Knife crime epidemic | Page 6 | Vital Football

Knife crime epidemic

LancsGordoRoad

Vital 1st Team Regular
There`ll be many in the police hoping for torrential rain tonight and tomorrow night. The climate on the street, in so many ways, is currently finely balanced and it won`t take much at all for a repeat of the rioting scenes we saw a few years ago.

For crying out loud, people need to stop taking knives out with them. The amount of lethal stabbing is on a fairly steep upward curve right now and the immediate outlook is worrying. There`s a lot of grim disorder going on out there at present, far more than the few that MSM show on the evening news.

Once again, an unarmed police officer is fighting for his life after tackling a knife wielding attacker, this time in Glasgow. Circumstances not clear at present but seems to have been a dispute between a resident and staff in a city centre hotel, resulting in multiple stabbings.

I have a bad feeling about the direction and growing extent of violent behaviour in our nation. Having been around this sort of thing for a long time I can`t remember ever feeling as concerned as I do currently. It`s a fact that police are already severely over-stretched, there`s no magic supply of police waiting in the wings. If the nation allows itself to keep slipping further down the slippery slope to lawlessness then there are some grim consequences awaiting us.

Sorry to sound like a doom-monger, but the knife crime epidemic, as per the thread title, is becoming just that, an epidemic. Knives belong in the kitchen, for goodness sake, let`s keep them there.
 

Gills 58

Vital 1st Team Regular
Agree. Seriously concerned about how badly it is going to kick off, particùlarly in London. I am aware there is a critical shortage of police to carry out normal duties in London at present because of dealing with these street raves/partues and the accompanying violence.
 

LancsGordoRoad

Vital 1st Team Regular
Agree. Seriously concerned about how badly it is going to kick off, particùlarly in London. I am aware there is a critical shortage of police to carry out normal duties in London at present because of dealing with these street raves/partues and the accompanying violence.
Yes. They (London`s Met) will implement mutual aid as it gets worse (if they haven`t already) but that leaves forces around London even more threadbare... Torrential rain will help - anyone know how to do the dance ?
 

LSB2

Vital 1st Team Regular
Yes. They (London`s Met) will implement mutual aid as it gets worse (if they haven`t already) but that leaves forces around London even more threadbare... Torrential rain will help - anyone know how to do the dance ?
If the rain doesn't come, call the fire brigade...
 
Last edited:

Nobby_66

Vital 1st Team Regular
There`ll be many in the police hoping for torrential rain tonight and tomorrow night. The climate on the street, in so many ways, is currently finely balanced and it won`t take much at all for a repeat of the rioting scenes we saw a few years ago.

For crying out loud, people need to stop taking knives out with them. The amount of lethal stabbing is on a fairly steep upward curve right now and the immediate outlook is worrying. There`s a lot of grim disorder going on out there at present, far more than the few that MSM show on the evening news.

Once again, an unarmed police officer is fighting for his life after tackling a knife wielding attacker, this time in Glasgow. Circumstances not clear at present but seems to have been a dispute between a resident and staff in a city centre hotel, resulting in multiple stabbings.

I have a bad feeling about the direction and growing extent of violent behaviour in our nation. Having been around this sort of thing for a long time I can`t remember ever feeling as concerned as I do currently. It`s a fact that police are already severely over-stretched, there`s no magic supply of police waiting in the wings. If the nation allows itself to keep slipping further down the slippery slope to lawlessness then there are some grim consequences awaiting us.

Sorry to sound like a doom-monger, but the knife crime epidemic, as per the thread title, is becoming just that, an epidemic. Knives belong in the kitchen, for goodness sake, let`s keep them there.
Agree with all of that and had pretty much that exact conversation with Mrs Nobby about an hour ago.
I don't mind admitting that there have been moments in my career when I have experienced true fear but these moments are fleeting and soon recede once an incident is over.
What I'm feeling now is a more long term fear for my colleagues, family and the public in general. Unless politicians, chief constables and commissioners all start singing from the same song sheet (as well as listening to the PCs on the ground) I really can't see all this ending well.
 

The pledge

Vital Reserves Team
saw that interview with an ex copper. The police have practically given up trying to stop young black kids from carrying knives. There are so many. He refers to so many single black women having had kids with no father around to influence their upbringing.
 

Gills 58

Vital 1st Team Regular
Yes. They (London`s Met) will implement mutual aid as it gets worse (if they haven`t already) but that leaves forces around London even more threadbare... Torrential rain will help - anyone know how to do the dance ?
Not quite resorted to mutual aid yet, but close.

3 known dead in Glasgow attack although media reporting only one at present. Don't know if this includes the perpetrator who was apparently shot dead.
 

Gills 58

Vital 1st Team Regular
Agree with all of that and had pretty much that exact conversation with Mrs Nobby about an hour ago.
I don't mind admitting that there have been moments in my career when I have experienced true fear but these moments are fleeting and soon recede once an incident is over.
What I'm feeling now is a more long term fear for my colleagues, family and the public in general. Unless politicians, chief constables and commissioners all start singing from the same song sheet (as well as listening to the PCs on the ground) I really can't see all this ending well.
Getting the same message from my contact nobby. So many on aid that response teams are dangerously short handed and at risk.
 

Nobby_66

Vital 1st Team Regular
Of the rain doesn't come, call the fire brigade...
You know what? There were disapproving mutterings when, as Mayor, Boris bought a number of water cannons. The govt (May) caved in and sold them at a loss. If used correctly these are a great tool in mass disorder situations but do not fit with consent policing.
As I said on another thread, it's time the public decided what they want the police to do but i will say that if the status quo remains, you won't have a police service at all. No one is joining and officers are leaving in droves because they are being lead by management who worry more about complaints for being heavy handed than they do about the safety of their officers. Who would want to join an organisation like that?
 

Nobby_66

Vital 1st Team Regular
Getting the same message from my contact nobby. So many on aid that response teams are dangerously short handed and at risk.
Plus, I'm guessing, your contact is losing rest days so the stress of the job, plus no rest, is causing massive problems with physical and mental health. (Not sure if you're aware but 1 in 5 officers are known to suffer from PTSD. I personally think it's a lot higher but there is a fear within the job, especially within firearms, that to be diagnosed will lead to loss of some skills).
 

Gills 58

Vital 1st Team Regular
Plus, I'm guessing, your contact is losing rest days so the stress of the job, plus no rest, is causing massive problems with physical and mental health. (Not sure if you're aware but 1 in 5 officers are known to suffer from PTSD. I personally think it's a lot higher but there is a fear within the job, especially within firearms, that to be diagnosed will lead to loss of some skills).
Yes. Just done 7 days. Crashed out next to me as I text. Looks knackered. Hard to sleep anyway in this weather, especially as the modern shift pattern is 2 earlies, 2 lates and 2 nights, constant change of when one is available to sleep. Living with permanent jet lag.

At least my contact knows they are doing something worthwhile and holds their head up.
 

LSB2

Vital 1st Team Regular
You know what? There were disapproving mutterings when, as Mayor, Boris bought a number of water cannons. The govt (May) caved in and sold them at a loss. If used correctly these are a great tool in mass disorder situations but do not fit with consent policing.
As I said on another thread, it's time the public decided what they want the police to do but i will say that if the status quo remains, you won't have a police service at all. No one is joining and officers are leaving in droves because they are being lead by management who worry more about complaints for being heavy handed than they do about the safety of their officers. Who would want to join an organisation like that?
The majority are pro police though :-)
Too many making decisions who have never been an officer... There needs to be more promotions from within, and stop the politicians making the job of the police impossible. I could have a rant about how we got to this situation, but the lilies will start defending the criminals... lol
 

Jerryattrick

Vital 1st Team Regular
I have been moaning on and on about this for years.

The main problem is that for years the media and politicians have not seen kids being killed on the streets as an issue. All problems become massive if not nipped in the bud.

Then we have the party of law and order removing border force, home office and 20,000 police officers.
Unless this is handled now it will blow up. This is both a good and bad time.
On the plus side this can be seen as controlling the virus spread.
On the minus time we dont want the blm hangers on to use this as an excuse for anti social behaviour

Personally I would go on a massive anti knife, anti virus spread initiative with metal detectors used at major shops, bus and rail terminals as a minimum. This would be for the general public so no discrimination.
Government and media need to be on the front foot with the propoganda this time.

In the big 1981 brixton riots it was a backlash against the policing of the SPG, that excuse has completely gone and anything kicking off is simple ant social behaviour and must be crushed along with accepting of anyone carrying a knife.
 

LancsGordoRoad

Vital 1st Team Regular
Hard to sleep anyway in this weather, especially as the modern shift pattern is 2 earlies, 2 lates and 2 nights, constant change of when one is available to sleep. Living with permanent jet lag.

Are those shifts 8 or 10 hour shifts ? Either way, shift work of that type really does mess up the body clock. There have been lots of experimental shift systems in the police over the years but, at the end of the day (so to speak) shift work is shift work and it`s not kind on sleeping cycles. Hope your contact has a good weekend off - assuming the next few days are rest days. There was a time, in the Met, when regular patrol officers were obliged to work three of their eight rest days per month - due to lack of resource. I speak of the seventies when getting six days off a month was luxury !!!! ;)
 

Jerryattrick

Vital 1st Team Regular
If you are caught carrying a gun or knife - 30 years no questions asked.
The problem at present is knives. The laws can be tightened up but the bigger issue is that people do not believe they will get caught.
Currently we have drug dogs on the train stations.

If the government treat it as the epidemic it is then it could be eradicated.
It should be reported on every day and money and resources poured into it, metal detectors can be used in large numbers much the same as ppe, etc.
 

shotshy

Vital 1st Team Regular
Are those shifts 8 or 10 hour shifts ? Either way, shift work of that type really does mess up the body clock. There have been lots of experimental shift systems in the police over the years but, at the end of the day (so to speak) shift work is shift work and it`s not kind on sleeping cycles. Hope your contact has a good weekend off - assuming the next few days are rest days. There was a time, in the Met, when regular patrol officers were obliged to work three of their eight rest days per month - due to lack of resource. I speak of the seventies when getting six days off a month was luxury !!!! ;)
When I was a civil servant, I loathed doing nights .
One of my colleagues loved it so we regularly used to swap, with permission.
Nights attracted a bit more money but not enough for me to like it . zzzzzzzzz
 

Gills 58

Vital 1st Team Regular
Are those shifts 8 or 10 hour shifts ? Either way, shift work of that type really does mess up the body clock. There have been lots of experimental shift systems in the police over the years but, at the end of the day (so to speak) shift work is shift work and it`s not kind on sleeping cycles. Hope your contact has a good weekend off - assuming the next few days are rest days. There was a time, in the Met, when regular patrol officers were obliged to work three of their eight rest days per month - due to lack of resource. I speak of the seventies when getting six days off a month was luxury !!!! ;)
Earlies 8
Lates and nights 9
Weekend shifts 10
Plus 30 mins early start to get ready + shifts regularly overruning.
Plus fewer/no perks, eg re housing and no chance of free driving lessons that my neighbour got in the 80's. Biggin Hill was known as Truncheon Alley as it was the furthest out one could go and receive housing assustance.
 

Nobby_66

Vital 1st Team Regular
When I was a civil servant, I loathed doing nights .
One of my colleagues loved it so we regularly used to swap, with permission.
Nights attracted a bit more money but not enough for me to like it . zzzzzzzzz
Nights are alright if that's all you work (I did permanent nights in an old job and loved it). I find its the constant change of shifts that f***s me up. We do 12 hour shifts, 2 or 3 days followed by 2 or 3 nights then 4 rest days (2 or 3 if which we have to work).
I regularly have to ask what day of the week it is 🤪