Is it curtains for Bonner? | Page 7 | Vital Football

Is it curtains for Bonner?

chris who said:
Given who he was and what he previously has said I'd say that was probably his most damning assessment of any team under the last three managers.
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Have just sped through the podcast and to summarise Fish thought vs Bromley we were disjointed and terrible to watch.

He thinks in League 2 you need “big nasty” players with a big target man up front who can hold the ball up and win headers. He doesn’t think the current team are “nasty” enough.
Thinks the tippy tappy triangle passes style is not suited to getting out of League 2.

Motivational tactics are different now to what they used to be, old fashioned rollockings don’t work any more, he’s sure Bonner has tried everything.
Feels we lack characters like Mark Harris, Mark Saunders, Paul Smith etc. Thinks we’ve become too soft.
If still employed by the club Fish would talk to the senior players to find out what is going on.
Thought v Bromley players were only giving 60-70% effort.
Unfortunately he thinks if he was still working there and if financially it would work, he’d make a change (with the manager).
Something has to change in the setup for results to change (he thinks).
Speaks fondly about Neil Harris, he couldn’t understand why he was sacked as he was long gone from the club by that time.
 
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I find it really interesting that someone who did have power at the top of the club encapsulates the exact same thoughts that most of the fans on here have.

What Fish has said pretty much summarises our thoughts, as does Bonner's interview after the game this week. McKenzie's interview as well.

I would just love to be a fly on the wall at team meetings currently, particularly if they sit through videos of the game.

They must be beyond saying things like "this must not happen again" as they seem to then go out and play in the exact same lacklustre manner.

Have they no self respect of determination to pull together and improve?

Absolutely baffling how similar the pattern of each game becomes when they know it isn't working.
 
GillsBluenose said:
I find it really interesting that someone who did have power at the top of the club encapsulates the exact same thoughts that most of the fans on here have.

What Fish has said pretty much summarises our thoughts, as does Bonner's interview after the game this week. McKenzie's interview as well.

I would just love to be a fly on the wall at team meetings currently, particularly if they sit through videos of the game.

They must be beyond saying things like "this must not happen again" as they seem to then go out and play in the exact same lacklustre manner.

Have they no self respect of determination to pull together and improve?

Absolutely baffling how similar the pattern of each game becomes when they know it isn't working.
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Knowledgeable fans are all saying the exact same things. We have all identified the issues. Bonner's not stupid either.

The concerning aspect of this current tripe is that the players are simply not responding to either the gaffer or fans. Why?

Being at Bromley on Wednesday confirmed my suspicion that too many players are simply not interested or committed to the cause.

Let's see today how many players fancy it in what's likely to be dreadful conditions & a toxic atmosphere. I fear I already know the answer.
 
It's all very well talking to the senior players but sometimes they might just be the problem.

As MB has said this week about some players not taking responsibility, I'd say a few players reactions at full time against Harrogate would back that up and one was the 'captain'.

There are very few in our current dressing room who'd I'd want to play alongside if I was still playing.

Attitude, effort, application and desire to win should all be a given.

Don't think MB has more than a couple of players that he can trust he'll get a genuine performance from currently and that's a sad reflection on this squad.
 
On the one hand i feel sorry for Mark Bonner but on the other I feel he has helped create this shitty scenario.
Looking back at those halcyon days at the start of the season Bonner was full of confidence and chat but always trying temper expectations. That's fine but as bit like Kier Starmer is finding, people need to hear positives and credit when
credit is due.

I keep thinking that it all changed after the Barrow home game.
Instead of publicly saying, "We played really well today it was a good performance. We've beaten the top of the table team twice in a week to go top ourselves and I'm really pleased for the club and the fans. We now have to try to maintain this standard."
What we got was "It was a poor performance, the team didn't play well and we should be doing better." Check it out the KOL report, it is remarkably negative and contrary to what I witnessed that day.
It all seemed a bit like he didn't have the confidence to celebrate the success because that would be tempting fate and things at some point would turn for the worse. And so they have.
Following the crop of dismal defeats after that game he tried belatedly to big up the team and reinstilll some confidence but the damage seems to be done.

Bonner is a young manager who has never played professional football - perhaps he and the players are too concious of that fact.
Brian Clough could say blunt comments to mentally tougher 1970's players but we live in a much more sensitive world nowadays and praise goes much further than constructive criticism.

That said, whatever the issues there is no excuse for the players performances in the last 10 games or so. They should be ashamed as they are not only letting themselves down but also the Gallinsons and us supporters.

I do hope that Mark Bonner can turn things around but in all honesty I don't think that he will
 
Dradley's Back said:
On the one hand i feel sorry for Mark Bonner but on the other I feel he has helped create this shitty scenario.
Looking back at those halcyon days at the start of the season Bonner was full of confidence and chat but always trying temper expectations. That's fine but as bit like Kier Starmer is finding, people need to hear positives and credit when
credit is due.

I keep thinking that it all changed after the Barrow home game.
Instead of publicly saying, "We played really well today it was a good performance. We've beaten the top of the table team twice in a week to go top ourselves and I'm really pleased for the club and the fans. We now have to try to maintain this standard."
What we got was "It was a poor performance, the team didn't play well and we should be doing better." Check it out the KOL report, it is remarkably negative and contrary to what I witnessed that day.
It all seemed a bit like he didn't have the confidence to celebrate the success because that would be tempting fate and things at some point would turn for the worse. And so they have.
Following the crop of dismal defeats after that game he tried belatedly to big up the team and reinstilll some confidence but the damage seems to be done.

Bonner is a young manager who has never played professional football - perhaps he and the players are too concious of that fact.
Brian Clough could say blunt comments to mentally tougher 1970's players but we live in a much more sensitive world nowadays and praise goes much further than constructive criticism.

That said, whatever the issues there is no excuse for the players performances in the last 10 games or so. They should be ashamed as they are not only letting themselves down but also the Gallinsons and us supporters.

I do hope that Mark Bonner can turn things around but in all honesty I don't think that he will
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You’ve brought this one up numerous times DB. But I’d be staggered if the coach not giving enough praise after a game has led to a run of 1 win in 10.

In fact, I think most players at all clubs would (and if not, then they should) take any coaches post match press conference utterings with a pinch of salt.

They should only listen to what he tells them in the sheds, on the coach home or on the Monday morning.
 
OneSirKeefy said:
You’ve brought this one up numerous times DB. But I’d be staggered if the coach not giving enough praise after a game has led to a run of 1 win in 10.

In fact, I think most players at all clubs would (and if not, then they should) take any coaches post match press conference utterings with a pinch of salt.

They should only listen to what he tells them in the sheds, on the coach home or on the Monday morning.
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It’s actually quite incredible how convinced DB is by this conspiracy theory.
 
Even after the opening game against Carlisle, Bonner was trying to play down expectations, saying something along the lines of - I hope the fans don't expect this every week. I thought his interview after the Barrow game had the same motive.

What he probably meant was that every team goes through a bad patch and be ready for it, but that is usually a few home draws against fellow contenders and slipping to the odd unexpected away defeat to a struggler. Not being a dream opponent for every 6 foot 8 slow centre back and any struggling team looking to get out of a bad run.
 
OneSirKeefy said:
You’ve brought this one up numerous times DB. But I’d be staggered if the coach not giving enough praise after a game has led to a run of 1 win in 10.

In fact, I think most players at all clubs would (and if not, then they should) take any coaches post match press conference utterings with a pinch of salt.

They should only listen to what he tells them in the sheds, on the coach home or on the Monday morning.
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Ah, you could be right Keefy but what has he been saying to the players?
Whatever it is it ain't working.
My theory is a best guess and Bonners chopping and changing players, systems and odd substitutions have added to the chaos. But the dramatic change in performances and results have been dramatic post Barrow.
The team spirit seems to have evaporated.

Oh to be a fly on the dressing room wall at the moment!
 
Lark said:
Have just sped through the podcast and to summarise Fish thought vs Bromley we were disjointed and terrible to watch.

He thinks in League 2 you need “big nasty” players with a big target man up front who can hold the ball up and win headers. He doesn’t think the current team are “nasty” enough.
Thinks the tippy tappy triangle passes style is not suited to getting out of League 2.

Motivational tactics are different now to what they used to be, old fashioned rollockings don’t work any more, he’s sure Bonner has tried everything.
Feels we lack characters like Mark Harris, Mark Saunders, Paul Smith etc. Thinks we’ve become too soft.
If still employed by the club Fish would talk to the senior players to find out what is going on.
Thought v Bromley players were only giving 60-70% effort.
Unfortunately he thinks if he was still working there and if financially it would work, he’d make a change (with the manager).
Something has to change in the setup for results to change (he thinks).
Speaks fondly about Neil Harris, he couldn’t understand why he was sacked as he was long gone from the club by that time.
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Little surprised as Paul Fisher was very supportive of Neil Harris despite the mess he made of it in our first season in league 2. We were getting relegated until the Galinson's took over.

We have three big target men but they have spent most of the season injured, none of them have stayed fit long enough to get going. Neither has the majority of our midfield and it has caught up with us.

I hope someone is looking at the type of injuries we are having because something needs to change, be it the way we train, the way we warm down, our training ground pitch to heavy etc.

If the playes are only giving 60-70% then they might respond to a manager change but how long before we back to square one with a squad that is failing to deliver. If part of a business is underperforming then the quick fix is to replace the manager but having done that several times only to have similar problems occur you would have to conclude that it's not the manager who is the problem.

Based on Joe Compers recent interview it seems to me that they are quite reliant on Bonner at the moment. With Kenny having not been about for some months it sounds like Bonner has been heavily involved with all football aspects of the football club and he is almost performing a dual role of manager and director of football. Joe really believes in him.

I think a few fans willl be disappointed, Bonner will get more time to turn it around and will get to the January transfer window, that might change if the loses continue to pile up. Having said now, he will probably be gone tomorrow.

We need to get behind the team until the final whistle today even if that feels a little difficult at times. It's not a good day to play football and if the players don't give everthing today then there is only going to be one result so lets hope the players show some character.
 
Captainreblue said:
It's all very well talking to the senior players but sometimes they might just be the problem.

As MB has said this week about some players not taking responsibility, I'd say a few players reactions at full time against Harrogate would back that up and one was the 'captain'.

There are very few in our current dressing room who'd I'd want to play alongside if I was still playing.

Attitude, effort, application and desire to win should all be a given.

Don't think MB has more than a couple of players that he can trust he'll get a genuine performance from currently and that's a sad reflection on this squad.
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Good post, but can someone please clarify what exactly the captain did after the final whistle against Harrogate? Seen the criticism just not what he did - a rude gesture to the fans?
 
Dradley's Back said:
Ah, you could be right Keefy but what has he been saying to the players?
Whatever it is it ain't working.
My theory is a best guess and Bonners chopping and changing players, systems and odd substitutions have added to the chaos. But the dramatic change in performances and results have been dramatic post Barrow.
The team spirit seems to have evaporated.

Oh to be a fly on the dressing room wall at the moment!
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You’ve mentioned the 2 things that I think are a problem.

1/ we don’t appear to have a defined way that we want to play. Well, I can’t see one anyway. And

2/ constant changes to team selection and formation. Some of it forced through the ridiculous injuries, some of it self inflicted when MB has shuffled things around and rotated players in and out.

I do think that MB despite being very knowledgeable, speaking well and seemingly identifying our deficiencies, never gives me confidence by explaining what he and we will do to fix things. And he now seems completely bereft of any ideas what to do.


One thing I don’t agree with you. The results post Barrow are definitely pronounced, but I’m not sure the actual performances are.

Even when we were 6-1-1, a lot of fans noted how we were definitely lucky and not exactly dominant in a lot of those games. The Barrow game was probably the only one where we were fairly comfortable throughout but Bonner wasn’t the only one who thought we didn’t play great that day. Even the 4-1 Carlisle and 3-0 Tranmere games, the lowly opposition caused us problems for large parts of both games. Notts could easily have beat us 3 or 4-1 on chances created. We rode our luck v Chesterfield despite being very committed in both those games. And take away the 4-1 & 3-0 games our goalscoring has been woeful all season.
 
Dradley's Back said:
Ah thanks Nibbles, my wife says I'm Incredible as well.
My conspiracy theory is of course pure supposition but please, let's have your valued opinion on the recent decline.
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I think it’s been long established that I don’t like to repeat myself.

Nothing wrong with dabbling in supposition - the unknowns are more plentiful than the knowns so we piece together the clues as best we can.

In this case I think you’re focussing on a red herring and ignoring the actual clues.

I won’t go into my own theories as to what’s gone on because it’s already out there and it’s long been established that I don’t like to repeat myself.
 
Dradley's Back said:
Ah thanks Nibbles, my wife says I'm Incredible as well.
My conspiracy theory is of course pure supposition but please, let's have your valued opinion on the recent decline.
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You won’t get anything out of nibbles. It’s long established that he doesn’t repeat himself.

(but could you please link us to your opinions nibs. Can’t find them).
 
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