The Politics Thread | Page 357 | Vital Football

The Politics Thread

wittonite said:
It's the hard left, they terrify people, hard working people. Some of the crap they were comming out with in the fringes at conference are nuts, and alienate people
Imposing a land tax if you have a garden, taxing farmers on the land they own.
Compulsory purchase of all the land that houses are built on, so that all land becomes the property of the state.
Grabbing 40% of all inheritance.
Nobody can own more than one house.
It's Marxist crap, and Starmer hasn't marginalized the left, he still has a long way to go before they are electable.
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My friend is a Labour Party delegate. If you think the people you describe here have ever had any power, she could educate you on the subject. Stop reading The Spectator.
 
colavfc said:
Labour is full of nutters. Everything is racist. Transphobic, UK history being eradicated. Ask someone from labour about the Rotherham grooming gang cover up. That's enough for me. They won't even address it.
A black MP who I forget his name but from what I have seen he is bloody great. He challenged Sadiq khan on the Rotherham issue and Sadiq said he finds that racist towards Muslims. Hahahahaha. What a twat. On just this alone I have a passionate hate for the left. I could go on for hours really.
And yes I understand Tories are in control and they covered up Rotherham too but the left just scream racist when the issue is debated. Then you have labour MPs making absolute idiots of themselves. Race baiting all the time or not knowing their own policies or information. Not for me. Makes me feel sick to be honest.
And yes. Boris makes me sick also.
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So basically, the system is flawed, not the parties.
 
wittonite said:
It's the hard left, they terrify people, hard working people. Some of the crap they were comming out with in the fringes at conference are nuts, and alienate people
Imposing a land tax if you have a garden, taxing farmers on the land they own.
Compulsory purchase of all the land that houses are built on, so that all land becomes the property of the state.
Grabbing 40% of all inheritance.
Nobody can own more than one house.
It's Marxist crap, and Starmer hasn't marginalized the left, he still has a long way to go before they are electable.
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The left fucking DESPISE Starmer, his policies, his shadow cabinet and are totally marginalised, even more so now the leadership rules have been changed meaning it's virtually impossible for the left of the party to get someone to be leader now.
 
colavfc said:
Labour is full of nutters. Everything is racist. Transphobic, UK history being eradicated. Ask someone from labour about the Rotherham grooming gang cover up. That's enough for me. They won't even address it.
A black MP who I forget his name but from what I have seen he is bloody great. He challenged Sadiq khan on the Rotherham issue and Sadiq said he finds that racist towards Muslims. Hahahahaha. What a twat. On just this alone I have a passionate hate for the left. I could go on for hours really.
And yes I understand Tories are in control and they covered up Rotherham too but the left just scream racist when the issue is debated. Then you have labour MPs making absolute idiots of themselves. Race baiting all the time or not knowing their own policies or information. Not for me. Makes me feel sick to be honest.
And yes. Boris makes me sick also.
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Glad you brought up Rotherham. Interesting interview here from 2014 with the former DPP.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/av/uk-politics-28965929
 
Platypus said:
The left fucking DESPISE Starmer, his policies, his shadow cabinet and are totally marginalised, even more so now the leadership rules have been changed meaning it's virtually impossible for the left of the party to get someone to be leader now.
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That's as maybe, but the message has not been gotten across to the voting public.
 
danvilla2 said:
The Tory masses in the south midlands through Oxfordshire towards the Home Counties would be in uproar. My folks have nightmares their little village is going to be overrun by some sort of Turkish invasion. Imagine the uproar from a mosque being built in a middle class, semi rural Oxfordshire town

The second problem would be the born and bred Brits would feel they have a right to those middle class houses before a refugee.

I can’t see how it all works however I am pro-economic migrants who have skills and are a culture fit for where we need them (which 52% don’t want either).
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We have an aging population and will need more people of working age to come in to support economic growth, to your last sentence, people with best cultural fit and closer values should be prioritised IMO.
 
It has worked. Yet when I have met people on the doorstep and present socialist policies, like improving the healthcare system, the vast majority like them. Even Nationalisation of some industries is.

Take away the stigma of the name, and boil it down to what it would mean, and people actually like it.
 
"Socialism" is too vague. It can be boiled down to 'public' ownership of the entire means of production, this ownership can be state or through some other mechanism such as through co-ops. You can't have this and have elements of capitalism. If you have a mixed economy then it is not socialism. Marxists will also differ on the definition and it's implications/ solutions.

Red herring.
 
Pangloss said:
"Socialism" is too vague. It can be boiled down to 'public' ownership of the entire means of production, this ownership can be state or through some other mechanism such as through co-ops. You can't have this and have elements of capitalism. If you have a mixed economy then it is not socialism. Marxists will also differ on the definition and it's implications/ solutions.

Red herring.
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Yes, in truth, not one UK or US politician wants socialism. It would make them poorer, in all likelihood. What everybody wants is a hybrid system of capitalism with some level of social welfare system.

It's the level of this welfare system that is where the differences lie.
 
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HeathfieldRoad1874 said:
Yes, in truth, not one UK or US politician wants socialism. It would make them poorer, in all likelihood. What everybody wants is a hybrid system of capitalism with some level of socials welfare system.

It's the level of this welfare system that is where the differences lie.
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I think at the end of the day the word 'socialism' is an anachronism that needs to be ditched, it's extremely bad PR for anyone to try and talk it up as a good thing. Presumably the part of politics is being able to get your ideas over to people who disagree, talking up socialism will be a barrier for many.
 
You will find that is a deliberate ploy by the right, Pangloss. They use it as an insult, and have twisted the meaning.

The left really do need to find some way to distance themselves from it. Like Bernie Saunders and AOC saying what they support is Democratic Socialism. To most, that's still socialism.

Even Corbyn isn't a true socialist, and for that matter, neither are the Chinese.
 
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