Interesting Miscellaneous Stats Discussion | Page 3 | Vital Football

Interesting Miscellaneous Stats Discussion

Could have is very vague. Burnley could have. I would be ashamed in a discussion with a City or Chav supporter talking about silver ware..... Yeah but we won the League cup, yes I know all the teams play their kids and just see it as an interference to the League they are in but you get a nice shiney cup at the end of it.

Yep a non league club could have won the FA cup, my point was IMO we had a frigging good opportunity to have certainly beaten Spam, gone past Juve and got to FA cup final.....but we didn't manage to.

As for being ashamed...why? We don't have to shout from the rooftops, or compare it to the PL or CL, but its a trophy and its about time we won one again.

And IMO we could have done better in 1,2,3 of those cups this year without effecting our top 4 chances.

As for the league cup and playing kids.....yep if we are going to do that, do it totally from the off and every game.....don't kinda 'go for it'
 
I may be wrong here but I seriously doubt winning a League Cup or even the FA Cup will have much of an impact on our recruitment and/or retention of players. Wages and consistent CL are what matter to the players.

I imagine every player would love to win a trophy....of course the PL or CL or EL would be better than the FA or League cup....but its a start. I also think that if for example we had won the FA cup this season, that along with 3rd in the league would IMO have been a shit hot season.

Yep wages, recruitment and retention of players matter to anyone thinking of going or joining, getting 3rd helps us, getting 3rd and a cup IMO helps us a bit more!
 
I'm not a tennis player ,nor do I do boxing nor do I consider myself the best in the world . What I do very well is support Tottenham and appreciate where we are at the moment .

You are obviously blinding yourself to Pochettino' s achievements , which I think is because you want to find reasons to find fault with him.
Did you notice how hoddle .conn and resrocspur attached themselves to your posts .?

When he joined us he inherited :
Lloris, Friedel, Vorm.
Yedlin, Walker , Rose, Davies

Kaboul, Vertongen , Chiriches, Fazio , Dier

Stambouli, Capoue, Paulinho, Dembele, Mason , Benteleb, Eriksen ,Cebellos, Lamella, Townsend , Chadli

Soldado , Adebayor, Kane.

Not quite what you were saying about having a squad of players that were some of the best in Europe.
In that first summer transfer season 18 players were either released or sold leaving him with the above .
Within two years he had transformed the squad into what we have now .
He brought in players that he knew he could work with and kept those that he recognised as worth keeping. He assembled a squad that he knew would work together , that he knew he could improve . And continue to improve

He moulded them into some of the best in Europe

He did it without breaking the strict constraints set by Daniel Levy.
And we all know what they are .

He has kept them together and given us some of the best football we have seen for years . We are Spurs supporters so we know how up and down it all was . We celebrated 4-4 draws as if it was a cup final . We beat the gooners on one occaision 5-1 and dined out on it for years .


As an aside ,if you want to compare him to Alex Ferguson , in his first four years , he came 11 th , 2 nd , 11 th , then just avoided relegation and the sack by the skin of his teeth. .


He has caught up with the gooners and left them in his wake , caught up with Chelsea, continually been better than Liverpool and now on a par with the red Mancs . You mention the money being spent by all them but seem to dismiss it .
Yes , you give him begrudging praise in certain areas but denigrate him because he hasn't won a trophy .you mention that four managers would have won a trophy with our players . I hope you are not alluding to Conte , Mourinho , Guardiola , or Wenger because there is no way in the world any of them would even get out of bed to work for us , with what we pay in transfer fees or wages
Who else would have settled for putting his job on the line by playing every game away from home ,for an entire season , and still delivered on the the promise , no ....exceeded on the promise to put this club into the positions expected by Daniel Levy
.
He has sold the project to the players , with perhaps only one baulking at what he gets paid . He has brought in quality that hasn't broken the bank and turned us into a team that now regularly qualifies for the Champions League .we are well known across Europe ,and feared by most .
Just say it to yourself again , we regularly qualify for the Champions League .

And That Is Genius.

I'm not blinding myself to anything. You are not understanding what I am saying. I call things as I see it. I give credit where it's due and I give criticism where it's due. Always have done and always will do.

Didn't take particular notice to them attaching themselves to my posts. I deleted a few of their posts as did the other mods. They have been banned anyway. So what is your point here?

I said in his first season he didn't have the squad to win trophies but he had a core base of players that could become very good players. I said from his 2nd season onwards he had developed a team that could win trophies not from his first. Again you are clearly not understanding what I am saying or choosing to ignore what I am saying for whatever reasons.

I have said numerous times he has moulded this team into what it is. So we agree there.

Yes he has put a squad together with one hand tied behind his back. Yes we agree again. He has also made some poor signings whilst spending a lot of money.

We have played some excellent football under Poch but we have also played some very boring football. Slow, sideways football. I think he needs to address certain things for us to play faster, more aggressive football. I liked the football we played against Madrid and Dortmund in the CL. It was a different style and showed some tactical intelligence. Sadly the counter attacking style didn't carry on as the season progressed.

Fergie was a proven winner before he went to United. 12 trophies at St Mirren and Aberdeen. He won the FA CUP with United in 3 and a half seasons. His CV was miles ahead of Poch even before he started winning titles with United.

Agree we have gained momemtum on the bigger clubs. Never said we didn't.

Have never dismissed the money issue. Not once. I have said we have players that are capable and should be winning trophies despite the handy cap. Plenty of spurs fans have said so and plenty of ex spurs players. Even the current crop like Verts are saying so. I think you re just picking up on the odd oneliner instead of reading all of my posts.

Begrudging praise? Do me a favour. You clearly haven't read my posts on him over the years. Laughable comment. Trust me I have been one of his biggest fans. I remember when we first appointed him. Plenty were slagging him off in his first season. Myself and 80 were his biggest supporters.

You asked what manager could match his achievements? Well unless other managers were in his position it is impossible to say. But looking at the quality of players we have had over the last 3 seasons there are managers around that could match his achievements with them players. The fat waiter certainly would have done a good job. The obvious crop like Pep, Wenger, Jose certainly would have. And yes I know none of them would come here. But that wasn't the question. By the way I think Poch is a better manager than Klopp even though I love his attacking playing style.

Yep Poch has delivered what Levy has asked. Doesn't mean fans can't expect a little more.

The project talk, some have brought into it some haven't. Walker has been sold. Rose kicked up a fuss. Toby certainly hasn't been thrilled with the ambitions of the club this season. Poch himself has even questioned the project in the last few weeks. So it's not perfect and it certainly isn't an easy job for Poch to keep running. Again though never said it wasn't.

Yep we have qualified for the CL 3 seasons running and Poch deserves all the credit in the world for that. Doesn't make him a genius. You are the only fan that I have seen call him that.

This is the part we agree to disagree. I can't see how we can go into anymore depth.

Try looking at the other side of the coin from time to time you never know you might learn something. :thumbup:
 
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The only definition of genius that could apply is achieving a target.....( top 4 ) in an unorthodox and original way, bucking the trend of the norm. Ranieri did it with Leicester in winning the PL but they then went back to reality.
Money chucking has not been the factor. Man management, professionalism and determination combined with shrewd signings of a few has helped Poch.
 
Stability and constant improvement. We can claim both of these things, and I argue we are one of a VERY few clubs in the PL that can. (And in my opinion the only club in top 5-6 who can).

I will say it again, we are in a good place and building the right way...and I believe we are on the cusp of something very special.

COYS!
 
I'm not blinding myself to anything. You are not understanding what I am saying. I call things as I see it. I give credit where it's due and I give criticism where it's due. Always have done and always will do.

Didn't take particular notice to them attaching themselves to my posts. I deleted a few of their posts as did the other mods. They have been banned anyway. So what is your point here?

I said in his first season he didn't have the squad to win trophies but he had a core base of players that could become very good players. I said from his 2nd season onwards he had developed a team that could win trophies not from his first. Again you are clearly not understanding what I am saying or choosing to ignore what I am saying for whatever reasons.

I have said numerous times he has moulded this team into what it is. So we agree there.

Yes he has put a squad together with one hand tied behind his back. Yes we agree again. He has also made some poor signings whilst spending a lot of money.

We have played some excellent football under Poch but we have also played some very boring football. Slow, sideways football. I think he needs to address certain things for us to play faster, more aggressive football. I liked the football we played against Madrid and Dortmund in the CL. It was a different style and showed some tactical intelligence. Sadly the counter attacking style didn't carry on as the season progressed.

Fergie was a proven winner before he went to United. 12 trophies at St Mirren and Aberdeen. He won the FA CUP with United in 3 and a half seasons. His CV was miles ahead of Poch even before he started winning titles with United.

Agree we have gained momemtum on the bigger clubs. Never said we didn't.

Have never dismissed the money issue. Not once. I have said we have players that are capable and should be winning trophies despite the handy cap. Plenty of spurs fans have said so and plenty of ex spurs players. Even the current crop like Verts are saying so. I think you re just picking up on the odd oneliner instead of reading all of my posts.

Begrudging praise? Do me a favour. You clearly haven't read my posts on him over the years. Laughable comment. Trust me I have been one of his biggest fans. I remember when we first appointed him. Plenty were slagging him off in his first season. Myself and 80 were his biggest supporters.

You asked what manager could match his achievements? Well unless other managers were in his position it is impossible to say. But looking at the quality of players we have had over the last 3 seasons there are managers around that could match his achievements with them players. The fat waiter certainly would have done a good job. The obvious crop like Pep, Wenger, Jose certainly would have. And yes I know none of them would come here. But that wasn't the question. By the way I think Poch is a better manager than Klopp even though I love his attacking playing style.

Yep Poch has delivered what Levy has asked. Doesn't mean fans can't expect a little more.

The project talk, some have brought into it some haven't. Walker has been sold. Rose kicked up a fuss. Toby certainly hasn't been thrilled with the ambitions of the club this season. Poch himself has even questioned the project in the last few weeks. So it's not perfect and it certainly isn't an easy job for Poch to keep running. Again though never said it wasn't.

Yep we have qualified for the CL 3 seasons running and Poch deserves all the credit in the world for that. Doesn't make him a genius. You are the only fan that I have seen call him that.

This is the part we agree to disagree. I can't see how we can go into anymore depth.

Try looking at the other side of the coin from time to time you never know you might learn something. :thumbup:

Thanks mate, but I won't be flipping the coin over , I like what I see from my side of it. At least it's consistent .
I think that we will never have the same understandings or expectations, which I suppose is what life is all about. Our views are so widely different on so many issues that we will have to constantly agree to disagree.


I will continue to call Poch a genius , for what he has achieved in his time here , with the tools that Daniel levy has given him and the players he has at his disposal , how he has brought them all together and is continuing to do so . It's unimportant that I am the only one to call him that . Obviously you are free to call him what you like as well