RIP Marvin Hagler | Vital Football

RIP Marvin Hagler

The Pyrry

Vital Reserves Team
#2
I agree Pie , he was my favourite boxer during the 80's .. never shirked a challenge. The night he destroyed the likeable Alan Minter will last in my memory for a long time.

Even after that night for him he loved coming to travel around the UK and give his after dinner talks etc ... top bloke
 

keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#3
Funnily enough I considered posting about the great man but decided not too as i don't think my boxing rants have always gone down too well .

He was an incredible fighter and in many ways underrated. When you look at his record his defeats or draws were all contentious decisions (Hagler often the victim of being the away fighter). He was never stopped and thanks to the politics of the day a man who only got a title shot in his 50th fight. When Joe Frazier was asked why Hagler couldn't get big fights he answered with "You have three strikes against you, "You're black, you're a southpaw, and you're good.". He ruined Minter who pissed off Marvin with a racist remark "I'll never lose to a black man" that Minter later said was a misunderstanding (only Minter ultimately would know the truth of that). Then you have landmarks in the sport like the eight minutes and one second against Tommy Hearns and the brutal 11th round victory against the Ugandan powerhouse John Mugabi.

There are two fights I'd point people towards that are lesser known. The second of the two fights against Mustafa Hamsho where you can see Hagler step on the gas and really go for him after being repeatedly fouled. It's a masterclass in suddenly going for the knockout, and a fight against the British Champion Tony Sibson. Sibson has a genuine go and it's a perfect demonstration of an elite level fighter in Hagler against a very good level fighter. Sibson himself would say as much post fight.


 
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PieMag

Vital Football Hero
#4
Funnily enough I considered posting about the great man but decided not too as i don't think my boxing rants have always gone down too well .

He was an incredible fighter and in many ways underrated. When you look at his record his defeats or draws were all contentious decisions (Hagler often the victim of being the away fighter). He was never stopped and thanks to the politics of the day a man who only got a title shot in his 50th fight. When Joe Frazier was asked why Hagler couldn't get big fights he answered with "You have three strikes against you, "You're black, you're a southpaw, and you're good.". He ruined Minter who pissed off Marvin with a racist remark "I'll never lose to a black man" that Minter later said was a misunderstanding (only Minter ultimately would know the truth of that). Then you have landmarks in the sport like the eight minutes and one second against Tommy Hearns and the brutal 11th round victory against the Ugandan powerhouse John Mugabi.

There are two fights I'd point people towards that are lesser known. The second of the two fights against Mustafa Hamsho where you can see Hagler step on the gas and really go for him after being repeatedly fouled. It's a masterclass in suddenly going for the knockout, and a fight against the British Champion Tony Sibson. Sibson has a genuine go and it's a perfect demonstration of an elite level fighter in Hagler against a very good level fighter. Sibson himself would say as much post fight.


Aye that's a new one, the overhead head jab.
 

Mcnamee67

Vital Football Hero
#5
A great boxer in an era when so many superb boxers were about. I remember the fight against Minter, racial comments from both camps. Minter had insisted that he 'did not intend to lose his title to a black man' while Hagler declared he would 'not shake hands with white flesh'. A pissed up crowd hurled bottles into the ring after the ref stopped the fight in the 3rd round. Harry Carpenter described the scenes as 'my low point of many years at British ringsides'.
 

PieMag

Vital Football Hero
#7
A great boxer in an era when so many superb boxers were about. I remember the fight against Minter, racial comments from both camps. Minter had insisted that he 'did not intend to lose his title to a black man' while Hagler declared he would 'not shake hands with white flesh'. A pissed up crowd hurled bottles into the ring after the ref stopped the fight in the 3rd round. Harry Carpenter described the scenes as 'my low point of many years at British ringsides'.
In defence of Hagler Mc

Before the fight in September 1980 the press frenzy was predictable; Minter’s friend and foe, Kevin Finnegan, insisted Hagler had refused to shake his hand when they had fought. Finnegan said that Hagler told him: “I don’t touch white flesh.” Hagler has always denied the claim. “I never shook any colour of hand before a fight!” he told me a year ago in Glasgow. He shook my hand as proof.

Minter, meanwhile, gave a bad interview and talked about not losing to “that black man.” It was clumsy at best. The fight was truly savage, Minter was cut in the first, second and third. It was over in the third, Minter’s world title was gone and then three seconds after it was called off the first of a thousand bottles landed in the ring.

There was “the rancid smell of racism” in the air insisted Carpenter. That is not a shock. The riot that followed meant Hagler had to flee under a canopy of raised policeman’s arms, urgent cover for the new champion. Hagler is now rightly considered one of the sport’s finest.
 

keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#9
Wow, five posts in to a Hagler thread and no one has claimed he was robbed against Leonard. (he wasn't)
It's a tough fight to score as it depends upon whether you score for effective aggression. Punches landed stats are pretty close, lot of holding (particularly by Leonard). The real problem comes with the one judges scorecard of 118-110 in Leonard's favour . The 115-113 scores either way are fine and can reflect the judges subjective opinion. The 118-110 is an impossible score for anyone having actually seen that fight. Scoring has been a problem in boxing for a long long time. Particularly in the U.K.
 

Neppos

Vital Reserves Team
#10
I
It's a tough fight to score as it depends upon whether you score for effective aggression. Punches landed stats are pretty close, lot of holding (particularly by Leonard). The real problem comes with the one judges scorecard of 118-110 in Leonard's favour . The 115-113 scores either way are fine and can reflect the judges subjective opinion. The 118-110 is an impossible score for anyone having actually seen that fight. Scoring has been a problem in boxing for a long long time. Particularly in the U.K.


I agree. It was an incredibly close fight, could have gone either way, a draw could easily have been called aswell.

You are right about that one scorecard, it was ridiculous. However, it was surprising how many of the 35 ringside experts, journalists etc had it one sided, both ways. I mean not many because it was a close fight, but a few. I think they called it 18 - 17 Leonard aswell.

For me, Leonard threw fewer punches but landed with more, making him superior both offensively and defensively. Hagler fans will say he was never hurt by any of them so wasn't bothered, not the point.

Hagler fans (or Leonard detractors), saying he was robbed is garbage. Neither fighter would have been 'robbed' if they lost the decision that night.