Manchester City v Aston Villa Match Thread - Wed 20th Jan @ 6pm | Page 36 | Vital Football

Manchester City v Aston Villa Match Thread - Wed 20th Jan @ 6pm

I haven't watched it back, but from first glance it seemed like he turned his body to play back past the player, I'll have to look at it again.
He should gave just got rid of it. He gave moss the opportunity of playing it on. He could have cost us the palace game as well.He thinks he's Beckenbauer at times when a Hause hoof would have done.
 
McGinn out for Saturday. Barkley goes missing.

Barkley plays better when he plays deeper, happened in another match of ours and McGinn and Barkley basically decided to switch positions and it worked, Barkley said that in an interview.

Perhaps El Ghazi on the left, Traore on the right, Grealish in the middle with Barkley partnering Luiz whilst McGinn is out for the match and see what happens, It means Barkley can find Grealish and perhaps play it between them up the field, spray it out wide and both get into better positions to support Watkins.
 
Mings could have headed that clear and past the halfway line rather than inviting pressure onto an already pressurised situation following Martinez's poor clearance . Poor decision making from a lack of experience at this level against this level of opponent . Frustrating

Indeed he could have but thats not the question. If everyone does not suddenly become onside if a goalie parries a ball. How was that onside last night? He was offside when Mings chested it. Im struggling to see a difference?
 
Barkley has been out for quite a long time and his first game back is against one of the very best teams. I think he'll once again become vital once he's properly match fit.
 
He should gave just got rid of it. He gave moss the opportunity of playing it on. He could have cost us the palace game as well.He thinks he's Beckenbauer at times when a Hause hoof would have done.

IMO this is a hindsight thing, as a glutton for punishment I've rewatched it quite a lot. Mings looks over his shoulder, he knows Rodri is there and by the rules, 99% of us understand if he comes and tackles Mings it's offside. For whatever reason, the rules suddenly aren't black and white now. Apparently, this grey area has been in existence for decades but somehow this phase of play has never happened before (it fucking has, it's always offside).

To your point, if a defender see's a player behind him now he has to just clear it or let it go. The latter is very dangerous.

They've reconstituted what "receives" means that word now includes miscontrolling/tackling. That is my biggest bone of contention. Any Villa fan who used to read that rule probably thinks of the goal Ashley Young scored against Everton in the 3-2 at Goodison. As the defender deliberating plays the ball and Ashley Young receives it in an offside position.

That's what that rule means and they know it. We need and we probably will see something happen in a month's time that will be given and then we'll see them fabricate a new reason why it was different. At some point, they'll get caught out. It'll happen again at the end of the season.

Dean will probably tell Ollie to just do this now. Stand offside by a yard, wait for them to control it and then tackle them.
 
He played central for most of December and we played fantastic football. He pulls more strings from the centre but may produce less fantasy football points.

I think it depends on the game, opposition, and how the game just generally plays out. Against good sides, I want him wider creating chances on the break, as he will also be in congested space. Against lesser sides, he could play in the middle, number 10 or just float. Iā€™ve no problem with jack following the play as long as someone behind him is prepared to give us shape.
 
I am a bit bemused about the stick Mings is getting lately. Seems that if he doesn't play like Moore and Beckenbauer rolled into one eery game it's not good enough.

He may not be them , but he is still a very good centre half.
I thought he was immense last night did mostly what he's great at defend.
 
My views:

1. I thought and still believe it is offside but I am slowly getting to the stage where I can understand why the law has been interpreted as it has been in this instance. Mings isn't actually tackled, he plays the ball and Rodri blocks it, but it's extremely tight (took a few views for me to be sure) so you can suggest he has received it but I'd find it hard to say that or for anyone else to do that. Likewise, be has controlled it already with his chest trap (rhetoric question: how many touches are defenders allowed in such a scenario?), more on that later.

2. The 'challenges for the ball' line earlier in the law, that some like @mike_field, @david-avfc, @overlookedvillan and @Villa 4 Ever have mentioned isn't relevant as that comes in when the last touch is from the 'attacking' team or City in this instance. It's why it's not being mentioned anywhere as the line being shared is the one relevant to the situation, due to Mings' chest trap and touch/pass(?). Likewise, @Old Trinity Villan your questions on a keeper making a save, that's another exemption in the law to invoke offside.

3. Mings trying to take the ball down isn't a mistake, I'm not having that @Silhillvilla or @robbali. We clearly, all season, have tried to get the ball down, play and be effective in possession. In that scenario, Mings thinks he has no pressure coming on him as that ball approaches him, so he shouldn't just give it back to City to let them attack us again, but actually give us a break. The critique you could say is the chest trap. As replays have shown, he checks his right shoulder to see Rodri, so to me, the chest trap should have actually been angled off to the left so the play could move that way and ensure he is between ball and opponent if Rodri gets involved in the new phase of play.

4. I think I'm in the minority, but I thought it was fair cop for the penalty. I'd be disappointed if it wasn't awarded our way. Might be a shortish distance but he sees the header (ie. not blind to it) and the arm was high and wide.
 
My views:

1. I thought and still believe it is offside but I am slowly getting to the stage where I can understand why the law has been interpreted as it has been in this instance. Mings isn't actually tackled, he plays the ball and Rodri blocks it, but it's extremely tight (took a few views for me to be sure) so you can suggest he has received it but I'd find it hard to say that or for anyone else to do that. Likewise, be has controlled it already with his chest trap (rhetoric question: how many touches are defenders allowed in such a scenario?), more on that later.

2. The 'challenges for the ball' line earlier in the law, that some like @mike_field, @david-avfc, @overlookedvillan and @Villa 4 Ever have mentioned isn't relevant as that comes in when the last touch is from the 'attacking' team or City in this instance. It's why it's not being mentioned anywhere as the line being shared is the one relevant to the situation, due to Mings' chest trap and touch/pass(?). Likewise, @Old Trinity Villan your questions on a keeper making a save, that's another exemption in the law to invoke offside.

3. Mings trying to take the ball down isn't a mistake, I'm not having that @Silhillvilla or @robbali. We clearly, all season, have tried to get the ball down, play and be effective in possession. In that scenario, Mings thinks he has no pressure coming on him as that ball approaches him, so he shouldn't just give it back to City to let them attack us again, but actually give us a break. The critique you could say is the chest trap. As replays have shown, he checks his right shoulder to see Rodri, so to me, the chest trap should have actually been angled off to the left so the play could move that way and ensure he is between ball and opponent if Rodri gets involved in the new phase of play.

4. I think I'm in the minority, but I thought it was fair cop for the penalty. I'd be disappointed if it wasn't awarded our way. Might be a shortish distance but he sees the header (ie. not blind to it) and the arm was high and wide.

I agree with all of that Tierney. Re: Item #1 I get it but I also think it's bollocks. I am ambivalent about the penalty, it almost takes away from the real story. Even though I get it I am also flabbergasted that it still wasn't flagged for offside. IMO they're bending the rules to fit reality.

I am convinced if we were locked in a room with them for an hour it would be an incredibly uncomfortable hour and they'd fight tooth and nail to show they were right. They've no interest in being wrong.

It would be great to see us make a farce of it by trying to get Ollie into a position like that where they call him offside.
 
My views:

1. I thought and still believe it is offside but I am slowly getting to the stage where I can understand why the law has been interpreted as it has been in this instance. Mings isn't actually tackled, he plays the ball and Rodri blocks it, but it's extremely tight (took a few views for me to be sure) so you can suggest he has received it but I'd find it hard to say that or for anyone else to do that. Likewise, be has controlled it already with his chest trap (rhetoric question: how many touches are defenders allowed in such a scenario?), more on that later.

2. The 'challenges for the ball' line earlier in the law, that some like @mike_field, @david-avfc, @overlookedvillan and @Villa 4 Ever have mentioned isn't relevant as that comes in when the last touch is from the 'attacking' team or City in this instance. It's why it's not being mentioned anywhere as the line being shared is the one relevant to the situation, due to Mings' chest trap and touch/pass(?). Likewise, @Old Trinity Villan your questions on a keeper making a save, that's another exemption in the law to invoke offside.

3. Mings trying to take the ball down isn't a mistake, I'm not having that @Silhillvilla or @robbali. We clearly, all season, have tried to get the ball down, play and be effective in possession. In that scenario, Mings thinks he has no pressure coming on him as that ball approaches him, so he shouldn't just give it back to City to let them attack us again, but actually give us a break. The critique you could say is the chest trap. As replays have shown, he checks his right shoulder to see Rodri, so to me, the chest trap should have actually been angled off to the left so the play could move that way and ensure he is between ball and opponent if Rodri gets involved in the new phase of play.

4. I think I'm in the minority, but I thought it was fair cop for the penalty. I'd be disappointed if it wasn't awarded our way. Might be a shortish distance but he sees the header (ie. not blind to it) and the arm was high and wide.

I see what you're thinking, and while you may be in the minority here, the world of football seems to agree with you.

I do not though. IMO the rule quoted is being misused and is not intended for this purpose.

In interpreting the rules in this way the game has been brought into disrepute when the officials could easily have done what IFAB expect referees to do, and make a decision within the ā€œspiritā€ of the game, by saying Rodri challenged for the ball (it looks to me like did - but each to their own!).

In this I think everyone in football will agree, unless you're a contrarian asshole that is.
 
Even if you take out 'challenging' Tierney it still leaves the remainder of interfering with-

interfering with an opponent by:
preventing an opponent from playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponentā€™s line of vision or
challenging an opponent for the ball or
clearly attempting to play a ball which is close when this action impacts on an opponent or
making an obvious action which clearly impacts on the ability of an opponent to play the ball
 
It would be great to see us make a farce of it by trying to get Ollie into a position like that where they call him offside.

I propositioned with others last night that it's the next evolution of the pressing game. Opposition have ball, striker makes no effort to come onside, rest of team press to force it to necessary defender, ensure that defender has time to take a touch but allows striker try to win it for the onrushing team-mates to collect and head towards goal.