end up the front men for campaigns despite rather than because of their expertise. As most politicians genuinely don't know very much about anything to be honest when you see them questioned thoroughly. They probably just skim read the notes provided by their advisors, get their party lines and go with that most of the time rather than know the subject in question properly. Which is why Andrew Neil can so easily drag then over the coals every week.

Brexit has exposed the utter shambles of political system is on every level including how it doesnt actually represent anyone but its own interests and i think a change is coming that is long overdue. Farage isnt the end solution but if he gets the ball rolling I'm happy with that. It will be a long process to satisfactory political reform.
 
king_dezeeuw06 said:
You post an article please be specific what you are pointing out from within the article.
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ALL OF IT! Especially the bit where it says it’s about 50/50 imports/exports with the EU.
Oh, but you said it was 10%?!? Are you saying our government is wrong?
 
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