New signings.... | Page 2 | Vital Football

New signings....

I wasnt at the WHU U23s game but the reports of bust up between Raynor and Kelman suggest that's the reason.

Management team has to retain full authority and stamp down hard on anything like that especially from a young fringe player on loan.

The real shame is I look at Saturday and how isolated Akinde was and think would Kelman have played. Is kelman more of a natural goalscorer than Akinde ? Oliver injury could have given kelman a run of games and maybe that's what he needed to show us what he's capable of.

Assuming he goes back out on loan in January it will be interesting to see what he does elsewhere

Would he be playing tho even if still here? If Steve Evans wanted a 2nd “nippy” body up front, Sithole was an option. He’s been used a fair bit recently but wasn’t in Saturday’s starting XI, and Kelman probably wouldn’t have been either.

If anything at all can be done in January I think we need to move someone, anyone, to be able to get in another striker with at least a bit of a record of scoring, even if not prolific. Just another option to help Oliver out.

Ideally a L2 club will see that Akinde would be excellent at that level, and hopefully Big Jon will this time agree a move. That would free up a decent wedge (if the other club agrees to pay it),

Which club down there needs a boost to get into the top 3 or 7, or away from relegation? And has a lot of money? I would have said Stevenage if SE had gone there 😉

Are Bristol Rovers a possible to come looking again?
 
I'm sure Chriswho is right when he says that clubs do research before sending players out - it isn't going to be as simple as Evans calling a contact and saying "who have you got spare"? Players go out on loan, but their only end goal is to play for their own team. Kelman will have wished he hadn't come to Gillingham, and QPR may feel the same.
 
A contact book is all well and good, but you need those contacts to be in a position to help. The football industry is fluid very few coaches stay that long at any club. Managers need to persuede other clubs to loan them players, they to have a gift of the gab to do a deal not just knowing who to phone, but also have a reputation of improving players.
Agree, but if you have a manager with no contacts (or few than SE) your chances of begging a player on loan are even smaller.
 
Does the embargo really impact on us. My reading

Squad limited to 23 - surely we are under that anyway?

We can’t pay a fee - I can’t remember the last time we did anyway?

We can not pay wages on top of parent club wages - I don’t think that’s the same as saying we can’t contribute towards a parent club wages. (might be wrong though).

We can only sign during a window - unless the player is out of contract. Surely that’s the same for everyone regardless of embargo?

We can only offer contracts to the end of current season. That’s probably the only part which is potentially damaging, but most of our signings seem to have been short term for several years now. There is nothing to stop us offering a new one-year contract at the end of the season.

Under what circumstances can a Club operating under an Embargo sign players?
During a Transfer Window
Clubs can ‘staff up’, so they have 23 players of Professional Standing within their squad.
Clubs are able to ‘staff up’ to ensure the integrity of the competitions remain and so that Clubs are able to fulfil their fixtures.

  • Clubs are only permitted to ‘staff up’ by signing players on loan or players not registered with another Club
    • Clubs cannot pay fees to acquire loan players and cannot pay additional wages on top of the salary the player receives at their parent Club
  • Clubs ‘staffing up’ may only register players until the end of the current Season, whilst loan transfers can only be for half a season
  • Budget restrictions apply dependent upon the divisional status of the Club under embargo
Outside of a Transfer Window
  • Outside of a transfer window, Clubs can only register Out of Registration players (free agents) and Clubs can only register Out of Registration players if they have less than 16 players of Professional Standing (2x Goalkeepers, 14x Outfield Players)
  • In line with Regulation 57, Clubs can register an Emergency Goalkeeper Loan if they don’t have any Professional Goalkeepers available due to injuries, suspensions or international call-ups.
Professional Goalkeeper = a goalkeeper (excluding any Goalkeeper registered as a Non-Contract Player) who has been named in the starting eleven on five or more occasions by:
  • any Club (or Premier League club) in any matches in the relevant league or first team cup competitions (other than the EFL Trophy); and/or
  • any other club in a professional league in that club’s home association (by way of example, any division of the Scottish Professional Football League, or Serie A, B or C).
Professional Standing = is any Player who has made one first team appearance (including as a sub) for any Club in any first team competition (EFL Trophy appearances do not count).
 
Does the embargo really impact on us. My reading

Squad limited to 23 - surely we are under that anyway?

We can’t pay a fee - I can’t remember the last time we did anyway?

We can not pay wages on top of parent club wages - I don’t think that’s the same as saying we can’t contribute towards a parent club wages. (might be wrong though).

We can only sign during a window - unless the player is out of contract. Surely that’s the same for everyone regardless of embargo?

We can only offer contracts to the end of current season. That’s probably the only part which is potentially damaging, but most of our signings seem to have been short term for several years now. There is nothing to stop us offering a new one-year contract at the end of the season.

Under what circumstances can a Club operating under an Embargo sign players?
During a Transfer Window
Clubs can ‘staff up’, so they have 23 players of Professional Standing within their squad.
Clubs are able to ‘staff up’ to ensure the integrity of the competitions remain and so that Clubs are able to fulfil their fixtures.


  • Clubs are only permitted to ‘staff up’ by signing players on loan or players not registered with another Club
    • Clubs cannot pay fees to acquire loan players and cannot pay additional wages on top of the salary the player receives at their parent Club
  • Clubs ‘staffing up’ may only register players until the end of the current Season, whilst loan transfers can only be for half a season
  • Budget restrictions apply dependent upon the divisional status of the Club under embargo
Outside of a Transfer Window

  • Outside of a transfer window, Clubs can only register Out of Registration players (free agents) and Clubs can only register Out of Registration players if they have less than 16 players of Professional Standing (2x Goalkeepers, 14x Outfield Players)
  • In line with Regulation 57, Clubs can register an Emergency Goalkeeper Loan if they don’t have any Professional Goalkeepers available due to injuries, suspensions or international call-ups.
Professional Goalkeeper = a goalkeeper (excluding any Goalkeeper registered as a Non-Contract Player) who has been named in the starting eleven on five or more occasions by:

  • any Club (or Premier League club) in any matches in the relevant league or first team cup competitions (other than the EFL Trophy); and/or
  • any other club in a professional league in that club’s home association (by way of example, any division of the Scottish Professional Football League, or Serie A, B or C).
Professional Standing = is any Player who has made one first team appearance (including as a sub) for any Club in any first team competition (EFL Trophy appearances do not count).
We can’t sign out of contract players outside of the windows due to embargo. Other clubs can sign non contracted players.
We are maxed out already at 23 players including Kelman currently anyway.
We can’t pay loan fees, I thought we could not pay wages towards loans either but not sure about that.
 
Does the embargo really impact on us. My reading

Squad limited to 23 - surely we are under that anyway?

We can’t pay a fee - I can’t remember the last time we did anyway?

We can not pay wages on top of parent club wages - I don’t think that’s the same as saying we can’t contribute towards a parent club wages. (might be wrong though).

We can only sign during a window - unless the player is out of contract. Surely that’s the same for everyone regardless of embargo?

We can only offer contracts to the end of current season. That’s probably the only part which is potentially damaging, but most of our signings seem to have been short term for several years now. There is nothing to stop us offering a new one-year contract at the end of the season.

Under what circumstances can a Club operating under an Embargo sign players?
During a Transfer Window
Clubs can ‘staff up’, so they have 23 players of Professional Standing within their squad.
Clubs are able to ‘staff up’ to ensure the integrity of the competitions remain and so that Clubs are able to fulfil their fixtures.

  • Clubs are only permitted to ‘staff up’ by signing players on loan or players not registered with another Club
    • Clubs cannot pay fees to acquire loan players and cannot pay additional wages on top of the salary the player receives at their parent Club
  • Clubs ‘staffing up’ may only register players until the end of the current Season, whilst loan transfers can only be for half a season
  • Budget restrictions apply dependent upon the divisional status of the Club under embargo
Outside of a Transfer Window
  • Outside of a transfer window, Clubs can only register Out of Registration players (free agents) and Clubs can only register Out of Registration players if they have less than 16 players of Professional Standing (2x Goalkeepers, 14x Outfield Players)
  • In line with Regulation 57, Clubs can register an Emergency Goalkeeper Loan if they don’t have any Professional Goalkeepers available due to injuries, suspensions or international call-ups.
Professional Goalkeeper = a goalkeeper (excluding any Goalkeeper registered as a Non-Contract Player) who has been named in the starting eleven on five or more occasions by:
  • any Club (or Premier League club) in any matches in the relevant league or first team cup competitions (other than the EFL Trophy); and/or
  • any other club in a professional league in that club’s home association (by way of example, any division of the Scottish Professional Football League, or Serie A, B or C).
Professional Standing = is any Player who has made one first team appearance (including as a sub) for any Club in any first team competition (EFL Trophy appearances do not count).
Kelman,Woods and Maghoma all count towards our 23 that was a big miscalculation. Also it basically means we lose Oliver and Dempsey on a free transfer unless we sell them in January.Every manager in our league knows that come May any of our players are up for grabs.Unless we sell Tucker in January he will possibly be at the mercy of a tribunal.Not being able to sign a free agent could have also impacted a left back would have been useful. While I do think McKenzie has done a decent job he would have been useful in other areas during this period. There is also a possibility we could have picked up a attacking player if funds were made available by Kelman's departure.
 
We can’t sign out of contract players outside of the windows due to embargo. Other clubs can sign non contracted players.
We are maxed out already at 23 players including Kelman currently anyway.
We can’t pay loan fees, I thought we could not pay wages towards loans either but not sure about that.
I read it as in:

If QPR are paying Kelman £7k a week…
…we can’t pay a fee to secure him (even on loan, but how often do we do that?)
…Kelman cannot earn more than £7k a week.

What I mean is e.g. QPR continue paying half of his existing wages (£3.5k) and we can’t pay him anything more than £3.5k too, otherwise he’d be better off. That’s how I read it, anyway.

What I don’t get is the ‘professional standing’ bit. There’s nothing to me to suggest youth players on scholarship contracts are exempt from this, otherwise it would say ‘any player on a professional contract who has played a game’. I feel this is unfair.

That said, we’re not allowed season-long loan but I’m sure we’ve made such deals this season?
 
His style is to get in as many as he can muster and offload the ones that don’t work out. Well I think most of us could manage that model and make a half decent effort.

kettners, are we about to hear of your dramatic return to the gills?
 
I read it as in:

If QPR are paying Kelman £7k a week…
…we can’t pay a fee to secure him (even on loan, but how often do we do that?)
…Kelman cannot earn more than £7k a week.

What I mean is e.g. QPR continue paying half of his existing wages (£3.5k) and we can’t pay him anything more than £3.5k too, otherwise he’d be better off. That’s how I read it, anyway.

What I don’t get is the ‘professional standing’ bit. There’s nothing to me to suggest youth players on scholarship contracts are exempt from this, otherwise it would say ‘any player on a professional contract who has played a game’. I feel this is unfair.

That said, we’re not allowed season-long loan but I’m sure we’ve made such deals this season?
I’m pretty sure all our loan deals are window to window. If the clubs agree to extend in January they can, or if one club wants the players back then can recall them then.
I think all our loan players will go back in January apart from Cumming.
Some people have said regarding the loan players’ wages that we cannot make any contribution to them, so the loaning club are just doing it for the player to get first team football, not to save money (by splitting wages) on a player there are unlikely to use very often.
 
I’m pretty sure all our loan deals are window to window. If the clubs agree to extend in January they can, or if one club wants the players back then can recall them then.
I think all our loan players will go back in January apart from Cumming.
Some people have said regarding the loan players’ wages that we cannot make any contribution to them, so the loaning club are just doing it for the player to get first team football, not to save money (by splitting wages) on a player there are unlikely to use very often.
In the past seasons, we’ve made a modest contribution to the loan players wages.
Last year we paid £500 a week towards the loanees.
The Arsenal lads were both on huge money.
 
In the past seasons, we’ve made a modest contribution to the loan players wages.
Last year we paid £500 a week towards the loanees.
The Arsenal lads were both on huge money.
Yes, but we weren’t under the embargo last year.
It depends how you read the EFL terms, it could also be different to what it says if Scally is right in saying it’s not really an embargo. Some of the terms are confidential.
 
If we can't pay any loan fee then players like Cumming and Phillips might have other clubs trying to sign them in January? Cumming especially has been very impressive so much so that if he isn't already signed up then he is going to be hard to keep. I don't think the Championship is beyond him he certainly is good enough to play for any league one side.
 
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