Ipswich v Villa - Saturday 18th August | Page 20 | Vital Football

Ipswich v Villa - Saturday 18th August

Bruce we now know for sure is a defensive minded manager, however, i agree that the fear of losing his job could be a reason why he may stick to his tried and tested method instead of trying what actually works in the modern era of football.

Well Cardiff last season disprove the theory that you have to play Guardiolas way to get promoted and I dont think either Brighton or Huddersfield play particulary attractive football either. Hughton is well known for being a defensively minded coach.
 
And what if the punch had gone straight to an Ipswich player who then scored. Its the curse of being a goalie, its a (pardon the pun) catch 22, screwed either way.

Yes, which is exactly what Steer did in the opening game at Hull. People seem to forget that as he made a couple of decent saves later on
 
Well Cardiff last season disprove the theory that you have to play Guardiolas way to get promoted and I dont think either Brighton or Huddersfield play particulary attractive football either. Hughton is well known for being a defensively minded coach.
There is certainly more than one way to play football. Personally I think physical / long ball tactics like Cardiff will only get so far and any success comes from luck / hoping for good form more than anything else whereas playing good passing football with creative players is a more reliable way to be successful although it is more difficult to implement and requires better players
 
Well you can forget comparing everyone you've mentioned from Doug Ellis onwards as they were owners/senior management.
I thought Billy McNeil was the worst ever Villa manager but, at least he tried to get us playing attack minded football, not at all times close to successfully.

Dr Jo Venglos was too far before his time to be successful. I really liked that guy for his, what were then, brand new idea's about not only playing but, training, having the players look after themselves with their intake and type of food taken, the alcohol abstinence etc etc. It was player rebellion that got rid of Dr Jo.

Graham Turner I felt sorry for because he was given charge of a squad that was starting to fall apart and he had no experience of dealing with a club run anything like this club was being run. Nor of players with as much power as our players had.

O'Leary was a bad choice, he'd only managed one club and he was given an almost bottomless pit of cash with them. When he came here he tried getting the team he'd inherited to play the exspansive type of football he'd played at Leeds but, two things stood in his way. One being the difference in class of the players he had had and the ones he had here. Two and the most telling, instead of being backed in everything he wanted, he now had a chairman who not only had very deep pockets but, extremely short arms.

I felt very sorry for Lambert, he was hamstrung from the very beginning, his primary job was replacing players with cheaper versions so the owner could save and recoup some money. An impossible task.

With Garde he wasn't only not here long enough to influence anything but, he was refused any kind of backing in transfers and/or loans.

RDM, just like Garde, wasn't here long enough to unpack his suitcase, so what damage could they do.

Bruce came in with a reputation and I was expecting him to be able to sort things out and get us pointed in the right direction.
When Dr Tone said to gamble everything on promotion, Bruce should have been a loud voice shouting against it, pointing out the many pit
falls.
I expected Bruce to balance the unbalanced squad, not to make it more unbalanced with his love of rightbacks and hatred of anykind of leftsided player.
We had 3 senior rightbacks and he got a loan from Man U that he insists oin playing at rightback, that makes 4. He is reported as being interested in Hayden from Newcastle, another rightback. We have 1 senior leftback, who probably needs psychological help to get over his part in an horrendous accident on Seamus Coleman.
We have two senior centrebacks, one of whom he doesn't want to use, he'd rather use a slow 34 year old DM in defence instead.
This manager, Oh hell you've read the arguments, 'square pegs' and 'tactics' should make the points.
In interviews he, Bruce, talks about needing wingers and a forward, doesn't he see the need to get the backline sorted.
Will the only time he'll be satisfied, be when we field a team made up entirely of rightbacks.
We have some great kids in our U23 squad but, the only chance any of them have of playing for the first team is if there are injuries and he doesn't have enough rightbacks to cover.
With a manager unwilling to give the kids anything resembling a chance, the good kids will stop signing for our club.
This is hurting the name of our club and will continue to, unless things are changed very shortly.

I really do give up now trying to explain to Bruce supporters who obviously think the sun rises and sets in his arse, what the man isn't and is doing to our club.

Hayden is a midfielder not a RB. Just another example of trying to create things to criticise Bruce for.
 
There is certainly more than one way to play football. Personally I think physical / long ball tactics like Cardiff will only get so far and any success comes from luck / hoping for good form more than anything else whereas playing good passing football with creative players is a more reliable way to be successful although it is more difficult to implement and requires better players

I'd probably agree with that, but I dont think our style of play is anywhere near as bad as Cardiffs despite what some will try and make out. We just seem to resort to the long ball down the channels when we are failing to create anything
 
I'd probably agree with that, but I dont think our style of play is anywhere near as bad as Cardiffs despite what some will try and make out. We just seem to resort to the long ball down the channels when we are failing to create anything
No it is not as bad as Cardiff although certainly last season we relied far too heavily on attacking down the wings, we made more crosses than any other team and at times it was far too obvious and ineffective. My worry is that it will be the same again this season - so far this season we have the highest % of attacks down the wings compared to any other team. That’s why we need to bring in a wide player with a bit of creativity because with Elmohamady and to a lesser extent Adomah it will just be the same story again.

To me the way we create chances is more important than having a striker to score them... there are many mediocre strikers in the championship who pick up goals (look at Hogans record at Brentford), the key is having players capable of creating chances
 
There is nothing wrong with the way Cardiff play, or the way Man City play - the problem is with the Vlla , we playone style with the other styles players.

We could easily play "The Warnock Way" and get promotion. For this we could play

Nyland,

Hutton, Jedi, Chester, Taylor

Elmo, Whelan , McGinn, Grealish

McCormack , Davis

The back 4 sit there, the middle two work, the wide two put crosses in, Davis knock em down, McCormack knock em in

Or we could play the Guardiola Way

Nyland ,

Bree, Tuanzebe, Chester, Hutton,

Mcginn

Adomah , Horihane , Green

Grealish

Kodjia

(and swap some players for whomever you want)

But we don't , we play 50% Warnock (set pieces), 40% Mourinho (get one, shut up shop) 10% Guardiola (asking Jack and McGinn to run 70 yards and beat 10 players) - with totally the wrong players in the positions you would want them



Nyland
 
So far we have been bang average in all 4 games. Yes we have got 3 results against poor teams and a point away against an average 10 man Ipswich, but the real tests are to come. McGinn looks useful, but the 'kids' are still largely unproven....we have problems at full back, centre half and centre forward...all our CF'S are bloody injury prone. And we could do with a decent keeper!
Sure, its not as bad as I thought it would be about 2 months ago...but there is NO chance of us going up unless serious improvements are made...Jack Grealish OR no Jack Grealish.
 
I've never been a Bruce fan, although I'm backing him this season. Maybe if you tried to understand what those who are supporting him are saying you wouldn't feel the need to trot out the load of garbage above.

Bruce did sort us out in the most important area at the time; removing the toxic atmosphere in the dressing room by selling the wasters who didn't want to be here.

Of course Tone didn't say gamble everything on promotion. In fact in terms of player outlay he's spent very little since the RDM signings. The overall net spend of Bruce has been very little. What Tone was spending money on until the money dried up was the high overheads he'd inherited and which RDM's signings didn't help.

It's against that background you have to judge Bruce's squad. Yes, getting in another good left back would be great; unfortunately they tend to cost quite a lot of money, even if they're available.

As to your other comments about Bruce's selections, remember that this is the start of the season, he's trying to give the bulk his squad game time to get them right up to match fitness, and that when he chooses a team for say the Ipswich match, he has an eye for the following two matches coming quickly up.
Douglas of Wolves would have cost us 3 million( he's gone to Leeds), while we bid double that for that bloke who ran off to fulham!
 
Douglas of Wolves would have cost us 3 million( he's gone to Leeds), while we bid double that for that bloke who ran off to fulham!

Douglas would have been perfect. Unfortunately, he went to Leeds while we were still up shit creek financially (ie before the takeover), so we were never in a position to sign him (or anyone else at that stage).
 
Douglas of Wolves would have cost us 3 million( he's gone to Leeds), while we bid double that for that bloke who ran off to fulham!

I think all that was sorted before our takeover was completed, but I agree he would have been a cracking buy for us
 
Well Cardiff last season disprove the theory that you have to play Guardiolas way to get promoted and I dont think either Brighton or Huddersfield play particulary attractive football either. Hughton is well known for being a defensively minded coach.

2 out of the 3 that got promoted last season played the right way. And I am concerned not just about going up, I want us to go up playing in a manner which will help us be in the prem.
 
2 out of the 3 that got promoted last season played the right way. And I am concerned not just about going up, I want us to go up playing in a manner which will help us be in the prem.

Neither Brighton or Huddersfield played sparkling football the season they got promoted and both managed to stay up. We aren't currently in the Premier League and there is no such thing as "the right way". If we do get promoted we will be in a position to buy better quality players which will enable us to play what you perceive to be more attractive football.
 
I like how those not in support of Bruce's football articulate their reasons, however those in favour disregard the obvious reasons which most likely will lead to another year and a failed attempt in the league for promotion.

If he’s going to fail to get us promoted then why are you moaning about him getting us relegated from the Prem?

Also, I think every single person on here said yesterday was crap football, some people just don’t feel the need to dump every complaint we’ve ever had against Bruce after a poor showing.

For the record, I’ve not wanted Bruce since day 1, but the man has done a lot for the club, and given me a reason to believe Villa can succeed for the first time since the early MoN days. So yes, I’ll cut him some slack after an away draw and hope we improve on the pitch Wednesday
 
WERE NOT IN THE PREMIER LEAGUE. Moaning about how Bruce will get us relegated from the Premier League is like moaning about the style of play Aston Villa would have if I was the manager.

It’s finding a way to take another shot at Steve Bruce for no reason whatsoever

I am assuming you do not care if we get relegated again if we get promoted.
 
Personally I was not really disappointed about losing the final, as I was expecting the defeat.

Not disappointed about losing the final? You’re taking the piss right?

Clearly on different wavelengths here, as you’re not disappointed about losing the final and saying that I don’t care if we get relegated. I’d be thrilled if I got to discuss how our season in the Prem is going and whether or not a change is needed to keep us afloat in the Prem.
 
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I'm a massive Bruce fan, what he has done since arriving is superb.
However, 4 games in, the warning signs in my opinion are glaring and obvious. Unless we improve , we will just miss out again.
I think we are less prepared as it stands than last season.
Johnstone Terry Snodgrass & Grabban haven't been replaced, McGinn is a great signing but him aside we've added no quality .
 
I'm a massive Bruce fan, what he has done since arriving is superb.
However, 4 games in, the warning signs in my opinion are glaring and obvious. Unless we improve , we will just miss out again.
I think we are less prepared as it stands than last season.
Johnstone Terry Snodgrass & Grabban haven't been replaced, McGinn is a great signing but him aside we've added no quality .

Agree, there are warning signs, but to be fair that's against an ambition to get promotion, which is very different from where we were a few weeks ago. Think a less than perfect situation is understandable! We've come a remarkable distance in those few weeks.

We are where we are. Let's see where it takes us. I for one am looking forwards to the season.