Safe standing to be debated...

A

alphabet_king

Vital 1st Team Regular
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44362522

Good news for those supporting safe standing.

I do look back fondly on the days of the terraces. Some of my best match experiences have been on a terrace. The surge when you score. The ability to move if someone's annoying you. I do wonder though, is the push for safe standing a little misguided?

I just cant see that this rail seating/standing will be anything like what we had 20 years ago That we all remember so fondly.

I also don't see how it would be much different to the back of the rainham end these days. We all stand up if we want to in rows, and store our seats in an upright position etc. To me this seems exactly the same as the safe standing proposals.

I think lots of football fans are hoping it will bring back the times of old but in reality i think it is unlikely to make much of a difference to how we currently operate.
 
alphabet_king said:
I also don't see how it would be much different to the back of the rainham end these days. We all stand up if we want to in rows, and store our seats in an upright position etc. To me this seems exactly the same as the safe standing proposals.
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Honestly, that's kind of the point. As it stands (pun not intended), we have areas of all seated stands, where fans will stand up to watch the game, it's prevalent across the country, and is technically illegal.

All that safe standing is trying to achieve is the ability for these people to stand at the same match, but without the risk of falling over the seat in front. There's literally no other difference, same stand, same exits, same capacity, same everything. Instead there's now a bar to lean against.

It's a first step, to correct the prejudice against football fans that has persisted through the past 30 years when it comes to terracing. The crumbling terraces of yore, surrounded by metal fences are a thing of the past, safe standing areas are just areas to stand, safely, and that can't be a bad thing.
 
It's a bit ironic that seating has effectively removed the prejudice against football fans but, for me, you can stick standing safe or otherwise; it's the knees, I'm afraid. A trip to King's Meadow reinforces my view that standing really is a thing of the past. As for those that stand at PL grounds, there always seems to be an air of smugness about them - sheep.
 
Wayne.Kerr said:
It's a bit ironic that seating has effectively removed the prejudice against football fans but, for me, you can stick standing safe or otherwise; it's the knees, I'm afraid. A trip to King's Meadow reinforces my view that standing really is a thing of the past. As for those that stand at PL grounds, there always seems to be an air of smugness about them - sheep.
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Lucky for you Wayne, you won't be forced to stand. That's the whole point of a safe standing section, it's just a section for people who tend to stand anyway.
 
The Rainham End should be standing, there's already a place for people like Wayne. It's the Gordon road!
 
LSB2 said:
The Rainham End should be standing, there's already a place for people like Wayne. It's the Gordon road!
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Ah yes I agree, no one is making people stand up. There will be plenty of seating spaces left Wayne. But there’s plenty of people who do like to stand up so it’s fair they are able to as well.

But I still just don’t get it. We all stand up at the back of the RE already. As we do in pretty much all away games these days. We are very very rarely told to sit down these days.

So why clamour to get us to be allowed to do something we do anyway? The standing areas are not going to be anything like the old terraces that people (including myself) remember so fondly.
 
alphabet_king said:
Ah yes I agree, no one is making people stand up. There will be plenty of seating spaces left Wayne. But there’s plenty of people who do like to stand up so it’s fair they are able to as well.

But I still just don’t get it. We all stand up at the back of the RE already. As we do in pretty much all away games these days. We are very very rarely told to sit down these days.

So why clamour to get us to be allowed to do something we do anyway? The standing areas are not going to be anything like the old terraces that people (including myself) remember so fondly.
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For me, going to football was always about standing, except Wembley even from very early on with schoolboy internationals. First half up the top corner of the Town End and then a half time walk pitch side to the Rainham End. Standing is permitted and that's fine and Gills fans are considerate but one significant accident will put an end to it.
 
Surely these new "safe-standing" sections would be unreserved thereby allowing the people that wish to make a din to congregate, more so than the current arrangement of illegal standing in all-seated areas allows.
 
alphabet_king said:
But I still just don’t get it. We all stand up at the back of the RE already. As we do in pretty much all away games these days. We are very very rarely told to sit down these days.

So why clamour to get us to be allowed to do something we do anyway?
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It isn't the lower league clubs who are pushing for the move or at least is not the driving force. I'd hope if Safe Standing is made legal that we don't waste money in converting a part of a stand into it.

Priestfield is rarely a sellout so if a few hundred fans stand then it probably doesn't going to cause a serious health and safety issue. Plus most of the people who stand are season ticket holders who have built up a lot of trust not to misbehave. It wasn't always like that. Was it Wolfie who used to be kicked out for standing during the 2000s? I seem to recall when the stewards gathered he would start a round of "Stand up for the Gillingham" as a protest?

It is being driven more by the larger clubs who have permanent sell outs who want the atmosphere of the old standing up stands and maybe a way of squeezing in a few extra places. I think Man United have been threatened to have their H&S certificate invoked a few occasions for supporters standing up.

Safe Standing is more of a benefit to large crowds where mismanagement could lead to crushes and problems and not to small clubs where crushes are unlikely.
 
HerrLjunga said:
Surely these new "safe-standing" sections would be unreserved thereby allowing the people that wish to make a din to congregate, more so than the current arrangement of illegal standing in all-seated areas allows.
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I doubt it. With safe standing you get a rail seat. That's where you will stand in that little square by your allocated rail seat.

Who will pay for their introduction ? A consideration for the new ground maybe but not sure we should spend what little budget we have on this.
 
alphabet_king said:
Why clamour to get us to be allowed to do something we do anyway?
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It's so that people who aren't quite so steady as yourself, don't trip and fall a couple of rows in front them when they're celebrating a last minute winner.

Standing behind a shin high plastic seat isn't as safe as standing behind a solid metal railing.
 
As Mark says, safe standing is rail seats. You get an allocated seat and depending on the event it’ll be locked via a key into the ‘closed and upright’ position, allowing you to safely stand without the seat opening up. You still get a ticket at your seat. At Shrewsbury they’ve replaced the top few rows of their home End with this, at Celtic they’ve replaced an entire corner block. See below for Shrewsbury’s section.

I think Shrewsbury funded this through crowdfunding? Surely the Football League/FA grant will make up a decent portion of it too. Hopefully with this you’re just replacing the seats rather than having to pay for the design and building of an entire stand with piling, concrete, roof and facilities.

View attachment 27296
 
HerrLjunga said:
Surely these new "safe-standing" sections would be unreserved thereby allowing the people that wish to make a din to congregate, more so than the current arrangement of illegal standing in all-seated areas allows.
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Policy might differ slightly from club to club, but from what I've read then home supporters would get a dedicated seat. There might be a relaxation of the reserved nature for away fans depending on the club and the size of the away section.
 
Baghdad_Rob said:
Was it Wolfie who used to be kicked out for standing during the 2000s? I seem to recall when the stewards gathered he would start a round of "Stand up for the Gillingham" as a protest?
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HA, great shout regarding wolfie. Does anybody still see him? I remember 2005 ish I was amazed to be walking about on the shop floor at work and saw him being shown around by HR. He was there to do some temping.

Anyone else remember Rambo?
 
I welcome the introduction of safe standing but only if compliance is enforced in the seating areas. I get the attraction of standing, I enjoyed (pre-seat era) standing in the Rainham End as well as the old North Bank at Highbury. Times have changed though and I accept that seating generally enables a safer environment. What really irks me is the inconsideration and arrogance of people standing in seated areas to the detriment of children or those less able, who consequently get to see very little of the game. Especially if the "standing" starts at the front, which leads to a concertina effect behind them. I`m not finger-pointing at anyone from Gillingham. "Selfish standing" seems to be mostly a Premiership and Championship thing. Occasionally it happens at the Gills and I will always challenge people near me who stand and block the views of others.

So yes, let`s get some official safe standing in place at GFC, or let`s make the whole Rainham End standing only - at least then everyone buying a RE ticket would be aware they will have to stand up.
 
Lancs - that’s amongst the best excuses for having a freely available option for terracing/safe standing. From then on there’s no excuse for persistent standing as long as you had the opportunity at the time of purchase to also get a standing ticket.

I’m honestly not a fan of rail seats but I’ll have them in an otherwise all-seater stadium, definitely. Ultimately I’d like terracing to return but with the modern regulations found elsewhere:
- well-treated surfaces
- equivalent of 5 rows of capacity to be kept back from sale to avoid crowding
- adequate CCTV
- adequate entrances & exits
- adequate volume of crush barriers
- adequate control of sections to avoid crowding

Make the home end standing and also ONE of the following including provision for away fans:
- the opposite end
- an opposite corner or both
- a side stand
 
I do hope we don't officially adopt safe standing because:

a) The cost to replace existing seating with the new seating set up is probably going to cost some money. And there will be those on here who will moan that the money should be spent on the team instead as a good team will bring in more fans than seating would.

b) Lots of moaning from people who want to stand but the zone doesn't extend to their seat so they might have to move from their long purchased seat. And then there will be those who want to sit that find themselves in the zone and will be surrounded by what LancsGordoRoad refers to as "Selfish Standers", although I think in the case of Safe Standing it will be generally accepted as reasonable that anyone buying a ticket in the zone is intending to stand.

In general, moaners will agree that the zone is in the wrong place, is too big and too small, spread too wide at the back of the stand or not deep enough from the back.

edit: And of course for those who find themselves in the zone and want to sit, the seating will naturally be less comfortable than the current plastic seating /unedit

The only thing that will be agreed is that Scally is a fool who doesn't understand fans and as a result of doing it to deliberately piss off those individuals, and as a result half the current season ticket holders don't intend to renew next season.

c) Knowing Scally, he'll probably charge an extra quid on the matchday ticket for the privilege of standing despite the fact historically standing was cheaper than sitting.

Although it would make sense to have some safe standing at the back of the Rainham End, I do wonder if it would be more logically to replace the away end.
 
Baghdad_Rob said:
I do hope we don't officially adopt safe standing because:

a) The cost to replace existing seating with the new seating set up is probably going to cost some money. And there will be those on here who will moan that the money should be spent on the team instead as a good team will bring in more fans than seating would.

b) Lots of moaning from people who want to stand but the zone doesn't extend to their seat so they might have to move from their long purchased seat. And then there will be those who want to sit that find themselves in the zone and will be surrounded by what LancsGordoRoad refers to as "Selfish Standers", although I think in the case of Safe Standing it will be generally accepted as reasonable that anyone buying a ticket in the zone is intending to stand.

In general, moaners will agree that the zone is in the wrong place, is too big and too small, spread too wide at the back of the stand or not deep enough from the back.

edit: And of course for those who find themselves in the zone and want to sit, the seating will naturally be less comfortable than the current plastic seating /unedit

The only thing that will be agreed is that Scally is a fool who doesn't understand fans and as a result of doing it to deliberately piss off those individuals, and as a result half the current season ticket holders don't intend to renew next season.

c) Knowing Scally, he'll probably charge an extra quid on the matchday ticket for the privilege of standing despite the fact historically standing was cheaper than sitting.

Although it would make sense to have some safe standing at the back of the Rainham End, I do wonder if it would be more logically to replace the away end.
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Don't worry, it'll be a feature of the new stadium
 
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