Keown; Jose's time's been and gone... | Page 4 | Vital Football

Keown; Jose's time's been and gone...

I tend to agree that on paper our squad is every bit as good as Leicester's. Perez, as an example, is nowhere near the calibre of a top four player in my assessment. It's not however always about the individual quality of the players is it. Team spirit and commitment can carry a team a long way, and add to that, Brendan Rodgers has made all the difference between Leicester being a mid table versus top four team. On team spirit, commitment and managerial impact, we come nowhere close currently.

Nicely put. I can see why Rodgers was apparently approached about our managerial position. They've been lucky with injuries but he has knitted them together well.

It will be interesting to see whether they can sustain the threat of losing key players, deal with the additional fixtures next season and cope with a few key squad players advancing into their thirties (Vardy, Evans, Fuchs, Morgan, Albrighton etc). Throw in a few injuries and all of a sudden it feels similar to us.
 
I dont have much expectation with our current injury situation. It doesn't add up. We have 3 key players out long term with no back ups. We lost Eriksen and got no replacement like for like. Davies is back but is not good enough anyway. Rose has gone, KWP gone. At present we are in bad shape , there is no dressing it up , no point pretending we can battle through it and play expansive attractive football. Then there is the crazy schedule of games 3 in 7, 4 in 10 coming up. Our signings continue to fall short of the quality required. Ndombele, Sessegnon, Gedson and Clarke are not contributing, Loco is ok but no Eriksen ( yet anyway ) maybe never.
The numbers don't add up and it's no good hoping there is a secret formula which will make them work. Jose has an impossible task.
Forget ‘expansive’ football, just modern football 101 should be the norm.
 
Nicely put. I can see why Rodgers was apparently approached about our managerial position. They've been lucky with injuries but he has knitted them together well.

It will be interesting to see whether they can sustain the threat of losing key players, deal with the additional fixtures next season and cope with a few key squad players advancing into their thirties (Vardy, Evans, Fuchs, Morgan, Albrighton etc). Throw in a few injuries and all of a sudden it feels similar to us.
You could argue that they are already feeling the strain of a few injuries and their exertions in the Carabao Cup. They've taken 12 points from their last 11 league games which is relegation form really. With that form it's crazy that they still have such a buffer between them and fifth-placed United.
 
Last season we lost 20 competitive games. This season we have lost 13. Will no doubt be close to 20 again before the end of the season.

Compare that with the scouse who have only lost 10 competitive games in the same time frame.

We are a bang average side. Sacking a proven winner isn't going to change that fact.
 
Last season we lost 20 competitive games. This season we have lost 13. Will no doubt be close to 20 again before the end of the season.

Compare that with the scouse who have only lost 10 competitive games in the same time frame.

We are a bang average side. Sacking a proven winner isn't going to change that fact.

During that period we play a few games where the whole squad / team pulled to together and did some wonderful stuff; yes we failed at the final hurdle, but we still re-qualified.

We weren't 'bang average' what we suffered from was some of the dumbest, stupidest handling of discontent that I've ever witnessed - that was the root cause of almost all our woes, the leadership both from Levy/the board and the manager was disastrous, they all hid and refused to act.

We are now in danger of having a coach/manager that is also prone to shoot his mouth off and burn and chuck players under the bus when he should be showing leadership, intellect and integrity - so far, he's more interested in saving his own reputation than showing any of the qualities we need now in this moment.

I supported his appointment, but I didn't sign up to abject surrender and more egotistical maniacal nonsense - let him get away with this and we may never repair ourselves.

If he doesn't show that he can deal with adversity in the same way you should deal with success, he can do one, because if he doesn't he'll destroy the club for years to come.
 
It's difficult to envisage that much will change between now and the end of the season, the observation that Jose seems more interested in preserving his reputation is fair comment. For fans and observers generally however, he is doing very little to preserve that reputation.
What happens in the summer (which will obviously be dependent on the eventual outcome of this season) will be interesting, particularly as regards whether the Board will be prepared to support JM in the market to the extent that he will no doubt want.
Equally interesting will be Levy's approach if for whatever reason, Jose is not with us next season.
- Will another 'name' manager be installed.
- Will a 'high potential' appointment be made.
- Will Poch be reappointed on his terms.
 
During that period we play a few games where the whole squad / team pulled to together and did some wonderful stuff; yes we failed at the final hurdle, but we still re-qualified.

We weren't 'bang average' what we suffered from was some of the dumbest, stupidest handling of discontent that I've ever witnessed - that was the root cause of almost all our woes, the leadership both from Levy/the board and the manager was disastrous, they all hid and refused to act.

We are now in danger of having a coach/manager that is also prone to shoot his mouth off and burn and chuck players under the bus when he should be showing leadership, intellect and integrity - so far, he's more interested in saving his own reputation than showing any of the qualities we need now in this moment.

I supported his appointment, but I didn't sign up to abject surrender and more egotistical maniacal nonsense - let him get away with this and we may never repair ourselves.

If he doesn't show that he can deal with adversity in the same way you should deal with success, he can do one, because if he doesn't he'll destroy the club for years to come.

As Souness said Spurs getting to the CL final was nothing but fluke. You don't lose 20 games in all competitions if you are a good side.

We scrapped through the group stages. We had 2 massive VAR decisions going our way at City.

Last kick of the game against Ajax with route one football that you love.

You can't base any progression on fluke or luck.

We were terrible in the league last season. There is no point pretending we were anything but bang average.

This season is even worse. I will be amazed if we get more than 60 points this season.

The squad is loaded up with over the hill, average, Injury prone pussies.
 
As Souness said Spurs getting to the CL final was nothing but fluke. You don't lose 20 games in all competitions if you are a good side.

We scrapped through the group stages. We had 2 massive VAR decisions going our way at City.

Last kick of the game against Ajax with route one football that you love.

You can't base any progression on fluke or luck.

We were terrible in the league last season. There is no point pretending we were anything but bang average.

This season is even worse. I will be amazed if we get more than 60 points this season.

The squad is loaded up with over the hill, average, Injury prone pussies.

Oh dear, so now in 'defence' of Jose you're prepared to diss some of the best football games in one off's we'd ever played and some of the best attitudes we'd ever displayed, even scraping so low as to use a hail mary to diss that football and my dislike of hoof-ball.

You make your own luck in sport and definitely in football.

As for the league form, no argument for me, I was groaning and moaning about it all season; we lost focus, too many players wanted out, there were too many little shits agenda's, including Poch's lack of commitment,vision and integrity.

AS for this season, if we keep playing like the last two games, we'll be lucky to scrape over 50 points.

It's funny, I've been arguing for the last 18 months that we had too many over the hill, couldn't care-less players - so at least we can now finally agree on that, no question that Poch and the club should of pushed them out sooner for whatever they could get, running them on was a recipe for disaster - as I argued at the time.

Who though are the injury-prone pussies, as that one defeats me?!
 
Must admit, I don't look back on last season with any affection to the players for the attitude shown in the CL run. It was more luck than attitude in my mind, with a few exceptions. I think more back to why these guys can magically get up for a Tues/Weds game with a huge bonus on it but stroll around on the weekends before and after as if it those games weren't worthy. It's the complete opposite of professionalism in my mind and showed the toxicity in the club at the time.

As for this season, we have 16 or 17 fit outfield players and about 8 or 9 of them aren't at the elite fitness levels to maintain the intensity for 95 mins e.g. Davies, Vertonghen, Dier, Gedson, Skipp, Ndombele, Bergwijn, Lamela. Some will return to full fitness as they assimilate to the Prem or get going again after injury. Others won't. Until such time, Jose's operating with one hand behind his back.

Even with the lack of robustness, I would say the squad is more together than one year ago though.
 
A mix of injuries, ageing, lack of motivation , below level required standards and lack of depth in the squad isnt going to improve by making no signings for 2 windows and then signing players for their potential instead of proven ability.

I entirely agree, but that was entirely down to Poch as he 'schooled' Levy as he put it.
 
I entirely agree, but that was entirely down to Poch as he 'schooled' Levy as he put it.

I'm not qualified but if I was to educate Levy it might be to....bring on players to replace the ageing ones, players low on motivation due to contract ending need their replacements lined up, ie Eriksen and Rose. Our standard needs to be raised in line with Liverpool etc and we need more depth for positions. I would advise him that not signing anyone for 2 windows and continuing with a Skinflint approach to the new signings won't deal with the issues mentioned.
Now Levy is far more qualified to advise on the above himself having been in football and dealt with managers and strategies over the years.....so I dont excuse him.
 
Oh dear, so now in 'defence' of Jose you're prepared to diss some of the best football games in one off's we'd ever played and some of the best attitudes we'd ever displayed, even scraping so low as to use a hail mary to diss that football and my dislike of hoof-ball.

You make your own luck in sport and definitely in football.

As for the league form, no argument for me, I was groaning and moaning about it all season; we lost focus, too many players wanted out, there were too many little shits agenda's, including Poch's lack of commitment,vision and integrity.

AS for this season, if we keep playing like the last two games, we'll be lucky to scrape over 50 points.

It's funny, I've been arguing for the last 18 months that we had too many over the hill, couldn't care-less players - so at least we can now finally agree on that, no question that Poch and the club should of pushed them out sooner for whatever they could get, running them on was a recipe for disaster - as I argued at the time.

Who though are the injury-prone pussies, as that one defeats me?!

Now now don't twist what I'm saying. I said in the CL we were lucky which we were. Of course it was exciting. But every man and his dog knew we wouldn't win the CL as Poch and the players were bottle jobs.

I wasn't particularly defending Jose. I was more hinting this squad is a bang average one last season and this.

You do make your own luck to a certain extent. Bit pointless if you can't win Jack at the end of it.
 
I'm really hoping that all the criticism he's picked up after the way he's set us up to play stings him into dumping the negativity and show us what is possible with the 'limited' resources he has at his disposal and the tactical acumen and management genius everyone believes he has in spades.

Chris Sutton has joined in now and has put the Boot into him as well yesterday:

Chris Sutton has told BBC Sport that he feels that Tottenham Hotspur boss Jose Mourinho has got it all wrong with the way he has dealt with his side’s problems.

Mourinho has bemoaned Tottenham’s lack of a striker publicly recently, and suggested that things could get worse before they get better for Spurs.

The Portuguese boss has sounded very pessimistic in interviews, since injury to Heung-Min Son has added to his problems.

And Sutton feels as if Mourinho’s down-case attitude will cost Tottenham a chance at making it into the top four.

"Yes, Spurs have got injury problems but I don't agree with the way Jose Mourinho has dealt with them,” Sutton said.

"Has he got a point, blaming all their problems on being without the likes of Harry Kane and Son Heung-min? No.

"This Mourinho, who is throwing his toys out of the pram, is the one I think a lot of people thought we would see at Spurs, so it is not a surprise.

"Of course it is not ideal to lose your star striker and his main back-up but they have still got lots of quality in their squad.

Rather than moan, Mourinho's job is to get the best out of the other players in his squad - but he is not doing that at the moment.”


What I do know to be is that the general feeling with some in the club is he's letting himself down badly, everyone knows he has a tough situation to face, but are alarmed at how negative he is and the effect it can have on the players.