NUFC v Man Utd | Page 3 | Vital Football

NUFC v Man Utd

Rza

Vital Champions League
#41
Scapegoats? Haha obviously I can only speak on behalf of myself, I don't come on here very often any more, but when I do it's to talk football. It's common knowledge Ashley is responsible for the mess, it has been for years - even before the penny dropped with you. I come on this forum now to talk about football. I've criticised everyone from Pardew to Benitez and Ben arfa to obertan. That's not going to stop and it certainly doesn't mean I don't know whose responsible. Now, any manager of a football team will tell you himself that HIS team is HIS responsibility. That's regardless of what goes on at boardroom level because there's politic at every club.


Onto Saturdays match. Well it seems you really do have different expectations than everyone else because a fair few of our educated fan base or actually anyone with half a brain cell knew this isn't 1996 and man Utd were there for the taking. But then again it's all Ashley fault Steve Bruce has never beaten man United with any club.
 

ukrocks0007

Vital Squad Member
#43
They are professional footballers Mac so I expect that anyone earning stupid money £ x thousands per week can actually play football. I don't care if they are a £3m signing from a lower league or £40m from a foreign league. They are paid to play football and half of them can't even do the basics right.

I've seen better defending, better shape and not an over reliance one one player to carry an attacking threat on a Wednesday night at The Parks.

We all know Ashley is to blame, there's nothing new that can be said about that now. I expect 11 players to put a shift in when they cross that white line. Instead there's a certain midfielder that struts about thinking he's David Beckham. A £40m signing that seems to be confused what he is supposed to be doing then when he actually get near the box he goes to pieces. A £3m centre half who marks shadows, stands off and is caught out of position but has the captains armband because he mouthed off in the paper one time!
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#44
I get all that mate - I genuinely do

I just dont understand why anyone finds results like this one surprising

We have some decent players who on their day can cause an upset but there is an absolute chasm in terms of club mentality between us and most other teams

We are actively encouraged by the owner to do no more than is necessary to survive each season

I just dont get why most on here recognise that we are a shambles of a club but expect more from them on a matchday
 

keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#45
If anyone isn't well aware of the managed decline of this club they never will be. The result wasn't surprising but Saturday in a lot of ways wasn't so much about the result but the performance. You can still expect a certain level from players and management even within the constraints of Ashley. This season unlike many others we've seen some money spent and that side has some decent players that could be organized and managed far better. Looking at Saturday's game Manchester United were there for the taking. Fresh off an annihilation by Spurs and being comprehensively outplayed by Palace and Brighton. Are we saying those players are not capable of playing to the levels of Brighton or Palace (obviously not in the Brighton game that they won 0-3)?

Newcastle had the gift of the own goal, a penalty saved and a goal against chalked off, there was never a better chance for Bruce and the side to get something and they failed, not by having a go, not through a bad decision or Manchester United swashbuckling their way through us but largely because of the ineptitude of the management.

Then you have the situation of Hayden who had a hamstring and was told to carry on , like he could run it off . Or Darlow, who having made 602 saves in that match and was rewarded for his efforts by being kept on whilst blatantly injured. That's without analyzing Bruce's post match psychosis and his blaming of going too attacking in the last few minutes and somehow implying that this was the fault of Almiron the 88th minute sub.

On top of that there will be horror stories passed from generation to generation dedicated to the levels of frustration that any Newcastle United fan will have encountered watching Joelinton on the right.

You are quite right Newcastle United are a shambles of a club but it's the shambles of a club that a fuckwit like Alan Pardew can get to fifth in the league within the constraints of Ashley. A shambles of a club that a Champion's League winning manager requested to manage and finished with more points than Bruce despite a spend of over £100 million less within the constraints of Ashley.

There are still some possibilities even under Ashley and a decent performance against Manchester United was certainly one of them. It wouldn't have been a patch on the 5-0 the Keegan side had but it could have been the equal of the 3-0 the Pardew one did.
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#47
If anyone isn't well aware of the managed decline of this club they never will be. The result wasn't surprising but Saturday in a lot of ways wasn't so much about the result but the performance. You can still expect a certain level from players and management even within the constraints of Ashley. This season unlike many others we've seen some money spent and that side has some decent players that could be organized and managed far better. Looking at Saturday's game Manchester United were there for the taking. Fresh off an annihilation by Spurs and being comprehensively outplayed by Palace and Brighton. Are we saying those players are not capable of playing to the levels of Brighton or Palace (obviously not in the Brighton game that they won 0-3)?

Newcastle had the gift of the own goal, a penalty saved and a goal against chalked off, there was never a better chance for Bruce and the side to get something and they failed, not by having a go, not through a bad decision or Manchester United swashbuckling their way through us but largely because of the ineptitude of the management.

Then you have the situation of Hayden who had a hamstring and was told to carry on , like he could run it off . Or Darlow, who having made 602 saves in that match and was rewarded for his efforts by being kept on whilst blatantly injured. That's without analyzing Bruce's post match psychosis and his blaming of going too attacking in the last few minutes and somehow implying that this was the fault of Almiron the 88th minute sub.

On top of that there will be horror stories passed from generation to generation dedicated to the levels of frustration that any Newcastle United fan will have encountered watching Joelinton on the right.

You are quite right Newcastle United are a shambles of a club but it's the shambles of a club that a fuckwit like Alan Pardew can get to fifth in the league within the constraints of Ashley. A shambles of a club that a Champion's League winning manager requested to manage and finished with more points than Bruce despite a spend of over £100 million less within the constraints of Ashley.

There are still some possibilities even under Ashley and a decent performance against Manchester United was certainly one of them. It wouldn't have been a patch on the 5-0 the Keegan side had but it could have been the equal of the 3-0 the Pardew one did.

A very eloquent post concluding that Bruce is shit

Similar to McLaren - absolutely no logical reason why either should have been appointed

But he is here because consistency and progression are not required from Ashley's Newcastle United
 
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Rza

Vital Champions League
#48
At what stage did you give up your season ticket Raza?

What sacrifices have you made?
Not that any of that is any of your business but let's put it this way, if all supporters had my stance instead of yours Ashley would have been gone back when you were calling him the saviour.
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#49
Not that any of that is any of your business but let's put it this way, if all supporters had my stance instead of yours Ashley would have been gone back when you were calling him the saviour.

You've got me mixed up with somebody else

I've never considered or stated that Ashley is or was the saviour


None of my business?? - its not exactly a personal question is it?

I'm just interested to find out at which point you gave up something you absolutely loved and walked away?
 

keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#50
But he is here because consistency and progression are not required from Ashley's Newcastle United
We know that. How about telling me something I don't know ?

So let's not discuss anything as ultimately it's always about the restrictions of Ashley. If you do that you might as well down tools and fuck off til he's gone. Why do you post at all in that case? You could just literally post the same sentence in every single one of your posts. It's reductive.

I'm a firm believer that every football fan and every Newcastle fan still have to have the chance to dream. Everyone knows full well the lack of ambition but loads of us will have been sitting down to watch the Manchester United match (hopefully not on pay per view) hoping Newcastle embarrass them. You can still dream even under Ashley's Newcastle, it's not the almost winning the league or beating Barcelona dreams that became reality, it's very different but you're still allowed to want to beat Manchester United. Still allowed to enjoy a goal or appreciate the skill of Saint Maximin, a hard tackle,expect more from a manager or vent your frustrations at Lascelles or any one of the many moments of escapism that football can give you.

If you've let him take your love of what football and even this skeleton of Newcastle United can still give you especially in grim times like these then you've truly lost.
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#51
I see where you're coming from...

Lascelles is shit
Steve Bruce is shit
Joelinton's shit
Shelvey's shit
Blah, blah fucking blah

How about telling me something I don't know ??

Nothing 'new' gets discussed on here regarding match days - its the same old rinse and repeat shite every week. Busting a gut to slag a player off even when they haven't seen the match

I'm merely expressing my opinion that accepting that the club is a shambles and then getting all upset when Man United make us look like a shambles is odd.
 

keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#52
I see where you're coming from...

Lascelles is shit
Steve Bruce is shit
Joelinton's shit
Shelvey's shit
Blah, blah fucking blah

How about telling me something I don't know ??

Nothing 'new' gets discussed on here regarding match days - its the same old rinse and repeat shite every week. Busting a gut to slag a player off even when they haven't seen the match

I'm merely expressing my opinion that accepting that the club is a shambles and then getting all upset when Man United make us look like a shambles is odd.
Ah so once again it's about ....you .
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#53
No no - I've very clearly explained (on numerous occasions now) that accepting the club is a shambles, purely down to Ashley's running of it and then blaming other people on a matchday is in my opinion a bit odd

Now you can attempt to change the meaning of what I have said or weirdly make out my opinion on this subject is 'all about me' but the fact remains that ALL roads lead to Ashley

I am fully aware that you (and the majority of posters on this board) understand this and that what I have said isnt news to any of you but that was sort of the point of my initial post stating that I seem to have different expectations than most of you seeing as we ALL know that this is ALL Ashley's doing

To then get all worked up and blame individuals who wouldn't be here under ambitious owners when a squad put together at around 4 times the value of ours shows us up for exactly what we are is just weird

It really isnt anymore difficult to understand than that
 
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keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#54
No no - I've very clearly explained (on numerous occasions now) that accepting the club is a shambles, purely down to Ashley's running of it and then blaming other people on a matchday is in my opinion a bit odd

Now you can attempt to change the meaning of what I have said or weirdly make out my opinion on this subject is 'all about me' but the fact remains that ALL roads lead to Ashley

I am fully aware that you (and the majority of posters on this board) understand this and that what I have said isnt news to any of you but that was sort of the point of my initial post stating that I seem to have different expectations than most of you seeing as we ALL know that this is ALL Ashley's doing

To then get all worked up and blame individuals who wouldn't be here under ambitious owners when a squad put together at around 4 times the value of ours shows us up for exactly what we are is just weird

It really isnt anymore difficult to understand than that
How is it weird to expect Shelvey to go in for a 50/50 tackle ? Or the manager not to play injured players ? Answer it isn't .

Your entire post is about you, in your words "having different expectations than most of you" but then you say it isn't about you .

Your own posts are saying that its about you ......again. There is no changing of meaning.
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#55
How is it weird to expect Shelvey to go in for a 50/50 tackle ? Or the manager not to play injured players ? Answer it isn't .

Your entire post is about you, in your words "having different expectations than most of you" but then you say it isn't about you .

Your own posts are saying that its about you ......again. There is no changing of meaning.
Because in a properly functioning, competitive club those points are not unreasonable but that is clearly not what I think is strange anyway

Obviously Bruce is a shite manager so why is he here?
Why isn't Shelvey better motivated to go in for 50/50 tackles?

You know the answer to both those questions

When people claim they fully comprehend we are an uncompetitive shell of a club, solely down to Ashley's shambolic regime but then try and reason we would be a better club if Ashley's players and managers were better at their jobs is what I find strange


You say you understand the situation we are in and yet still think we should compete with Man United - music to Ashleys ears

I preferred the Keggy that was leading email assaults on Sports Direct - the Keggy who now makes excuses for Ashley I'm not so keen on
 
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keggy_keagal

Vital 1st Team Regular
#56
Because in a properly functioning, competitive club those points are not unreasonable but that is clearly not what I think is strange anyway

When people claim they fully comprehend we are an uncompetitive shell of a club, solely down to Ashley's shambolic regime but then try and reason we would be a better club if Ashley's players and managers were better at their jobs is what I find strange

You say you understand the situation we are in and yet still think we should compete with Man United - music to Ashleys ears

I preferred the Keggy that was leading email assaults on Sports Direct - the Keggy who now makes excuses for Ashley I'm not so keen on
"If we were happy with the standard of every player we wouldn't have an issue with Ashley "

Who said that again ?

You don't care about anything else Ashley has done you just care about the standard of player.

I stand by the points I've already made in relation to this whether here or in other threads. I neither seek nor care about your approval. If you weren't so self obsessed you'd maybe be funny. The irony of you at one time calling others a narcissist.
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#57
"If we were happy with the standard of every player we wouldn't have an issue with Ashley "

Who said that again ?

You don't care about anything else Ashley has done you just care about the standard of player.

I stand by the points I've already made in relation to this whether here or in other threads. I neither seek nor care about your approval. If you weren't so self obsessed you'd maybe be funny. The irony of you at one time calling others a narcissist.
Yes I agree - that was a generalisation too far

My views on Ashley are well documented on here so dont attempt to let that one sentence define my stance

Expressing an opinion and sticking by it is hardly narcissistic either but your opinion is your opinion

You claim you understand the restrictions Ashley has put on us and still expect us to compete with Man United - if you weren't so intent on trying to prove a point with me you'd accept how ridiculous that sounds

self obsessed -funny that
 
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Rza

Vital Champions League
#58
None of my business?? - its not exactly a personal question is it?

I'm just interested to find out at which point you gave up something you absolutely loved and walked away?
This is brilliant. You've managed to contradict yourself in 2 sentences
 

Rza

Vital Champions League
#59
I see where you're coming from...

Lascelles is shit
Steve Bruce is shit
Joelinton's shit
Shelvey's shit
Blah, blah fucking blah

How about telling me something I don't know ??

Nothing 'new' gets discussed on here regarding match days - its the same old rinse and repeat shite every week. Busting a gut to slag a player off even when they haven't seen the match
What's worse, the forum, or that you still read and post despite knowing all this?
 

McCreery

Vital 1st Team Regular
#60
This is brilliant. You've managed to contradict yourself in 2 sentences
I take it you missed the question marks?

so when was it you packed in your season ticket or did you not have one??

what sacrifices have you made for you to sit in judgement of those who have??