Fulham v Tottenham match thread | Page 18 | Vital Football

Fulham v Tottenham match thread

Spursex said:
If I am critical of anyone, it would be Poch for not using him more in the last 18 months to keep him ticking over, sharp and perhaps closer to match fitness - of course he may not like him and so wouldn't give him more minutes, but lorente was a Poch pick and so that one is down to him.
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I agree. You cant expect a player who is fit though hardly plays to come out firering on all canon. Fernando needs time.

Well Trippier is a bit a strange one for me such a good crosser.
He played like a winger yesterday but never tries to take on the defender or make space for him to release his best asset, the crosses. When a player is closing him down he always takes that backpass instead of taking the player on. Rose at least tries, he's just a terrible crosser.

In attacking area he would always take the easy back pass. In the midfield zone somehow he sometimes risks things. shouldnt it be the other way round.
 
Spursex said:
I couldn't help but think it wasn't a lack of faith, but more one of settling for the draw and not wanting to kick Lorente when he was down (who may become very important against the chav's) ?

But who knows, I often struggle with Poch's game management and late substitutions - but didn't Nkoudo do the trick?
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Think someone on here said Poch put in his book that he thinks subbing a player who is having a bad game is damaging for them? He definitely believes you catch more flies with honey when it comes to handling attacking players in game.
 
Spursex said:
I couldn't help but think it wasn't a lack of faith, but more one of settling for the draw and not wanting to kick Lorente when he was down (who may become very important against the chav's) ?

But who knows, I often struggle with Poch's game management and late substitutions - but didn't Nkoudo do the trick?
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I wouldn't have took the useless plank Llorente off but as you say I guess NKoudou made the difference in the end, just think it would have been better to see what Sterling was all about.
 
I’m not sure I buy into the idea that anybody earning SEVENTYFIVE THOUSAND POUNDS a week needs to be given a few games to get up to speed. Not in the middle of the season with all the training they have had. I might accept it if they are coming back from injury, or not had a pre season like all the others .
I’m sure as fuck that anybody earning that amount of money shouldn’t need babying/ cajouling . What else are they paid for !
I’m also not having this lack of confidence thing. If you’re not in the first eleven , and you have lost confidence , it can only have happened on the training ground. In which case , picking a player who has no confidence ,at 33 years old over an 18 year old , ready to bust a gut with all the confidence in the world , wouldn’t make sense .
If neither Jansen or Llorente can’t be arsed then we should be giving the kids who can be bothered a chance to make the grade . All in my humble opinion ! Ha ha
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
I’m not sure I buy into the idea that anybody earning SEVENTYFIVE THOUSAND POUNDS a week needs to be given a few games to get up to speed. Not in the middle of the season with all the training they have had. I might accept it if they are coming back from injury, or not had a pre season like all the others .
I’m sure as fuck that anybody earning that amount of money shouldn’t need babying/ cajouling . What else are they paid for !
I’m also not having this lack of confidence thing. If you’re not in the first eleven , and you have lost confidence , it can only have happened on the training ground. In which case , picking a player who has no confidence ,at 33 years old over an 18 year old , ready to bust a gut with all the confidence in the world , wouldn’t make sense .
If neither Jansen or Llorente can’t be arsed then we should be giving the kids who can be bothered a chance to make the grade . All in my humble opinion ! Ha ha
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Sterling is 20 and Parrott is not yet 17. I think I will trust Poch in deciding when to play them. Sterling may have played if we had a decent lead yesterday. Llorente was already under pressure yesterday , I could see it on his face. But then the own goal put even more on his shoulders. He was in position to rectify twice , he may have tried too hard on the second one, there was a lot of movement and turn of his head to direct the ball. The first he caught clean and firm. Ironically if he had duffed it downward he probably would have beat the keeper. I don't think he had much chance to direct it left or right.
 
Spursex said:
You're assuming we didn't try and that who we approached was happy to be a bench warmer.
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I'm making no such assumption. I am saying unequivocally that the idea there was no one on planet earth we could get is bogus. We chose to save money.
 
I think too much negative emphasis on Llorente,there were many others on the pitch not playing intelligently.Trying to play one -twos in a packed penalty area doesn't work unless you have Messi,Suarez & Neymar etc with quick feet & minds to match. We don't have so let's go more direct,break fast,hit long balls to the wings to stretch & open a packed defence .Then get in good crosses to feet or head-Llorente will convert with better service I'm sure of that.N'koudou must play against Chelsea,he's young ,quick & can deliver an inswinging cross from the right-a defender's nightmare.Football principles don't change ,only the personel.
 
In fairness, we can sometimes carry Son defensively and get outdone by top sides. That's when he's still running around a lot, but not switching on. To think what Chelsea will do at Stamford Bridge with Llorente doing neither is a little scary to be honest. We'll get camped in our half without an outlet.

Moura or Sterling need to start Thursday's game. Ditto with Dier. That at least gives us a chance of hurting them with Eriksen in his best position slightly further forward. I don't see any chance to rest Lamela who should perhaps be put over on the left channel.
 
We don't need to hurt them unless they score. I would put the emphasis on defence. With Dier back, Davies and Rose fit, Toby and Vert plus Sanchez all fit. Our defence is in good shape unlike our attack. Try to hit them on the break yes, Moura and Winks are no slouches and Lamela has shown he can provide passes on the break , remember that one fairly recently, he ran from quite deep in our half on his own and passed to Kane I think who tucked it away.
 
Nick Real Deal said:
Sterling is 20 and Parrott is not yet 17. I think I will trust Poch in deciding when to play them. Sterling may have played if we had a decent lead yesterday. Llorente was already under pressure yesterday , I could see it on his face. But then the own goal put even more on his shoulders. He was in position to rectify twice , he may have tried too hard on the second one, there was a lot of movement and turn of his head to direct the ball. The first he caught clean and firm. Ironically if he had duffed it downward he probably would have beat the keeper. I don't think he had much chance to direct it left or right.
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He completely missed the second one . He should have scored with both . Sandra would have scored both
How on earth was Llorente already under pressure , so much so that you could see it on his face . If you could see it then why didn't the rest of the proffessional training staff see it and either not play him or get him off .
When playing football ,living a pampered life ,living the dream of millions and getting paid obscene amounts of money and receiving obscene bonuses for doing what you are paid for in the first place ,becomes so stressful , it's time to give it up , or knuckle down and give it your best shot. Ask Danny Rose .
 
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Talking of Danny Rose ........did anyone else notice how often he was bringing the ball inside and crossing with his right foot on Sunday . He also did the same and had a terrific right foot shot which just caught a deflection onto the bar . Can't say that's something I've noticed much before
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
He completely missed the second one . He should have scored with both . Sandra would have scored both
How on earth was Llorente already under pressure , so much so that you could see it on his face . If you could see it then why didn't the rest of the proffessional training staff see it and either not play him or get him off .
When playing football ,living a pampered life ,living the dream of millions and getting paid obscene amounts of money and receiving obscene bonuses for doing what you are paid for in the first place ,becomes so stressful , it's time to give it up , or knuckle down and give it your best shot. Ask Danny Rose .
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Sorry but this is grossly unfair to Llorente. Just because pro athletes make alot of money doesn't eliminate the enormous pressure when called upon to replace one of te best in the world at his craft. If anything, it increases the feelings of accountability, and pressure.

I guarantee everyone in the professional staff would be aware of how he'd likely feel, being many of them are former pro footballers and can relate. There'd be no reason to be overly concerned about him prior to the match, sometimes this 'pressure' results in the best performances, sometimes not, like yesterday.

I would start him again in the next league match, not sure he's a good foil for Chelsea regardless of his last performance. I'd expect he'd have a very good game the next time out after having gotten all the bullshit outta his system vs Fulham.

If not I'd hand him a train ticket.

.
 
To me it is about tactics and being able to adapt to the flow of the game and how the opposition is playing you. Against Fulham Llorente simply was ineffective...yeah he should have converted some, that is on him, but his hold up play and his aerial threat strength was largely taken away. Ok...that didn't work...make a change...maybe put someone with pace up top and see if they can get behind the defense...etc...

BL - MP, in my opinion, needs to be a bit more proactive and not so passive during matches. Take the fight to the opposition...force them to change. Dictate the damn game. I would like to say MP is too reactive, and sometimes does make changes...but largely they are very late...and sometimes not at all. This is my largest beef with MP. When games are flowing nicely for us, all is well...when shit hits the fan...this is when a manager makes his money...I am not sold on MP being very good at this yet.
 
xvausch said:
Sorry but this is grossly unfair to Llorente. Just because pro athletes make alot of money doesn't eliminate the enormous pressure when called upon to replace one of te best in the world at his craft. If anything, it increases the feelings of accountability, and pressure.

I guarantee everyone in the professional staff would be aware of how he'd likely feel, being many of them are former pro footballers and can relate. There'd be no reason to be overly concerned about him prior to the match, sometimes this 'pressure' results in the best performances, sometimes not, like yesterday.

I would start him again in the next league match, not sure he's a good foil for Chelsea regardless of his last performance. I'd expect he'd have a very good game the next time out after having gotten all the bullshit outta his system vs Fulham.

If not I'd hand him a train ticket.

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Would your expectation of his performances extend to every time he comes on as a substitute then . Sorry , I just don't get it . The non first eleven living in awe and trepidation of the ' superstar first eleven '. Really !
Sorry , I would be out there ,busting a gut , showing them that i should be the one being picked every week. Harry who ! ..... I'm the one you need ,look what I can do for the club .

What's the point in having these players with the wrong mindset .
Grossly unfair .... Really . I know I'm probably from a different generation than you X , and I always admire your input ,but we are way , worlds apart on this one .
If for one second , Anyone thought Poch told him " sorry to have to pick you today, Llorrers old chap , I know how difficult it must be for you ,and what a predicament I'm putting you in " then that is a pretty damning state of affairs that this club is in
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
Would your expectation of his performances extend to every time he comes on as a substitute then . Sorry , I just don't get it . The non first eleven living in awe and trepidation of the ' superstar first eleven '. Really !
Sorry , I would be out there ,busting a gut , showing them that i should be the one being picked every week. Harry who ! ..... I'm the one you need ,look what I can do for the club .

What's the point in having these players with the wrong mindset .
Grossly unfair .... Really . I know I'm probably from a different generation than you X , and I always admire your input ,but we are way , worlds apart on this one .
If for one second , Anyone thought Poch told him " sorry to have to pick you today, Llorrers old chap , I know how difficult it must be for you ,and what a predicament I'm putting you in " then that is a pretty damning state of affairs that this club is in
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I actually thought that these athletes got paid a lot of Money precisely for the fact that they were proffesionsals and were actually expected to be able to handle the pressure. Surely I haven't got this wrong
 
cotton wool society..(.risk averse health and safety paralysis) ...poor love having to go out on a pitch and work! See what side I'm on in this argument ......then again as Walthy says we come from a different generation to many on here...old farts we may be but tough as nails!
 
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