Here we go! | Page 119 | Vital Football

Here we go!

Strett said:
I am a firm believer in workers rights; workers should have the right to work as many hours (allowing for safety considerations) that they want.
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To be fair, whilst we have no idea if the government actually is planning to do this, you can easily work more than 48 hours a week if you want to. Five years since I worked, but workers who wanted to just signed a form. I believe it's the same now. From what I remember many people (mainly women) including a few I knew did actually reduce their working hours (think it was down to 16?) because they could get more in credits than bothering to work more hours. Can't remember why that was the case though.

My daughter is currently working over 60 hours per week, though quite a lot of that is classified as Self Employed. Ironic that since covid affected her self employment that she's got more hours.
 
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Lienking said:
To be fair, whilst we have no idea if the government actually is planning to do this, you can easily work more than 48 hours a week if you want to. Five years since I worked, but workers who wanted to just signed a form. I believe it's the same now. From what I remember many people (mainly women) including a few I knew did actually reduce their working hours (think it was down to 16?) because they could get more in credits than bothering to work more hours. Can't remember why that was the case though.

My daughter is currently working over 60 hours per week, though quite a lot of that is classified as Self Employed.
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In some ways you can look to the civil service to see what Givernment intentions are.

The civil service were one of, if not the first to erode pensions although Labour were heavily involved in this one too.

As recently as two years ago, several departments were offering their staff lump sums of £500 iirc to permanently reduce their annual leave. You can guarantee that was just an opening gambit.
 
Basha73 said:
In some ways you can look to the civil service to see what Givernment intentions are.

The civil service were one of, if not the first to erode pensions although Labour were heavily involved in this one too.

As recently as two years ago, several departments were offering their staff lump sums of £500 iirc to permanently reduce their annual leave. You can guarantee that was just an opening gambit.
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You are talking about a different thing here though. You are talking about reductions in benefits at a particular organisation that probably offers more than the legal minimum, rather than a change in government legislation reducing workers rights. Most private companies have realised that things like index linked salary related pension schemes are unaffordable.
 
Lienking said:
You are talking about a different thing here though. You are talking about reductions in benefits at a particular organisation that probably offers more than the legal minimum, rather than a change in government legislation reducing workers rights. Most private companies have realised that things like index linked salary related pension schemes are unaffordable.
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Not at all. You have missed my point.

The government were pretty much the first to change pension schemes for employees.

They are now at the forefront of looking to reduce annual leave for employees.

Where they lead, businesses tend to follow and employee rights have always been a bone of contention with Tory governments.

If you think that they won’t take the opportunity to reduce rights in the coming years then you are kidding yourself.
 
Lienking said:
To be fair, whilst we have no idea if the government actually is planning to do this, you can easily work more than 48 hours a week if you want to. Five years since I worked, but workers who wanted to just signed a form. I believe it's the same now. From what I remember many people (mainly women) including a few I knew did actually reduce their working hours (think it was down to 16?) because they could get more in credits than bothering to work more hours. Can't remember why that was the case though.

My daughter is currently working over 60 hours per week, though quite a lot of that is classified as Self Employed. Ironic that since covid affected her self employment that she's got more hours.
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Yes, correct.
 
Basha73 said:
Not at all. You have missed my point.

The government were pretty much the first to change pension schemes for employees.

They are now at the forefront of looking to reduce annual leave for employees.

Where they lead, businesses tend to follow and employee rights have always been a bone of contention with Tory governments.

If you think that they won’t take the opportunity to reduce rights in the coming years then you are kidding yourself.
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Yes, let's knock the government for doing something that they haven't actually done. There's a massive difference between reducing what holidays people get etc to reducing minimum standards. Didn't we sign up for EU standards anyway ? I worked at a company that when 20 days holidays became a legal minimum, tried to cut new employees holidays to the legal minimum of 12 days plus bank holidays ! (Now 20 days plus BH I believe).
 
Lienking said:
Yes, let's knock the government for doing something that they haven't actually done. There's a massive difference between reducing what holidays people get etc to reducing minimum standards. Didn't we sign up for EU standards anyway ? I worked at a company that when 20 days holidays became a legal minimum, tried to cut new employees holidays to the legal minimum of 12 days plus bank holidays ! (Now 20 days plus BH I believe).
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So you want to cheer them on for reducing working people’s rights? That’s a new one, even for you.

And it’s not a case that it hasn’t happened. It is already happening. While we were in the EU there was a minimum level they could aim for and that’s the way it was going. Now the EU minimums don’t apply do you think they will stop at those levels or do you think they will keep going?

I will give you a clue. People like Rees Mogg think the ‘plebs’ should have minimal rights if any.

It might not affect you directly but I can guarantee that it will affect your children and grandchildren.
 
That cannot happen...
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Of course that won't happen...
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We wouldn't do that...
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They're only talking about it...
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Other countries do it...
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It always used to be like that...
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It hasn't happened yet...
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Let's see how it goes before we judge...
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It will only affect a small proportion of society...
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It wasn't the idea's fault. They just didn't implement it properly...
v
v
v
Oh dear.
 
in_the_top_one said:
That cannot happen...
v
Of course that won't happen...
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We wouldn't do that...
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They're only talking about it...
v
Other countries do it...
v
It always used to be like that...
v
It hasn't happened yet...
v
Let's see how it goes before we judge...
v
It will only affect a small proportion of society...
v
It wasn't the idea's fault. They just didn't implement it properly...
v
v
v
Oh dear.
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Absolutely.

The worry for me is that these things have been ‘talked about’ for a long time in certain circles.

Brexit and the ‘deal’ we have means that now people can do more than just ‘talk’ about it.
 
in_the_top_one said:
That cannot happen...
v
Of course that won't happen...
v
We wouldn't do that...
v
They're only talking about it...
v
Other countries do it...
v
It always used to be like that...
v
It hasn't happened yet...
v
Let's see how it goes before we judge...
v
It will only affect a small proportion of society...
v
It wasn't the idea's fault. They just didn't implement it properly...
v
v
v
Oh dear.
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I 5hought that was a Lienking post for a minute Lots of his lines there...:cool:
 
Strett said:
I am a firm believer in workers rights; workers should have the right to work as many hours (allowing for safety considerations) that they want.

This could be used to close up the benefits trap.

Many at my place don't work overtime because it would impact tax credits they receive, even though they want to work because the time and half pay is a good incentive.
There could be some out of the box thinking like encourage people to work more, by reducing tax on hours over 37, or even make it tax free. It would reduce the load on working tax credits.

We have many opportunities to make the system suit our economy, the big question for me is do we have the government to think creatively??
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And what about those on a salary? ( no overtime just a flat monthly salary). The 48 hour max. Rule at least protected them from their employer abusing them. I lived and worked in the UK and once I was given a document that I had to sign which said that I was ok ( of something on those lines) with working more than 48 hours a week ( again, I was salaried so I was gaining nothing). When I asked what happens if I dont sign this document they told me that they will have to monitor my working hours so not to exceed the 48. In reality, when I asked my colleagues I was told that, what would really happen if I don't sign this document, they ( the company) will find a way how to fire me as they( my employer) couldn't afford to have someone within the staff that dont 'belong' to the company and basically works from 7 till 6 Mon-Fri and 7 till 4 on Saturday...if the 48 hour rule is removed, first it will be sold that workers can do as much overtime as they want, but those on a fixed salary will have any legal protection taken away.
This is Brexit for you. Is it this why the workers wanted to leave the EU?
 
in_the_top_one said:
That cannot happen...
v
Of course that won't happen...
v
We wouldn't do that...
v
They're only talking about it...
v
Other countries do it...
v
It always used to be like that...
v
It hasn't happened yet...
v
Let's see how it goes before we judge...
v
It will only affect a small proportion of society...
v
It wasn't the idea's fault. They just didn't implement it properly...
v
v
v
Oh dear.
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Is this as opposed to inventing something that could happen, moan about it for four years, pan the government for allowing the thing to happen which hasn't happened , hold a march to try to overturn a democratic vote etc
 
Lienking said:
Is this as opposed to inventing something that could happen, moan about it for four years, pan the government for allowing the thing to happen which hasn't happened , hold a march to try to overturn a democratic vote etc
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It is perfectly legitimate to criticise the government for plans they have, and for what those plans might lead to- especially when you distrust their motives.

And we have every reason to, given that all but one of the "Britannia Unchained" "Singapore on Thames" brigade are now in the cabinet.

Of course this should be opposed now; it will he too late later
 
Pope John XXIII said:
It is perfectly legitimate to criticise the government for plans they have, and for what those plans might lead to- especially when you distrust their motives.

And we have every reason to, given that all but one of the "Britannia Unchained" "Singapore on Thames" brigade are now in the cabinet.

Of course this should be opposed now; it will he too late later
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What is concerning is he obviously doesn’t believe that any of this either can or will happen despite the evidence of cronyism, incompetence and sheer bloody mindedness that is on display already.
 
I always figured overtime was a bad thing on several fronts, not least the wages for those on time n half and double pay hours could be paying for another person to have a job. If working for yourself then its a bit different. But as an employee I think it should be like 32 hours a week. (Im self employed and probably work 60 hours plus but im not denying anyone else a role :))
 
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