GFC Holdings Ltd restored to Companies Register | Page 9 | Vital Football

GFC Holdings Ltd restored to Companies Register

itstimupnorth said:
I doubt that under that definition no-one in the first world is debt free.
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On a philosophical and sociological note, while I was cleaning the windows (actually, not a euphemism) it occurred to me that actually, under the dictionary definition of debt, in the present world, usually only those with assets have debt.
 
itstimupnorth said:
I'm not surmising what he means, I'm surmising what he doesn't mean, which is that under the dictionary definition of debt the club owes no money to anybody.
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Where ffs do you get that information, when the last consolidated accounts of the Gillingham FC group shows indebtedness of £10m? We'll wait and see if the debt has disappeared when the next set of accounts are produced, although in your view the club owes no money.

I'm not even sure you know where you're coming from; I can only comment on what is in black and white but you talk about contingent liabilities, loans off balance sheet, moneys not loaned by banks and security given to the bank for loans from others.
 
Wayne.Kerr said:
Where ffs do you get that information, when the last consolidated accounts of the Gillingham FC group shows indebtedness of £10m? We'll wait and see if the debt has disappeared when the next set of accounts are produced, although in your view the club owes no money.
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I think you've rather lost the plot and have started confusing me with Paul Scally. He's the one that said the club was debt free. I'm the one that's saying that he doesn't mean that under the dictionary definition of debt. Read the posts.

Wayne.Kerr said:
I'm not even sure you know where you're coming from; I can only comment on what is in black and white but you talk about contingent liabilities, loans off balance sheet, moneys not loaned by banks and security given to the bank for loans from others.
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The issue started because you were commenting inaccurately on things that were in black and white. You stated "The loan is a fixed and floating charge against everything GFC other than the £1.8m" The loan is a loan (which was not made to GFC), the fixed and floating charge is just that and is against GFC.

The matter of contingent liability arose because IF (as is probably the case) GFC have given guarantees against the loan that DOES represent a contingent liability. It was then a matter of determining whether that liability should be declared in the financial statements.

Quite simple really. Eventually.

And to get back to original point where this all started, there is no document or statement that GFC has made guarantees against the loan, but I think that it's reasonable to apply the duck test

If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck
 
itstimupnorth said:
The matter of contingent liability arose because IF (as is probably the case) GFC have given guarantees against the loan that DOES represent a contingent liability. It was then a matter of determining whether that liability should be declared in the financial statements.
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Probably the case? Ffs it's there in black and white. If there was a contingent liability it would be recorded in the notes.There's not and it wasn't now fuck off with your little bit of learning.
 
You are now to this thread what a creationist is to evolution theory.

If you have actually been following this thread you should have realised that my interpretation of the situation has changed over the past few days, and I am genuinely grateful for your input (despite the manner in which it has been given) which has helped to lead me to what I am now satisfied is one that is more accurate. That situation, whether you are willing to admit it or not, is probably as I posted last night. And I say 'probably' because the ONLY thing that is in black and white (other than the accounts) is the debenture. Everything else after that is speculation. I now think probably very accurate speculation, but there is NO DOCUMENTARY EVIDENCE of anything else, specifically a loan or a loan guarantee.

I know there are other financial professionals on this board. Anyone else willing to comment?
 
itstimupnorth said:
You are now to this thread what a creationist is to evolution theory.

If you have actually been following this thread you should have realised that my interpretation of the situation has changed over the past few days, and I am genuinely grateful for your input (despite the manner in which it has been given) which has helped to lead me to what I am now satisfied is one that is more accurate. That situation, whether you are willing to admit it or not, is probably as I posted last night. And I say 'probably' because the ONLY thing that is in black and white (other than the accounts) is the debenture. Everything else after that is speculation. I now think probably very accurate speculation, but
itstimupnorth said:
there is NO DOCUMENTARY EVIDENCE of anything else, specifically a loan or a loan guarantee.
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The accounts report a loan - previously it was mentioned as a bank loan - and there is evidence on the Companies House site of a charge on the assets of GFC Ltd

I know there are other financial professionals on this board. Anyone else willing to comment?
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I started the thread; I'm a qualified accountant and fellow of the Institute of Taxation. In my view, the accounts have been prepared according to the rules [for private limited companies], although I'm a bit puzzled why companies in the group have been dissolved and restored.
 
Trev_GFC said:
They probably don’t want their head bitten off over some trivial point.
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Plus all the other people with financial backgrounds said their pieces back in July when Wayne first started to go on about it. It is only Wayne who still wants to go on about it and he luckily found a couple of new people on the forums who foolishly decided to respond.
 
I have e-mailed Mr Scally to ask him if we are in debt to the tune of over £9M but he avoided the question. Typical!

That said, he put me in contact with a bloke in Dubai with "inside knowledge" of the emerging digital optimizer market.

Happy days!
 
Baghdad_Rob said:
Plus all the other people with financial backgrounds said their pieces back in July when Wayne first started to go on about it. It is only Wayne who still wants to go on about it and he luckily found a couple of new people on the forums who foolishly decided to respond.
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I went on about it because there were recent changes in filings at Companies House. The new guy comes along; admits he's not an accountant and then starts querying matters that are determined by the Companies Act. While I'm not convinced by all things PS has done regarding the financial affairs of the Club, I am of the opinion that the accounts/notes are all proper and correct.
 
Wayne.Kerr said:
I started the thread; I'm a qualified accountant and fellow of the Institute of Taxation. In my view, the accounts have been prepared according to the rules [for private limited companies], although I'm a bit puzzled why companies in the group have been dissolved and restored.
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I fully agree, but we know that accounts don't always tell all the story, and what I've been trying to find out is what at least part of the rest of the story might be (if there is one).

Wayne, apologies that I've hijacked your thread, but it seemed an obvious place to start as my enquiries followed on from a discussion that already existed. There is a follow up to this which I have started as a separate thread.
 
itstimupnorth said:
I fully agree, but we know that accounts don't always tell all the story, and what I've been trying to find out is what at least part of the rest of the story might be (if there is one).

Wayne, apologies that I've hijacked your thread, but it seemed an obvious place to start as my enquiries followed on from a discussion that already existed. There is a follow up to this which I have started as a separate thread.
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You should go on the stage
 
Very much seems that Wayne spends his time practicing arguing with himself in a mirror. :ROFLMAO:
 
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