Racism and Abuse in football | Vital Football

Racism and Abuse in football

Imps2018

Vital 1st Team Regular
#1
Following the abuse of the Chelsea, Man Utd and other premier league players as well as the death threats sent to Mike Dean’s family, what action should be taken?

Personally I think stopping the premier league season needs to be investigated at this point and look into how widespread the issue is in lower leagues and stop those if required. If all the taking a knee and say no to racism really means something, it’s about time some action was taken.

I’d also mic the refs up to let fans hear their reasoning, and take dissent much more seriously. Bookings straight away and a sending off if you carry on. If the players aren’t arguing back and respecting the referees then maybe the fans will be more inclined to.

The abuse of the players and officials has gone way too far, even the non racist and non death threat abuse. Even on here, you would not say some of these things out loud so it’s not ok to type. People really need to take a long hard look at some of the things they are saying and typing.

Just focus on cheering and celebrating the talent rather than being a d***.
 

MaineRoad_96

Vital 1st Team Regular
#2
Well the magic of social media means that the views of every crank and weirdo get amplified. These cowards only do this because they think the remoteness of social media gives them some kind of protection from any consequences.

Identify them and make an example of them - like that dick from Retford the other week.
 

hulloutpost

Vital Football Hero
#3
There have been rumblings of law changes to bring in huge fines for outlets like Facebook if they fail to self police the material they allow to be posted via their forums.

That seems like an eminently sensible first step. Focus the minds in a meaningful way of those that provide a handy platform for the abusers, and turn a blind eye to the repeated infractions.

If the ability of the dimwits to utilise social media becomes much harder to do with impunity, they are unable to operate with a degree of anonymity and they are guaranteed prompt repercussions it will reduce a lot of the problem at source; certainly so far as the pre-meditated troll mentality offenders goes.

There will always be e.g. some drunken idiot that can't contain themselves on the spur of the moment but they can be mopped up by the authorities in due course.
 

S6Ian

Vital Reserves Team
#4
Following the abuse of the Chelsea, Man Utd and other premier league players as well as the death threats sent to Mike Dean’s family, what action should be taken?

Personally I think stopping the premier league season needs to be investigated at this point and look into how widespread the issue is in lower leagues and stop those if required. If all the taking a knee and say no to racism really means something, it’s about time some action was taken.

I’d also mic the refs up to let fans hear their reasoning, and take dissent much more seriously. Bookings straight away and a sending off if you carry on. If the players aren’t arguing back and respecting the referees then maybe the fans will be more inclined to.

The abuse of the players and officials has gone way too far, even the non racist and non death threat abuse. Even on here, you would not say some of these things out loud so it’s not ok to type. People really need to take a long hard look at some of the things they are saying and typing.

Just focus on cheering and celebrating the talent rather than being a d***.
The problem is that social media is a huge problem and I query if it is a football problem as much as it is a society problem.
The answers, to me are punishments have to be robust. If somebody is being racially offensive (Or discriminatory about anyone) or making threats to kill people that has to be taken seriously by the authorities (Courts) AND the social media platforms concerned.

As for players kneeling down, I don’t think it achieves anything and I would argue that a ‘Kick it out’ weekend every season doesn’t either. This is the 21st century and people have been ‘Educated’ long enough, now is the time for robust action. It cannot be that tricky.

I also totally agree that players have to take responsibility for their actions. I find it galling listening to players preach anything when a significant proportion are not exactly paragons of virtue on the pitch.
 

Ruskingtony

Vital Reserves Team
#6
There are always cowards kicking around in society. Most bigots are usually cowards. They must get up every morning thinking how wonderful social media is for them.
They can hide with the total knowledge that they can spread their hatred and vile abuse without fear of being identified.
All the social media outlets play lip service to solving the problem, whilst letting this continue unabated. Politicians spout on about it all the time whilst actually doing nothing about it.
Until something is done to fine the social media companies massive amounts for every time this happens nothing will change.
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Squad Member
#7
Referees expect verbal abuse at banter level from supporters, all part of the day out for us (and them).
But nasty threats to them and players are so so wrong.
Hope some way can be found to stop it.
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Squad Member
#10
Banter, yes. Abuse, no.
Went to a sports dinner a while back with a retired FIFA referee as guest speaker.
He opened with a big grin saying "over the last 20 years I have had several million football fans all agree that I'm a w###ker..."

Doubtless we all contributed to that assessment at times.
Sending people death threats is on a totally different planet.
 

Imps2018

Vital 1st Team Regular
#11
Went to a sports dinner a while back with a retired FIFA referee as guest speaker.
He opened with a big grin saying "over the last 20 years I have had several million football fans all agree that I'm a w###ker..."

Doubtless we all contributed to that assessment at times.
Sending people death threats is on a totally different planet.
Football is the only sport I can think of that has no respect in it for the officials. And I can’t think of any reason for that to be true. It’s about time players and fans respected them.
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Squad Member
#13
Football is the only sport I can think of that has no respect in it for the officials. And I can’t think of any reason for that to be true. It’s about time players and fans respected them.
Also one of the few sports where most officials have not played it.

But actually I think officials get loads of respect from players and fans alike.
 

PerthImp

Vital 1st Team Regular
#15
Oh I wish solving racist abuse in football was as simple as telling people to stop. It’s a lot more complex and deep rooted than that unfortunately and we could debate the issue endlessly. There have been studies and educational courses to look at the problem for decades and they have only scratched the surface. It’s a basic human trait which has its roots in tribal conflict and won’t be resolved until parents teach their children properly, teachers reinforce parental education and, perhaps most importantly, political groups and world leaders stop setting the example by abusing and violating their own people and others.

Ooh did I really say that🤔. My brain hurts and I’m going back to bed 😴
 

LA_Imp

Vital Youth Team
#16
Has there been some recent events prompting this, specific to football? I might have missed it, and I've seen a couple of forum posts but have not been able to find the source of what is going on.

I don't use Facebook, or do twittering, or chatsnapping or anything like that so it is quite likely I'm way behind what is occurring.
 

Ex-Ref

Vital Squad Member
#17
In respect of following Lincoln City, the racism at football in the 1960's and 70's was on a scale that people today would think that you were either lying or exaggerating. I have heard thousands of people at Sincil Bank giving monkey chants to the only black player on the pitch. Their choice language was boundless and without challenge.This was in the times of a mere hand full of black players throughout the whole football league.
These days, in the rare instances at LCFC that a racist insult is heard, the majority of supporters either challenge it at the time or there is a mighty discussion amongst supporters later. If caught the culprits are banned. What huge steps we have made in 50 years.
Enough experts tell us that racism still exists so we have to believe them if we don't see it for ourselves.
What I would challenge is the sudden escalation in claims of racism over the past few months. One could argue that more people are coming out to say what is happening. A different argument and one that has gained popularity with several MP's beginning to raise questions, is the role in far left politics in the racism in football debate. Apparently Boris Johnson has ordered an inquiry (I didn't read the reports). However, I do find it hard to believe that there are any more racists this year than last year (are you now racist but weren't before)?
I find it much easier to believe that that the extreme or far left are behind the racism debate and using it for their own ends. Even Black Lives Matter had until recently stated that they were a Marxist group (in their mission statement which has subsequently been removed). Naturally, when this happens the far right will get out of bed and suddenly it appears that there is a massive problem whereas the existing problem of racism was becoming steadily less year on year.
Of great hindrance to the fight against racism is actually the left wing itself. They stifle all debate by screaming "racist" at anyone who doesn't agree 100% with their point of view. This make people frightened to join in and leaves left wing rhetoric
to rule. I've been called a Trotsky and a racist in the same conversation.
Well, I'm no expert and in the middle politically, I'm white so will never actually know or experience what it is to be black in this country. However, I feel free enough to call out both left and right on the subject because they are the ones that do nothing to fight racism.
 

Imps2018

Vital 1st Team Regular
#18
Has there been some recent events prompting this, specific to football? I might have missed it, and I've seen a couple of forum posts but have not been able to find the source of what is going on.

I don't use Facebook, or do twittering, or chatsnapping or anything like that so it is quite likely I'm way behind what is occurring.
Racial abuse - 5 Chelsea & Man Utd players in the last 2 weeks, including Marcus Rashford
Referee abuse - Mike Dean and his family have been sent death threats. Just watch any match and you’ll see players trying to intimidate the ref into giving decisions their way. Or read our match day threads or rate the ref threads
General abuse and lack of respect - I imagine that Steve Evans thread on here is not too polite or respectful.
 

oldgaurd

Vital 1st Team Regular
#19
In respect of following Lincoln City, the racism at football in the 1960's and 70's was on a scale that people today would think that you were either lying or exaggerating. I have heard thousands of people at Sincil Bank giving monkey chants to the only black player on the pitch. Their choice language was boundless and without challenge.This was in the times of a mere hand full of black players throughout the whole football league.
These days, in the rare instances at LCFC that a racist insult is heard, the majority of supporters either challenge it at the time or there is a mighty discussion amongst supporters later. If caught the culprits are banned. What huge steps we have made in 50 years.
Enough experts tell us that racism still exists so we have to believe them if we don't see it for ourselves.
What I would challenge is the sudden escalation in claims of racism over the past few months. One could argue that more people are coming out to say what is happening. A different argument and one that has gained popularity with several MP's beginning to raise questions, is the role in far left politics in the racism in football debate. Apparently Boris Johnson has ordered an inquiry (I didn't read the reports). However, I do find it hard to believe that there are any more racists this year than last year (are you now racist but weren't before)?
I find it much easier to believe that that the extreme or far left are behind the racism debate and using it for their own ends. Even Black Lives Matter had until recently stated that they were a Marxist group (in their mission statement which has subsequently been removed). Naturally, when this happens the far right will get out of bed and suddenly it appears that there is a massive problem whereas the existing problem of racism was becoming steadily less year on year.
Of great hindrance to the fight against racism is actually the left wing itself. They stifle all debate by screaming "racist" at anyone who doesn't agree 100% with their point of view. This make people frightened to join in and leaves left wing rhetoric
to rule. I've been called a Trotsky and a racist in the same conversation.
Well, I'm no expert and in the middle politically, I'm white so will never actually know or experience what it is to be black in this country. However, I feel free enough to call out both left and right on the subject because they are the ones that do nothing to fight racism.
Oh dear.I wish I could remember the name of the black female journalist .She is an activist who opposes racism She once stated that if she appears on radio or TV regarding racism they invite a racistin order to offer a balanced debate. Ex Ref you are falling into the trap of bringing the left or the right into the debate .You fell for the classic Marxist explanation for the true existence of BLM .......Racism is insidious .What is there to debate?
 

Croozey

Vital 1st Team Regular
#20
The difference now is it's being called out, rather than ignored.
No doubt that society in the UK is a lot less racist now than it was in the past, when it was part and parcel of our lives. You had TV shows on every week being racist and calling it funny.
I havent lived in Lincoln since the early 90's, but there has never been many black or asian people living there. This was due to immigrants coming to Britain in the 50's and 60's went to live where the work was and that wasnt Lincoln. Perhaps people in Lincoln have a different perspective. I've got a lot of neighbours, work colleagues and good friends who are black and asian. I dont see their colour, just lovely, generous people, great sense of humour and love the country by the way.
But the stories they tell, about not just racial abuse but, getting off the train on your way home minding your own business, and the next thing you are running for your life with a white gang after you. Another chap, who is built like a Heavyweight boxer, yet he talks with his head down and suffers from his nerves. He's been subjected to a number of kickings. Only because of his colour. You need to see things from their point of view.
I think we have changed the way society as a whole thinks, no doubt about that, but the extreme nutters are still out there. Sadly I don't think you will stop them without the use of concentration camps. But compare our society to most other countries, we are an improvement.