How bad was the ref last night then?

A

alphabet_king

Vital 1st Team Regular
I've seen a load of comments in the press from Columbia (and randomly Maradona), moaning about the ref from last night. Apparently they feel he was biased towards england.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/44716774

https://www.theguardian.com/footbal...ons-colombia-england-radamel-falcao-world-cup

The thing is, a lot of the england commentary on the game on here, in the press and all over my social media is that we also thought the ref was pretty poor also and should have stopped them fouling properly far earlier in the game and that actually he let too much go on.

Surely we can't both be right?

Sour grapes from the Columbians, or do they have a right to be annoyed?

I know we've got a bunch of fans on here from all over the world. What do fans from other countries think? maybe more impartial?

I spoke with an Irish and a Scot and even they said we deserved to win the game.
 
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Astonishing all round.
Colombia were poor and their tactic of winding us up was counterproductive. The World Cup is far better without their shithousery. Does Neymar have any Colombian ancestry?
 
As a pukka Kiwi got to say you poms deserved to win, and we're far too polite to hate anyone (except f'in Aussies;))
 
Maradona makes me laugh. Obviously hates us.

Yes, the ref was poor but it meant one of Colombia's players got away with a booking for putting his head in to Henderson (Didn't help that he made contact with the chin and Henderson started holding the sides of his head) which should be an instant sending off.

The ref also allowed the Colombians to scuff up the penalty spot before Kane took the penalty and also to constantly surround the ref complaining about everything.

After the sending offs of Beckham and Rooney in previous Finals, it was brilliant to see our lads keep their cool.
 
Columbia were very lucky not to have one or more of their players red-carded. In this regard, some would say that the ref was biaised against England.
 
All of the VAR and technology in the world can't help if the ref can't keep control of the game and he lost control of it when he didn't book any of the Colombians for dissent after he gave the penalty. It's not exactly the first time for him apparently which begs the question, why was he in charge of such an important game? For all the controversy over VAR the refereeing has exceeded my (admittedly low) expectations, but I wouldn't let that guy ref in Sunday League.
 
townendgill said:
All of the VAR and technology in the world can't help if the ref can't keep control of the game and he lost control of it when he didn't book any of the Colombians for dissent after he gave the penalty. It's not exactly the first time for him apparently which begs the question, why was he in charge of such an important game? For all the controversy over VAR the refereeing has exceeded my (admittedly low) expectations, but I wouldn't let that guy ref in Sunday League.
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This is sort of my point exactly townendgill. Almost exactly the same comments came from both falaco and Maradona about his ability to ref the game. They also said he should never have been picked. They think he was awful too which is just odd. For pur penalty they thought kane should have been punished rather than the other way around. Deluded?
 
Marandona is just an oxygen thief but may have an excuse for his delusion, its a white substance, usually consumed through the nose. As for Falaco, he and his teammates were just tools all through the game.

Don't think the ref was very good, but IMO most other refs would've taken even less shit than the one appointed did, so don't quite get how the Colombians think that would have benefited them. Do they seriously think the ref was to harsh, wtf?.
 
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townendgill said:
All of the VAR and technology in the world can't help if the ref can't keep control of the game and he lost control of it when he didn't book any of the Colombians for dissent after he gave the penalty. It's not exactly the first time for him apparently which begs the question, why was he in charge of such an important game? For all the controversy over VAR the refereeing has exceeded my (admittedly low) expectations, but I wouldn't let that guy ref in Sunday League.
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I felt for the ref I have to say - he was on a hiding to nothing.

After the penalty, the Colombians truly and utterly lost the plot, and the ref would've been within his rights to have booked about 5 blokes that surrounded him.

Had he done that at the time, I'm almost certain that the Colombians would've lost it even more, which could've led to about 3 or 4 red cards, and he would've been the ref to lose control that much further.

So rock and hard place.

If there was a sin bin for this sort of thing, then he'd have had a better option imo.
 
I have some sympathy for the ref. His record was suggest that he was out of his depth and not experienced enough for such a match. It was also not easy refereeing (or playing in England's case) a disgusting bunch of cheats. The ref should have clamped down on the Colombian's cheating and harranging of him from the word go by dishing out a yellow. When they didn't stop, he should have sent one or more of them off.

I do once again question what the point of VAR is. Regardless of Henderson's reaction, the headbutt was clear and a clear red card for violent conduct. There were also an array of other incidents it didn't bring to the ref's attention despite the fact that they were clear (including the penalty spot scuffing). As I say, what is the point of it?

Also, why isn't hindsight action being taken against clear foul play and cheating, whether it be there headbutt, Colombian coach barging Sterling, scuffing the spot, or in other games for example Neymar's completely disgraceful cheating. For me, he should be kicked out of the tournament for his repated cheating.

As for Maradona, bloke is a fat loser and attention seeker. OK, he was a great player, but he is a complete tool. Apparently, someone is currently filming a docu-film about him and were out in Russia with him - so his ridiculous behaviour was possibly playing for the cameras as well as due to being a crackhead and complete ****.
 
SteveTreacle said:
I have some sympathy for the ref. His record was suggest that he was out of his depth and not experienced enough for such a match. It was also not easy refereeing (or playing in England's case) a disgusting bunch of cheats. The ref should have clamped down on the Colombian's cheating and harranging of him from the word go by dishing out a yellow. When they didn't stop, he should have sent one or more of them off.

I do once again question what the point of VAR is. Regardless of Henderson's reaction, the headbutt was clear and a clear red card for violent conduct. There were also an array of other incidents it didn't bring to the ref's attention despite the fact that they were clear (including the penalty spot scuffing). As I say, what is the point of it?

Also, why isn't hindsight action being taken against clear foul play and cheating, whether it be there headbutt, Colombian coach barging Sterling, scuffing the spot, or in other games for example Neymar's completely disgraceful cheating. For me, he should be kicked out of the tournament for his repated cheating.

As for Maradona, bloke is a fat loser and attention seeker. OK, he was a great player, but he is a complete tool. Apparently, someone is currently filming a docu-film about him and were out in Russia with him - so his ridiculous behaviour was possibly playing for the cameras as well as due to being a crackhead and complete ****.
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Lol Steve I do love it when people that dislike VAR criticise that it's not used more.
 
alphabet_king said:
This is sort of my point exactly townendgill. Almost exactly the same comments came from both falaco and Maradona about his ability to ref the game. They also said he should never have been picked. They think he was awful too which is just odd. For pur penalty they thought kane should have been punished rather than the other way around. Deluded?
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There are two incidents outside of the penalty (and what was Kane's supposed offence for that do they say? Allowing himself to be ridden like a racehorse?), Henderson at one point moved his head towards a Columbia player and may have made contact and at one point an England player got close to standing on a Colombians head as they fell in a tangle. They may have a point on the first, the second didn't even look premeditated in slow-motion which almost always makes things look worse.
MedwayModernist said:
I felt for the ref I have to say - he was on a hiding to nothing.

After the penalty, the Colombians truly and utterly lost the plot, and the ref would've been within his rights to have booked about 5 blokes that surrounded him.

Had he done that at the time, I'm almost certain that the Colombians would've lost it even more, which could've led to about 3 or 4 red cards, and he would've been the ref to lose control that much further.

So rock and hard place.

If there was a sin bin for this sort of thing, then he'd have had a better option imo.
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I don't think the Colombians were genuinely outraged at the penalty, both the ludicrous length of the "protesting" and their actions around the penalty spot make me think they knew exactly what they were doing. But I have the benefit of TV pictures and hindsight (and, of course, good old pro-England bias) the ref didn't.
 
alphabet_king said:
Lol Steve I do love it when people that dislike VAR criticise that it's not used more.
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I don't see that much wrong with VAR itself, it's the way it's being used. My view has always been that we are running before we can walk in using it for everything and it should have just been brought in for line decisions first and then tested in depth in other competitions before being used at the World Cup. I am still of the view that there are always going to be judgement calls, which VAR cannot be definitive about, but if it's being used, let's at least employ it for cut and dry decisions!
 
Seen on f/b. Says it all :lol:
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townendgill said:
All of the VAR and technology in the world can't help if the ref can't keep control of the game and he lost control of it when he didn't book any of the Colombians for dissent after he gave the penalty.
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I said on the VAR thread, I think the dissent after the penalty (2 minutes and 10 seconds of arguing) is a deliberate VAR tactic, to stall for time. Once the ball is in the net it is too late. The days of "the ref's decision is final" ended when VAR came in
 
The handling of the match by the ref seems to have got differing reactions depending on geographical location (as you would expect I suppose).
A little survey on TalkSport revealed that press in and around Central/South America are lambasting the ref, saying he favoured The English whereas just about all of Europe (including wales and Scotland ironically) are saying we deserved to win because of the Colombian shinanigans.
It would appear that values and standards are different depending where you come from, can't say I was surprised at the antics on display, it was pretty much what we've come to expect from South American teams. Even Brazil have, in the past, let it into their way of playing the "beautiful" game.
What did surprise and impress me was how well our young team dealt with it. There was very little in the way of retaliation (as mentioned above, Rooney and Beckham incidents spring to mind. Can you imagine Rooney getting block tackled by the coach at half time and not chinning the little twat?).
This seems to have been a product of the calm methodical way Southgate puts his teams out and I have to say, I'm becoming more and more impressed with that particular individual every time I see/hear him speak.
As for the ref, I'm sure I read somewhere that he was one of the lowest scoring officials from the group stage but was kept on when higher scoring refs have been let go. I hear on the radio this morning that he is also being kept for the latter knockout stages too. Now I get that they have to keep certain nationalities of ref to allow for impartiality but this guy seems to be living a charmed life.
 
Nobby_66 said:
A little survey on TalkSport revealed that press in and around Central/South America are lambasting the ref, saying he favoured The English whereas just about all of Europe (including wales and Scotland ironically) are saying we deserved to win because of the Colombian shinanigans.
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That seems to imply that fans are biased towards their own teams???
 
One reaction from a Colombian fan on Twitter suggested the ref was biased towards "his Anglo Saxon friends".

England could suggest the reason the Colombian was not sent off was that he was biased towards his American continent friends.:grinning:
 
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