Rotherham United (h): Interviews, Score Predictions, Starting XI & Match Thread

[Sincilbanks]

For League 1 and league 2 clubs like us john the money is in the sell on fees.

We're never going to be selling players for 3,4,5 million pounds to Championship or Premier League teams.

Take Erhahon as the example. If we sold him for a million quid we would probably have a couple of hundred grand profit in that after you had taken out what he had cost us and the wages we've paid him.

If we had a 30% sell on clause on him and he moved again for say 3 million quid then we get the best part of a million quid for doing nothing.

Bearing in mind that this process could take anything up to 6 seasons to be realised and players you get big money for come along once in a blue moon it's pretty obvious for clubs like us that we stay afloat because of the money put in by the by the board/investors.

The real trick is though to overperform with the resources you have with a good manager/coach with a well thought out and assembled squad of players.

When the Cowleys came in we were on our knees. We didn't have 2 pence to rub together and it wasn't that long ago. They knew what was required, knew the non league scene inside out, assembled a squad where we had proper defenders, proper midfielders and proper forwards and set out an identity and a way we would play and the rest is history.

We look an absolute million miles away from that at the minute. The recruitment doesn't match our needs because we don't know how we want to play therefore who do we bring in.

I'll give you an example. At the start of the season we all thought we would play with wingbacks so we sign a wing back on loan from Plymouth who has hardly kicked a ball in anger for us. Let's say though that he would of been great and he is in the team every week where would that of left the likes of Hackett, Duffy and Hamilton now, probably sitting in the stands twiddling their thumbs. Now, it's not the fact that they're not playing, it's the fact that they are still being paid for doing nothing apart from sit in the stands or on the bench. Yeah we might need one of them as cover or to be in the squad but would we need all of them which will probably add up to six figures disappearing out the club when you add up all their wages.

I mean how do the people who are recruiting think. We can't afford to be spending 60 grand on a centre forward on a four year contract with a quarter of a million worth of wages to be sat doing nothing...are they crackers, have they seen our forward line ,we needed someone who was first team ready now, not a 23 year old who can't get a game yet is sat on a contract until he's 27!!! What do you think is going to happen to him aged 27 if he hasn't made it here...he'll be released and we'll be 300 grand down the drain.

It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recritment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said.

Not sure where this ends at the moment.
It's clear we need some fresh blood in to liven the squad up but it has to be quality not quantity and upfront is the absolute priority.

Scubala as the coach needs some results to appease a lot of the fans who are not happy with the style of play at the moment when they have seen glimpses of how the team can play if the set up of it is right.

Definately needs to win on Saturday against a team who have only won once away all season. Then there is a break in the league for the Cup game at Birmingham and the Cup game against Bolton on the following Tuesday night.

Defeat on Saturday though against Stevenage and a poor performance will put hellish pressure on the board to sack him because he will have lost 99% of the fans but even if they don't their is a hell of a job on to steady the ship as we are at the moment.

We were a big fish in a small pond in the National League, we nicked Raggett from under Dovers nose if you remember and poached Habergham and Woodyard from part time Braintree, we simply cannot do that in League one and a big part of our game plan was the diagonal into Ready from Habergham, that and being a step ahead of everyone else at set pieces

 

[Rasenimp]

We were a big fish in a small pond in the National League, we nicked Raggett from under Dovers nose if you remember and poached Habergham and Woodyard from part time Braintree, we simply cannot do that in League one and a big part of our game plan was the diagonal into Ready from Habergham, that and being a step ahead of everyone else at set pieces

Yep. I think I remember hearing that opposition teams couldn't even get tape on set pieces at that time, so we had that, plus above average delivery and Raggett, Waterfall and Rhead in there.

Now there will be lots of analysts watching them etc - think scoring at a higher rate at that level, particularly back in 2016/17, is more sustainable than us being a long way above average this time.

I guess although we were a bigger fish in a smaller pond then, we've still seen us pinch players from lower L1 clubs or L2 clubs in a not entirely dissimilar way, albeit not of the same, ready-made standard. There was definitely also some former club connections/SE connections with the Cowleys and a lot of their signings, whereas I think we've seen that a bit less with MS (think we've given up on the Leeds player rumours now!)

 

[clanfordimp]

We were a big fish in a small pond in the National League, we nicked Raggett from under Dovers nose if you remember and poached Habergham and Woodyard from part time Braintree, we simply cannot do that in League one and a big part of our game plan was the diagonal into Ready from Habergham, that and being a step ahead of everyone else at set pieces

Yes I understand that and yes the NL is a lot different to League 1 but what I'm saying is whether your shopping at Harrods or shopping at Aldi you have to know what players you need to build a team. A lot of our signings seem random and don't fit what we are trying to do and that's because nobody knows what we're trying to do. We have just come off 3 defeats having learnt absolutely nothing from those defeats and coming out and playing in exactly the same way in all those games...that's not right.

What the hell are they doing on the training pitch between games? They are inacting the definition of insanity. Just doing exactly the same thing expecting a different result.

 

[mikeosullivan]

Don’t agree with the assertion that the cost negates a short term loan out. He was never going to be fit enough to contribute for us in a meaningful way immediately. So what options are there - hang around the Club for 6-12 months to recover, get up to speed (nothing in his history, or his displays, suggests he’s any better than what we have at the moment) and slowly start making up minutes, or loan him for 6-12 months as part of a rehab and development plan, to get his sharpness back. I’m not suggesting either option is better, or intended, but going out on loan would be an option.

There has been nothing from the club to say that Street is not fit enough to be considered for selection, but of course if Skoobs thinks the other strikers on our books are ahead of Street in being selected to start, then he may as well go out on loan.

The point many are making is that there seems to a divergence between the views of the recruitment team who thought Street was worthy of paying a decent fee for and giving a four year contract to, and the coaching team who clearly do not rate him good enough for a starting place and (sometimes) even a place on the bench.

A similar point could be made about McKiernan too.

 

[mikeosullivan]

For League 1 and league 2 clubs like us john the money is in the sell on fees.

We're never going to be selling players for 3,4,5 million pounds to Championship or Premier League teams.

Take Erhahon as the example. If we sold him for a million quid we would probably have a couple of hundred grand profit in that after you had taken out what he had cost us and the wages we've paid him.

If we had a 30% sell on clause on him and he moved again for say 3 million quid then we get the best part of a million quid for doing nothing.

Bearing in mind that this process could take anything up to 6 seasons to be realised and players you get big money for come along once in a blue moon it's pretty obvious for clubs like us that we stay afloat because of the money put in by the by the board/investors.

The real trick is though to overperform with the resources you have with a good manager/coach with a well thought out and assembled squad of players.

When the Cowleys came in we were on our knees. We didn't have 2 pence to rub together and it wasn't that long ago. They knew what was required, knew the non league scene inside out, assembled a squad where we had proper defenders, proper midfielders and proper forwards and set out an identity and a way we would play and the rest is history.

We look an absolute million miles away from that at the minute. The recruitment doesn't match our needs because we don't know how we want to play therefore who do we bring in.

I'll give you an example. At the start of the season we all thought we would play with wingbacks so we sign a wing back on loan from Plymouth who has hardly kicked a ball in anger for us. Let's say though that he would of been great and he is in the team every week where would that of left the likes of Hackett, Duffy and Hamilton now, probably sitting in the stands twiddling their thumbs. Now, it's not the fact that they're not playing, it's the fact that they are still being paid for doing nothing apart from sit in the stands or on the bench. Yeah we might need one of them as cover or to be in the squad but would we need all of them which will probably add up to six figures disappearing out the club when you add up all their wages.

I mean how do the people who are recruiting think. We can't afford to be spending 60 grand on a centre forward on a four year contract with a quarter of a million worth of wages to be sat doing nothing...are they crackers, have they seen our forward line ,we needed someone who was first team ready now, not a 23 year old who can't get a game yet is sat on a contract until he's 27!!! What do you think is going to happen to him aged 27 if he hasn't made it here...he'll be released and we'll be 300 grand down the drain.

It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recritment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said.

Not sure where this ends at the moment.
It's clear we need some fresh blood in to liven the squad up but it has to be quality not quantity and upfront is the absolute priority.

Scubala as the coach needs some results to appease a lot of the fans who are not happy with the style of play at the moment when they have seen glimpses of how the team can play if the set up of it is right.

Definately needs to win on Saturday against a team who have only won once away all season. Then there is a break in the league for the Cup game at Birmingham and the Cup game against Bolton on the following Tuesday night.

Defeat on Saturday though against Stevenage and a poor performance will put hellish pressure on the board to sack him because he will have lost 99% of the fans but even if they don't their is a hell of a job on to steady the ship as we are at the moment.

"It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recruitment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said."

I think you have hit the nail on the head there Clan.

I have a feeling that we are back in a MK situation. Manager blames the recruitment, recruitment blames the manager.

I'm sure the coaching team at the end of last season told recruitment what type of players they needed to be able to continue to play the attractive/winning football we played in the run-in last season, to replace our two best players (Jensen and Taylor), and also have the injury cover in the squad that we badly missed last season.

Recruitment team goes out and signs those players, some on long expensive contracts. Coaching team reviews the new signings in pre-season training and early games, and decide they are not good enough to be regular first team selections.

On another note, Skoobs does not look well in the interview today that mentioned Walker being out. I feel for the guy - he is looking more and more stressed as each week goes by.

 

[Rasenimp]

"It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recruitment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said."

I think you have hit the nail on the head there Clan.

I have a feeling that we are back in a MK situation. Manager blames the recruitment, recruitment blames the manager.

I'm sure the coaching team at the end of last season told recruitment what type of players they needed to be able to continue to play the attractive/winning football we played in the run-in last season, to replace our two best players (Jensen and Taylor), and also have the injury cover in the squad that we badly missed last season.

Recruitment team goes out and signs those players, some on long expensive contracts. Coaching team reviews the new signings in pre-season training and early games, and decide they are not good enough to be regular first team selections.

On another note, Skoobs does not look well in the interview today that mentioned Walker being out. I feel for the guy - he is looking more and more stressed as each week goes by.

Think there's a fair bit of supposition in that...

 

[johnolbe]

For League 1 and league 2 clubs like us john the money is in the sell on fees.

We're never going to be selling players for 3,4,5 million pounds to Championship or Premier League teams.

Take Erhahon as the example. If we sold him for a million quid we would probably have a couple of hundred grand profit in that after you had taken out what he had cost us and the wages we've paid him.

If we had a 30% sell on clause on him and he moved again for say 3 million quid then we get the best part of a million quid for doing nothing.

Bearing in mind that this process could take anything up to 6 seasons to be realised and players you get big money for come along once in a blue moon it's pretty obvious for clubs like us that we stay afloat because of the money put in by the by the board/investors.

The real trick is though to overperform with the resources you have with a good manager/coach with a well thought out and assembled squad of players.

When the Cowleys came in we were on our knees. We didn't have 2 pence to rub together and it wasn't that long ago. They knew what was required, knew the non league scene inside out, assembled a squad where we had proper defenders, proper midfielders and proper forwards and set out an identity and a way we would play and the rest is history.

We look an absolute million miles away from that at the minute. The recruitment doesn't match our needs because we don't know how we want to play therefore who do we bring in.

I'll give you an example. At the start of the season we all thought we would play with wingbacks so we sign a wing back on loan from Plymouth who has hardly kicked a ball in anger for us. Let's say though that he would of been great and he is in the team every week where would that of left the likes of Hackett, Duffy and Hamilton now, probably sitting in the stands twiddling their thumbs. Now, it's not the fact that they're not playing, it's the fact that they are still being paid for doing nothing apart from sit in the stands or on the bench. Yeah we might need one of them as cover or to be in the squad but would we need all of them which will probably add up to six figures disappearing out the club when you add up all their wages.

I mean how do the people who are recruiting think. We can't afford to be spending 60 grand on a centre forward on a four year contract with a quarter of a million worth of wages to be sat doing nothing...are they crackers, have they seen our forward line ,we needed someone who was first team ready now, not a 23 year old who can't get a game yet is sat on a contract until he's 27!!! What do you think is going to happen to him aged 27 if he hasn't made it here...he'll be released and we'll be 300 grand down the drain.

It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recritment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said.

Not sure where this ends at the moment.
It's clear we need some fresh blood in to liven the squad up but it has to be quality not quantity and upfront is the absolute priority.

Scubala as the coach needs some results to appease a lot of the fans who are not happy with the style of play at the moment when they have seen glimpses of how the team can play if the set up of it is right.

Definately needs to win on Saturday against a team who have only won once away all season. Then there is a break in the league for the Cup game at Birmingham and the Cup game against Bolton on the following Tuesday night.

Defeat on Saturday though against Stevenage and a poor performance will put hellish pressure on the board to sack him because he will have lost 99% of the fans but even if they don't their is a hell of a job on to steady the ship as we are at the moment.

Yes good points Clanford but what happens if we sell a player for 1m to a club and he signs a 3 year deal. He does very well and is worth 5m after the 3 years but runs his contract down and leaves on a free so we get 30% of nothing for a player worth 5m

 

[clanfordimp]

Yes good points Clanford but what happens if we sell a player for 1m to a club and he signs a 3 year deal. He does very well and is worth 5m after the 3 years but runs his contract down and leaves on a free so we get 30% of nothing for a player worth 5m

We lose out John. That's the game. Every single player and every single manager will look after number 1 first and foremost. We wouldn't be given a second thought in that scenario.

 

[mikeosullivan]

Think there's a fair bit of supposition in that...

Of course there is. I have no inside info.

But if its all supposition, why can't many of our summer signings get in our first choice eleven?

Most of the summer signings were established league players at the end of their contract and we we enticed them away by offering better and longer contracts. Its not as though we were signing from non-league and were not therefore sure if they could make the grade.

It has to be a disappointment amongst the coaching staff that, after half a season, only Darikwa and Wickens of those signings has nailed down a starting role.

 

[nlondonimp]

"It's barmy, clubs like us have to live in the moment. It's difficult when you have a Recruitment manager and a Coach, these people have to get on and there is more chance that they don't as we know with what Kennedy said."

I think you have hit the nail on the head there Clan.

I have a feeling that we are back in a MK situation. Manager blames the recruitment, recruitment blames the manager.

I'm sure the coaching team at the end of last season told recruitment what type of players they needed to be able to continue to play the attractive/winning football we played in the run-in last season, to replace our two best players (Jensen and Taylor), and also have the injury cover in the squad that we badly missed last season.

Recruitment team goes out and signs those players, some on long expensive contracts. Coaching team reviews the new signings in pre-season training and early games, and decide they are not good enough to be regular first team selections.

On another note, Skoobs does not look well in the interview today that mentioned Walker being out. I feel for the guy - he is looking more and more stressed as each week goes by.

Injury cover is exactly why some of these players (street, ring, mck, jeffries… as it turned out) are not regular first team selections. We could never afford 23 ‘first team’ players.

And it is possible that bringing in 22-23 year old projects as ‘injury cover’ was deemed a better way to spend money, than on 25-29 year old seasoned pros with much less potential. 22-23 year olds still have time to develop into regular first team selections in due course.

I think you also do hamer and bayliss a disservice as they were both around the first 11 before injury.