Match Thread; Bristol City Vs Forest, Sponsored by Phillip's great innings | Page 8 | Vital Football

Match Thread; Bristol City Vs Forest, Sponsored by Phillip's great innings

seasider red said:
Agree with the above comments about making team hard to beat. It does however involve more than just defending in numbers, if the opposition know they only have to score one to have a very good chance of winning then you are not difficult to beat.
Carrying an attacking threat has to come in to it otherwise the opposing team know they can throw everything forward without having to worry too much about leaving their defence exposed
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I don’t think anyone thinks otherwise but compared to where we were this is a very good base to build from and represents real progress.
 
we need a beast of a striker and we will rip this division to pieces...unless that happens we will be counting on 1 nil wins and count on the defence to keep clean sheets ... but the latter is not the way to win promotion ...
 
MaltaRed said:
we need a beast of a striker and we will rip this division to pieces...unless that happens we will be counting on 1 nil wins and count on the defence to keep clean sheets ... but the latter is not the way to win promotion ...
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Winning 1-0 is precisely how the best teams win Championships. Look at Man Utd, Liverpool and even Forest in their heydays. It wasn’t the thumping wins that won the trophies but the scrappy 1-0s when the team wasn’t playing well.

I don’t disagree that we need the players in to give us a consistent goal threat but saying that winning 1-0 and counting on the defence won’t win you Championships is wrong.
 
Basha73 said:
Winning 1-0 is precisely how the best teams win Championships. Look at Man Utd, Liverpool and even Forest in their heydays. It wasn’t the thumping wins that won the trophies but the scrappy 1-0s when the team wasn’t playing well.

I don’t disagree that we need the players in to give us a consistent goal threat but saying that winning 1-0 and counting on the defence won’t win you Championships is wrong.
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Agreed lots of games are won by the odd goal probably even most games, but you have to carry that attacking threat, so the opposition know they are always in a game and can't take liberties
 
seasider red said:
Agreed lots of games are won by the odd goal probably even most games, but you have to carry that attacking threat, so the opposition know they are always in a game and can't take liberties
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Even Liverpool last season were built on a solid defence. They blew lots of teams away but that overshadowed the games where they relied on their defence to keep teams out and then snatched a goal.

Man Utd under Fergie were masters of it.
 
As pleasing as it is that we’ve put together a string of results that’s seen us pretty much safe now, in my opinion yesterday Hughton had precious little to turn to from the bench.

When he turns to his bench he wants to see one or two that can come on and make a difference. When he sees that his main attacking threat is Freeman and Taylor, you have to feel for him a bit.

As already mentioned, he’s got the defence pretty much spot on, although I doubt very much that Worrall will be with us next season. So it’s not all doom and gloom and if we somehow manage to recruit well this summer, next season looks more promising. I’m not Hughton’s biggest fan on what we’ve had so far this season, but the bloke knows how to get out of this division. And I doubt Marinakis could realistically get much better.

Season is over. In early April. For a team that costs a heck of a lot of money. It’s poor, very poor. And sadly our poor recruitment means we’ve got a little bit of deadwood to clear again, for the 22nd season running!
 
PVH said:
As pleasing as it is that we’ve put together a string of results that’s seen us pretty much safe now, in my opinion yesterday Hughton had precious little to turn to from the bench.

When he turns to his bench he wants to see one or two that can come on and make a difference. When he sees that his main attacking threat is Freeman and Taylor, you have to feel for him a bit.

As already mentioned, he’s got the defence pretty much spot on, although I doubt very much that Worrall will be with us next season. So it’s not all doom and gloom and if we somehow manage to recruit well this summer, next season looks more promising. I’m not Hughton’s biggest fan on what we’ve had so far this season, but the bloke knows how to get out of this division. And I doubt Marinakis could realistically get much better.

Season is over. In early April. For a team that costs a heck of a lot of money. It’s poor, very poor. And sadly our poor recruitment means we’ve got a little bit of deadwood to clear again, for the 22nd season running!
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Absolutely.

In goal, defence and central midfield he had options even if some aren’t ideal but in the forward positions we don’t really have anyone who can turn a game around.

Thsts not down to Hughton and is something he has had to work around. I know he has never been a great user if substitutes but when he looks at our bench he must despair.

It has been far from an inspiring season, pretty much a total failure in fact but if Hughton is backed I think he will do what he has always done and at least have us fighting for promotion. It may not always be the prettiest but it will be effective.
 
I’m not sure I agree that we don’t have options from the bench. I would agree that those options haven’t lived up to the hype this season, but we can’t call having Knockaert, Taylor, Lolley and Freeman for most weeks before the last couple as ‘not having players who can change a game’.

If somebody said they’d be your bench at the beginning of the season, you’d probably have suspected we’d got promoted or certainly that we’d be vying for it this season, because all those players have been game changers or frankly starters for the last few years. Why aren’t they now?

Not saying it’s Hughtons fault, but I’m not convinced that good players suddenly go bad overnight. I’d also add that Hughton never ever turns to his bench to know if they’d make a difference. He brings players on far too late and usually always the wrong option.

Whether that’s him sending a message I don’t know, but if he gets the chance to add his own players in next season , I’d hope what does improve is his ability to utilize his subs when the game clearly demands it.
 
MaltaRed said:
we need a beast of a striker and we will rip this division to pieces...unless that happens we will be counting on 1 nil wins and count on the defence to keep clean sheets ... but the latter is not the way to win promotion ...
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It's how the wee bastart got the worst team in history promoted.
 
Will.NFFC said:
I’m not sure I agree that we don’t have options from the bench. I would agree that those options haven’t lived up to the hype this season, but we can’t call having Knockaert, Taylor, Lolley and Freeman for most weeks before the last couple as ‘not having players who can change a game’.

If somebody said they’d be your bench at the beginning of the season, you’d probably have suspected we’d got promoted or certainly that we’d be vying for it this season, because all those players have been game changers or frankly starters for the last few years. Why aren’t they now?

Not saying it’s Hughtons fault, but I’m not convinced that good players suddenly go bad overnight. I’d also add that Hughton never ever turns to his bench to know if they’d make a difference. He brings players on far too late and usually always the wrong option.

Whether that’s him sending a message I don’t know, but if he gets the chance to add his own players in next season , I’d hope what does improve is his ability to utilize his subs when the game clearly demands it.
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How many of those have come on and changed a game. Cant remember any.
 
Will.NFFC said:
How many have come on with enough time to change the game?
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How many have done enough over the course of a full game to show that they can make a difference?

These were supposedly quality players who, even if we are being kind, have done largely fuck all. Given that, it’s no surprise that they haven’t done anything when brought on from the bench. Lack of time doesn’t really come into it.
 
Will.NFFC said:
I’m not sure I agree that we don’t have options from the bench. I would agree that those options haven’t lived up to the hype this season, but we can’t call having Knockaert, Taylor, Lolley and Freeman for most weeks before the last couple as ‘not having players who can change a game’.

If somebody said they’d be your bench at the beginning of the season, you’d probably have suspected we’d got promoted or certainly that we’d be vying for it this season, because all those players have been game changers or frankly starters for the last few years. Why aren’t they now?

Not saying it’s Hughtons fault, but I’m not convinced that good players suddenly go bad overnight. I’d also add that Hughton never ever turns to his bench to know if they’d make a difference. He brings players on far too late and usually always the wrong option.

Whether that’s him sending a message I don’t know, but if he gets the chance to add his own players in next season , I’d hope what does improve is his ability to utilize his subs when the game clearly demands it.
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But the players you mention, Will, have not gone bad overnight.

Lolley was far from at his best last season as well; there might be mitigating reasons why his form dropped last season and the hangover from that could well have carried over to this season.

There is no question that his performances this season have not warranted a place in the side, but at least he was displaying determination and signs of getting back to his best before his injury struck.

I certainly would not be writing him off for next season.

Freeman only played 11 games for the Blades last season and struggled to break into their side; he arrived here with an injury, the injury was misdiagnosed and eventually needed an operation.

Allowing him to play his way back to fitness was never on the cards and he has struggled to hold down a place since.

Missing a large part of the season does not make him a bad player; if we could get him for the right price and on the right wages I would take him.

Knockheart has been hugely disappointing since he arrived and has not deserved his place in the side; he just has to be better than what we have seen so far, but on the basis of what we have seen I would not buy him with forged money.

If Knockheart has been disappointing, Taylor has been a complete waste of time; he has not displayed the slightest interest in fitting into the side or playing for the team, he just coasts through games waiting for a chance.

As for his substitutions; he is obviously doing what he thinks is right, and if moving the team from bottom 4 to mid table is anything to go by, he has been quite correct in what he has been doing.

If you go back a few Months, some people were describing him as insane because he was doing the same thing repeatedly; he turned out to be correct on that one as well.

Hughton will turn out to be very good for this Club, and despite a few supporters in Norwich and Brighton, there are still plenty of supporters at other Clubs who would have him as manager tomorrow.

You might not be aware of it, but there are a good few Bristol City supporters who regret him not being appointed as manager and would dearly like him to be so.

I was reading through the comments of the oppositions supporters last night and they would love him at Ashton Gate.
 
Basha73 said:
How many have done enough over the course of a full game to show that they can make a difference?

These were supposedly quality players who, even if we are being kind, have done largely fuck all. Given that, it’s no surprise that they haven’t done anything when brought on from the bench. Lack of time doesn’t really come into it.
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But at one stage, none of the 11 were playing well on the pitch. Every match thread we’d say ‘we need to change something because we’re awful and the games running away’, but we’d never see it until it was too late.

I’m not defending the performances of these players who’ve been poor, but equally, the manager can’t be exempt from criticism. These are good players who you’d expect a good manager to get more out of, or at least show dynamism if the game isn’t going well. I haven’t yet seen him display his ability to ‘change it up’.
 
mao tse tung said:
But the players you mention, Will, have not gone bad overnight.

Lolley was far from at his best last season as well; there might be mitigating reasons why his form dropped last season and the hangover from that could well have carried over to this season.

There is no question that his performances this season have not warranted a place in the side, but at least he was displaying determination and signs of getting back to his best before his injury struck.

I certainly would not be writing him off for next season.

Freeman only played 11 games for the Blades last season and struggled to break into their side; he arrived here with an injury, the injury was misdiagnosed and eventually needed an operation.

Allowing him to play his way back to fitness was never on the cards and he has struggled to hold down a place since.

Missing a large part of the season does not make him a bad player; if we could get him for the right price and on the right wages I would take him.

Knockheart has been hugely disappointing since he arrived and has not deserved his place in the side; he just has to be better than what we have seen so far, but on the basis of what we have seen I would not buy him with forged money.

If Knockheart has been disappointing, Taylor has been a complete waste of time; he has not displayed the slightest interest in fitting into the side or playing for the team, he just coasts through games waiting for a chance.

As for his substitutions; he is obviously doing what he thinks is right, and if moving the team from bottom 4 to mid table is anything to go by, he has been quite correct in what he has been doing.

If you go back a few Months, some people were describing him as insane because he was doing the same thing repeatedly; he turned out to be correct on that one as well.

Hughton will turn out to be very good for this Club, and despite a few supporters in Norwich and Brighton, there are still plenty of supporters at other Clubs who would have him as manager tomorrow.

You might not be aware of it, but there are a good few Bristol City supporters who regret him not being appointed as manager and would dearly like him to be so.

I was reading through the comments of the oppositions supporters last night and they would love him at Ashton Gate.
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It’s not that I don’t want Hughton to do well and I certainly am more positive now than I was about him a few months ago. From a league position point of view, we’re in a much healthier state but I maintain that he hasn’t got the best out of this team that somebody of his pedigree could have.

He’s got some excellent players at his disposal and I think whilst I’m pleased he’s moved us near safety, given he took over after 4 games (4 terrible games and in bad form I give you), he would have been a total disaster had he taken us down.

I think we’ll know next season whether he’s the man. I don’t want to be unfair and judge somebody on what’s clearly been a bad summer and start to the year.

In regards to Lolley, I would never write him off - still our best player overall, but I disagree with his form last season. 9 goals, 9 assists last year is still a good return for a winger. If he can come to form next year with Mighten emerging and Ameobi singing a new deal, we’ll have a really good defence and wide men.

Midfield and striker signings will be critical to how we progress next year.
 
Will.NFFC said:
It’s not that I don’t want Hughton to do well and I certainly am more positive now than I was about him a few months ago. From a league position point of view, we’re in a much healthier state but I maintain that he hasn’t got the best out of this team that somebody of his pedigree could have.

He’s got some excellent players at his disposal and I think whilst I’m pleased he’s moved us near safety, given he took over after 4 games (4 terrible games and in bad form I give you), he would have been a total disaster had he taken us down.

I think we’ll know next season whether he’s the man. I don’t want to be unfair and judge somebody on what’s clearly been a bad summer and start to the year.

In regards to Lolley, I would never write him off - still our best player overall, but I disagree with his form last season. 9 goals, 9 assists last year is still a good return for a winger. If he can come to form next year with Mighten emerging and Ameobi singing a new deal, we’ll have a really good defence and wide men.

Midfield and striker signings will be critical to how we progress next year.
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Just out of interest chap what tune do they have to sing for their deal or can they choose any song they like? Cheers chap.
 
Will.NFFC said:
But at one stage, none of the 11 were playing well on the pitch. Every match thread we’d say ‘we need to change something because we’re awful and the games running away’, but we’d never see it until it was too late.

I’m not defending the performances of these players who’ve been poor, but equally, the manager can’t be exempt from criticism. These are good players who you’d expect a good manager to get more out of, or at least show dynamism if the game isn’t going well. I haven’t yet seen him display his ability to ‘change it up’.
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And yet Mighten and Christie have improved and Garner and Krov managed to hit the ground running.

A manager can only improve players who want to improve and I am not convinced that some of them do.

Give Hughton a degree of free reign in the close season and I would be shocked if we weren’t challenging at least for the prayoffs next season.
 
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