Poch to Manure..according to the Sun's Neil Ashton. | Page 2 | Vital Forums

Poch to Manure..according to the Sun's Neil Ashton.

Pollo

Alert Team
#21
I can't believe so many want him to leave, 3 top 4 finish in a row. I guess they want to go back to finishing 5th, 6th & 7th.
Winning a trophy would be great, but finishing in the top 4 at the moment in the clubs development is far more important in my view. Those top 4 finishes is sign of our improvement, I don't know where people think winning a trophy and finishing outside top 4 would get us.

Those top 4 finishes has allowed us to increase a number of our players salaries, thus keeping them on board.
As for having the best 11 in the league is utter nonsense IMO, Citeh certainly has a better 11. And I would argue that you could make an argument that both Chelski and pool are also better.

With the new stadium coming on line I'd certainly take a top 4 finish over a trophy (unless it's the Europa league), anyone that thinks a player would come to us because we've won the FA cup to play in Europa over team in CL who can pay bigger salary is deluded IMO.

Also every year we are in CL means someone else isn't, and the longer we keep them out of CL the weaker they get. I just feel that we really need to look past our nose and see the long term objective.
I for one want him to leave so we can move forward, not backwards, and presenting this as a binary choice, when in fact it is nothing more than a prediction, leaves little room for discussion.

We did have the best 11 in the league IMO in the years Leicester/Chavs won the league, we don not anymore. Feel free to view this differently, but I am not alone in thinking that.

It is difficult to speak hypothetically, what another manager could or could not have achieved with that squad. Could it have been worse? Yes, but it could also have been a lot better. Poch has done some amazing things here, but he also inherited a club with top players in their prime (Jan, Mousa, Walker, Rose, Lloris), and young players such as Dele Ali and Kane.

We keep hearing long term project, and I was a supporter, but the end goal is not top 4 finishes. Poch said so himself a couple of seasons ago - the goal is to win the league.

All the rest I agree with - finances, CL and league position. That said, it is time we win something. We were better than Arse in that last years and they have several FA cups. Last year Chelsea managed to win it off a terrible season. ManU in their worst years have won a few titles. Spurs could not manage a single title. Zero.

His inability to improve his game management, apparent lack of tactical flexibility, the way he allowed the squad to get to this point, and his press comments have me in the leave camp.
 

Topspur1

Vital Champions League
#22
The longer he stays the stronger we'll get IMO, we will see more youngsters pushing for first team squad place. It is well documented that chopping and changing managers is detrimental to youth development.
 

spurdon

Vital Football Legend
#23
I don't exactly want him to leave but I wouldn't be too bothered if he did go.

Been over this loads of times before but give me mid table finishes and the odd cup win then constant top 4 finishes and no cup wins. Each to their own though
At this point in the long term viability of the club a cup, bar the big two league and champions league,dose nothing but give us a nice memory. We cant afford to be sentimental now. The finances are too precarious. If we keep Chelsea or Arsenal out the ECL for one more season, we could see epic issues for their wage bills. In real terms it could be the difference with them keeping a Hazard or an Abamayang and us starting to shop for that bracket of player. We finally have UEFA talking exclusion for Man City over FFP. They are also talking an 80million transfer window cap. So no more owner back splurges to solve there problems like city taking Walker whils adding Sane and Jesus. No more artificially leaps away which is what Liverpool did to get past us.
 

Topspur1

Vital Champions League
#24
When he joined us it was stated quite clearly that it was part of a 5 year plan, for me the club is on an upward projector.
Pollo point regarding Leicester is fair enough, I his view regarding Chav is a little more contentious IMO. The season Chavs won it they had no European football, we finished on 86pts, I think since PL started only 5 teams amassed 86pts and not won the league.
 

ScottDaYid

Vital Football Legend
#25
At this point in the long term viability of the club a cup, bar the big two league and champions league,dose nothing but give us a nice memory. We cant afford to be sentimental now. The finances are too precarious. If we keep Chelsea or Arsenal out the ECL for one more season, we could see epic issues for their wage bills. In real terms it could be the difference with them keeping a Hazard or an Abamayang and us starting to shop for that bracket of player. We finally have UEFA talking exclusion for Man City over FFP. They are also talking an 80million transfer window cap. So no more owner back splurges to solve there problems like city taking Walker whils adding Sane and Jesus. No more artificially leaps away which is what Liverpool did to get past us.
Them teams will always be there or there abouts though, same as us. The top 6 is too far ahead for anything to go that drastically wrong.
 

spurdon

Vital Football Legend
#26
Them teams will always be there or there abouts though, same as us. The top 6 is too far ahead for anything to go that drastically wrong.
Mate its not about those teams not competing with us its about what a hit to there revenue streams for another season does to the nature of that competition. For the first time we'd have an edge. If the reports I read on the Chavs is accurate another season outside might even put us firmly in front. Think about it if they lose Hazard and can only replace him with Zaha are they even a top four side?
 

muttley

Vital Squad Member
#27
Shall we go back in for Frank de Boer? He was the bees knees at the time of signing Poch.

How about a straight swap "no titles Poch" with "serial winner Mourinho"

Then there's Eddie Howe. How could he possibly fail.

Chrissy Hughton bleeds Spurs, has cut his teeth elsewhere and is ready for the job he was born for.

Then there's Harry. If we let Poch go now, he could leave the jungle and come back to save us again. We could buy a couple of 30 year olds in Jan, switch back to 4-4-2 and we could have those famous team talks "spread out lads and run around a lot".

Surely anyone that wants Poch to leave can offer up some names !!!
 
#31
Shall we go back in for Frank de Boer? He was the bees knees at the time of signing Poch.

How about a straight swap "no titles Poch" with "serial winner Mourinho"

Then there's Eddie Howe. How could he possibly fail.

Chrissy Hughton bleeds Spurs, has cut his teeth elsewhere and is ready for the job he was born for.

Then there's Harry. If we let Poch go now, he could leave the jungle and come back to save us again. We could buy a couple of 30 year olds in Jan, switch back to 4-4-2 and we could have those famous team talks "spread out lads and run around a lot".

Surely anyone that wants Poch to leave can offer up some names !!!
The only proven winner I could see us getting is the fat waiter.
 

Pollo

Alert Team
#32
How did I do that?!!
It does take 22 to win the league, but my argument is that with the level of players he had in the 11, he should have won something, and he did not win anything.

Now, saying that we didn't have the squad to win anything is really a big statement. We had some squad players like Son, Lamela, Sanchez, very decent backup LB/RB which are far better than any backup fullbacks around.
 
#36
It does take 22 to win the league, but my argument is that with the level of players he had in the 11, he should have won something, and he did not win anything.

Now, saying that we didn't have the squad to win anything is really a big statement. We had some squad players like Son, Lamela, Sanchez, very decent backup LB/RB which are far better than any backup fullbacks around.
Ok, I understand, but either way 11 players just isn't enough to win a competition without incredible luck - yes, to winning any game on the day - but to get through awhole competition and win when the clubs we've been up against have spent vast sums on squad depth?!!

I just can't agree with you on this one - except perhaps for the year Leicester won the PL and we fell apart.
 
#37
What an ungateful lot we have here! Poch has given us top 4 in the last 3 years & Champions League in consequence. He has achieved this with the meanest board of any top club in the Premiership. If you think we can replace this amazing manager with a better one, with the miserable budget that ENIC operates on, then you are seriously deluded.
 

Nick Real Deal

Vital Champions League
#39
I think we have had the players to win something. But the League Cup and FA Cup are token tournaments. The Europa proved too disruptive playing on Thursdays. That leaves the CL no chance and the PL .
Over the last 3 seasons we had Leicester which was a freak outcome and nobody saw that coming, but we pushed them nearly all the way. Then the Chavs which again we were in contention with despite a far less expensive squad. Then City who had the best manager in the world and some of the best players in the world, again money no object.

So I never expected any PL win , we punched above our weight and defied the odds with such a squad.

The best chance was the Leicester year but we fell away for various reasons. If we had a crystal ball and knew what was going to happen we could have signed a few top players and said..... this is the year, we just have Leicester to beat, go out and win the title.

I'm not having it Poch had the squad to win anything of significance. A token cup maybe but that's a consolation prize that Poch has already admitted to not really caring about, neither do I . If we won the FA Cup all well and good but it has lost its prestige.