MoN OUT

[mr ron]

That's just it he hasn't done anything positive apart from the sheep result, without that the small percentage of fans wanting him to stay would be even smaller. Can't see us doing anything again today, see what his tombola pulls out for a starting 11 possibly see pants at cb and grabban lb.

 

[AdebolaCornflakes]

This is a good squad with some pretty talented players. Any potential new manager would think that with 2 or 3 good additions they could have us in the top 6.

We are absolutely where we are because of our current manager's negative football, strange team selections and insistence on benching our better players.

 

[Pope John XXIII]

This is a good squad with some pretty talented players. Any potential new manager would think that with 2 or 3 good additions they could have us in the top 6.

We are absolutely where we are because of our current manager's negative football, strange team selections and insistence on benching our better players.

I agree.

Spine of the team is pretty strong

Just look at Sheffield United. I didn't see anyone who stood out for them. Goldie up front FFS.

Dawson, Yacob, Carvalho, Grabban, Lolley would all get into their first team easily and I suspect you could say the same of Leeds for most of them.

Pants has mistakes in him but statistically is actually one of the better keepers.

Problem is out wide.

Osborn, Cash, Robinson, Darikwa, Janko wouldn't get into any of the top six sides

 

[MancTrickyTree]

I agree.

Spine of the team is pretty strong

Just look at Sheffield United. I didn't see anyone who stood out for them. Goldie up front FFS.

Dawson, Yacob, Carvalho, Grabban, Lolley would all get into their first team easily and I suspect you could say the same of Leeds for most of them.

Pants has mistakes in him but statistically is actually one of the better keepers.

Problem is out wide.

Osborn, Cash, Robinson, Darikwa, Janko wouldn't get into any of the top six sides

Agree with the thrust of this but disagree on Cash and Robinson. Both have their off-days (especially Robinson’s discipline) but I think they’re excellent players who had good seasons until MON arrived.

On another subject, let’s make sure we get Worrall back in the summer. He’ll make a big difference.

With the right manager we’re very close to a promotion winning team.

 

[MancTrickyTree]

This is a good squad with some pretty talented players. Any potential new manager would think that with 2 or 3 good additions they could have us in the top 6.

We are absolutely where we are because of our current manager's negative football, strange team selections and insistence on benching our better players.

Nails it.

If your ambition was to make sure we DON’T get in the play offs you’d make all the decisions MON has made

 

[Pope John XXIII]

Agree with the thrust of this but disagree on Cash and Robinson. Both have their off-days (especially Robinson’s discipline) but I think they’re excellent players who had good seasons until MON arrived.

On another subject, let’s make sure we get Worrall back in the summer. He’ll make a big difference.

With the right manager we’re very close to a promotion winning team.

Let me clarify on those two.

Every team has players who are a little bit more average, but do the job and are pulled up by the 'special' players around them. Robinson is like that. Most promotion squad's aren't full of players that are "good enough for promotion". They have a few, with a few other players who are more average but just play very well.

I always thought Lichaj could be like that and Robbo is too.

Cash started the season superbly. He seemed to have learned where to be and was scoring goals every other week. He lost that form and the got injured, and hasn't been effective at all since. Cash has potential if he can become more consistent. If he could replicate that early season form for 2/3 of games or even half of them he would be one of the better wingers in the league. But as he is right now he wouldn't get into any of the promotion battler's sides

 

[The Poacher]

I think we’ve got lots of good players, albeit probably the squad is too big. A good manager would get this squad into the play offs and I believe AK was on course to do that no later than next season, and quite possibly this.

Losing AK was absurd, a huge error imo.

The choice of his replacement was an equally serious error.

In my view, by some distance the biggest problem we have is the manager.

I totally disagree with this, IMO I am confident in MON and Roy K WILL get us promotion next season just have a little bit of faith as I have in our manager. He really will come good, remember our last dynamic duo BC & PT. I assume outgoings and incomings will greatly enhance the squad in the coming few weeks/months.
I don't hold with the dinosaur thesis because our manager is doing things his way.
I appreciate my views are different from most posters on Vital so I suppose it will come back and bite me.
This forum is open to all and I respect ALL views from which ever direction they come from, this just happens to be mine.

 

[Hardy Forest]

I understand your feelings Hardy, but it's very difficult to blindly support a manager who isn't giving you any hope to cling too. I can't actually think of a single positive that O'Neill has brought to the team. I don't like his selections, the footballs bad, the results are worse, even the initial rise in workrate has dropped off again.
I'm an advocate of keeping managers and giving them time. In this instance I can't see time for MoN doing anything positive for the club. He won't build on what AK had got showing some promise, he's going to rip it all apart. And that's a crying shame.

He’s introduced Yates, who has by his own admission, praised him and Keane in his development.
He has brought in Benyhoun, Milo and Wague, who all look more than capable at this level.
He has brought in Pele, who also looks promising.
So, while results have been disappointing, I’m not sure why people are saying they don’t want to see him bringing in players, as the ones he has brought in so far, have been pretty good imo.

 

[Hardy Forest]

erm

Erm, this squad was 1pts off the play offs, hard to beat and capable of scoring goal. No we're mid table fodder who cannot score for toffee.

Had AK still been in charge I am sure we'd be on more points, higher up the table and still within a shout if the play offs.

MoN has taken us backwards and should not be given any time and money to further damage the club's footballing potential

I didn’t want AK sacked either!!! That’s the point I’m making! We need to be giving a manager a chance!

 

[Taylor82]

Benalouane keeps getting sent-off. Milosevic has been dropped. Wague is unconvincing. Pele could go down the Guy Moussi route and Bonatini hasn't made any impact.

 

[Hardy Forest]

Milo is injured isn’t he?

 

[Basha73]

And why would you think we would do that, when we haven't stood by a manager for the last 12 or so seasons? What makes you think it will be any different? The owners sterling record in standing by managers in Greece?
What you really mean is, until we hit upon a manager you like, then you will get all afronted when he gets sacked and start complaining about the owner then, forgetting that you were no different when it was someone you didn't like.
Hypocrites.

Sorry Hardy but this is total bollocks.

There has only been one manager I have refused to support before now and that was Mcleish because I knew he would only take us one way and that was backwards.

I didn’t want MoN despite him being one of my favourite ever players and despite loving listening to him talk. I didn’t want him because I knew his football was dour at best and I didn’t want his reputation tarnished at the club.

He said all the right things however and I was happy to give him a chance. I was desperate to see him prove me wrong and succeed.

He hasn’t. He has taken us backwards both in terms of style and results.

Big whoop he has started Yates and Appiah. Will he start them next season if he is here? Doubtful as they don’t suit the type of team he wants to build.

Yes he has brought in some decent players but we are actually playing worse and getting less points so something is obviously wrong.

With the numbers of managers we have gone through I am more than aware there is no guarantee we will get a decent manager. As Pope says it is not so much how many we go through that’s the problem, it’s the fact we keep picking poor managers.

I was happy with AK and would have backed him to have another season but it was not to be.

MoN was the wrong replacement though and I’d taking us in the wrong direction on pretty much every level.

It pains me to say he needs to go but he does.

And you know where you can shove your hypocrites comment too. Absolutely no need.

 

[DR Forest]

The MON debate is really interesting and a massively important one.
With season ticket sales and planned developments, its probably THE most important decision Mary has had to make so far.

It all depends on whether he thinks MON is the right man for the job or not. End of, because there are some basic facts-

1. if you are going to change MON then now is the time to do it;
2. we are not quick or athletic enough as a team to get promotion.
3. those with the athleticism such as yates and cash dont have the technical quality to give us the edge we need. MON addressed the physicality issue but hasnt yet addressed the quality gap thats still there.
4. Olympiacos will buy our square pegs like Carvalho so we will have funds to back a new manager.
5. Getting Karanka back (though I like him) is not the right direction- his teams are still too slow and ineffective. He was better but not the answer.

If we are going to spend money this summer then give it to someone who knows how to use it. Maybe, just maybe, the best money we might spend this summer is paying Jokanovic what he wants to come here.

And for the sentimentalists, there would only be one ex-player on the short list for me- Dougie Freedman.....

 

[Taylor82]

Why all the fuss about Jokanovic? He spent over £100m last summer, was sacked after a few months, and Fulham are relegated.

 

[Hardy Forest]

Sorry Hardy but this is total bollocks.

There has only been one manager I have refused to support before now and that was Mcleish because I knew he would only take us one way and that was backwards.

I didn’t want MoN despite him being one of my favourite ever players and despite loving listening to him talk. I didn’t want him because I knew his football was dour at best and I didn’t want his reputation tarnished at the club.

He said all the right things however and I was happy to give him a chance. I was desperate to see him prove me wrong and succeed.

He hasn’t. He has taken us backwards both in terms of style and results.

Big whoop he has started Yates and Appiah. Will he start them next season if he is here? Doubtful as they don’t suit the type of team he wants to build.

Yes he has brought in some decent players but we are actually playing worse and getting less points so something is obviously wrong.

With the numbers of managers we have gone through I am more than aware there is no guarantee we will get a decent manager. As Pope says it is not so much how many we go through that’s the problem, it’s the fact we keep picking poor managers.

I was happy with AK and would have backed him to have another season but it was not to be.

MoN was the wrong replacement though and I’d taking us in the wrong direction on pretty much every level.

It pains me to say he needs to go but he does.

And you know where you can shove your hypocrites comment too. Absolutely no need.

Bash, apologies for the hypocrites comment, you are right, there was no need, though it wasn’t just aimed at you, but our fan base in general. I was angry, frustrated and fed up. I don’t usually resort to personal comments, so please accept my apology.

I can’t agree with all your comments though. With the exception of the Ireland side (where he was limited to the players available), my memories of his football at Norwich, Leicester and Villa wasn’t dour at all. It was fast paced attacking football, down the flanks and creative midfielders. This myth that he has always played dour football, is rubbish.
AK’s first half a season here, was terrible, despite having brought in a load of players. It was worse than MW’s, who had just been sacked. He had far longer than the time you are giving MON.

 

[Calvin Plummer]

Oh he was a reject without doubt. The implications of the word in this context is usually that the club wqs wrong to do so, especially since you were in effect praising him in a blades shirt.

Just a more general point that we've had a number of players over the years that have been good enough to be part of a promotion side but for a variety of reasons, mostly self-inflicted but not always, haven't worked out here.

I didn't rate Sharp particularly...

 

[Taylor82]

Just a more general point that we've had a number of players over the years that have been good enough to be part of a promotion side but for a variety of reasons, mostly self-inflicted but not always, haven't worked out here.

I didn't rate Sharp particularly...

Billy Sharp is a goalscorer.

 

[Calvin Plummer]

He’s introduced Yates, who has by his own admission, praised him and Keane in his development.
He has brought in Benyhoun, Milo and Wague, who all look more than capable at this level.
He has brought in Pele, who also looks promising.
So, while results have been disappointing, I’m not sure why people are saying they don’t want to see him bringing in players, as the ones he has brought in so far, have been pretty good imo.

He's often played Yates out of position which I'm not sure is completely helpful for his development.

My main point would be that the three CBs you've mentioned are all largely identical. Big units with no technical ability and limited pace. Where is the balance? Which of them is capable of passing out of defence? Who sets our tempo?

 

[Calvin Plummer]

Billy Sharp is a goalscorer.

Happy to hold my hands up to being wrong.

 

[Basha73]

Bash, apologies for the hypocrites comment, you are right, there was no need, though it wasn’t just aimed at you, but our fan base in general. I was angry, frustrated and fed up. I don’t usually resort to personal comments, so please accept my apology.

I can’t agree with all your comments though. With the exception of the Ireland side (where he was limited to the players available), my memories of his football at Norwich, Leicester and Villa wasn’t dour at all. It was fast paced attacking football, down the flanks and creative midfielders. This myth that he has always played dour football, is rubbish.
AK’s first half a season here, was terrible, despite having brought in a load of players. It was worse than MW’s, who had just been sacked. He had far longer than the time you are giving MON.

No problem at all.

At Leicester and Villa the football wasn’t too bad - fast paced counter attacking.

At Sunderland and Ireland however, his two most recent jobs, the football has been agricultural at best.

I clung to the hope that Ireland was different. They didn’t have the players...

At Forest it would be different - he was taking over a side playing decent football and within striking distance of the playoffs. I wanted to give him time.

What I didn’t expect was for the quality of football to nose dive overnight.

Had we started playing like Cardiff and getting results, I would have understood it. I wouldn’t have liked it but I would have understood the motivation.

But we aren’t winning. We aren’t even drawing. He has changed the style for the worse and there is no payoff. We have tumbled down the league, playing like Rotherham and being beaten by them too.

I honestly don’t want MoNs legacy to be this but I don’t see any other option. The fans haven’t turned on him just because of the results - it’s the manner of those results.

If we give him next season we are gambling that he will turn things round and do it by playing the sort of football we would like to see. It’s a gamble too far though. There is nothing to suggest he will change his approach and the odds are, if he doesn’t start getting results, he would be out within ten games now.

Better for all concerned if he goes now.