Fulham v Tottenham match thread

[Spursex]

Jannsen fitness is his biggest problem from what I can see, the impression is he doesn't train hard enough.

He didn't/doesn't and wouldn't control his diet or apply himself - in our coaches book, that's tantamount to suicide and indicative of a shit attitude - so we gave up on ever trying to improve him.

Of course you can blame our recruitment team for not realising that he had an 'in and out' type of attitude towards his own career, but ultimately, it's down to the player - well that and his agent making demands that were downright dumb.

You win your chance with Poch by training like you mean it.

 

[Spursex]

Tough times or us. too many key players injured/missing. Would be difficult for any top team.
Imagine Barca are missing, Messi, Suarez, Isco and Busqets.
Liverpool without Sala, Mane, Firmino and wijnaldum
City without Sterling, Silva, Aguero and De Bruyne

They all would be strugling..... Even with their big squads they wouldnt be competing at the top. So untill we have a couple of them back we will be strugling, every win is a bonus. Dont expect us to be a top 3 side without Kane, Son, Moura and Sissoko/Dembele.

But we're Spurs; some Spurs fans think we can and should produce, no matter what.

 

[spurdon]

But we're Spurs; some Spurs fans think we can and should produce, no matter what.

EX with even a modicum of forethought we would and should not be in this situation.

 

[Greavswasthegreatest]

Well as a spurs fan, despite the absence of Kane Sissokko and Son and Moura still expect the rest of our squad to not struggle against a poor team like Fulham.

 

[Spursex]

Why is it that criticism is seen by some as disloyalty? We're a professional outfit, good skills, well trained and mostly well paid. To watch a player like Eriksen, for whom I have much respect, play mediocre for most of the game (aside from his cross for the equalizer). Trippier, Lamella were off their game. Llorente was out of his depth. We cannot hope to compete on four fronts with this squad. Potch is brilliant in talking his players up before and after a match, but he is also too smart not to be realistic away from the media. We can't hope to secure a competent striker in this window, so it comes down to priorities. CL is a must.

After a tough summer, another international campaign, injuries, a ridiculous number of games that we are barely equipped to deal with after such a bad injury run - below par performances shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, at least not to anyone that's played the game at any level and understood the toll 2/3 games a week at a high tempo takes from you both mentally and physically.

I'm perhaps prepared to be more forgiving for Llorente as one or two touches that could have gone the other way - and he'd be lauded as short term answer by many.

Strikers play on confidence, they need sharpness that comes from fitness - if we can sneak through a couple of more games where he fins that, in a months time we may just be looking at him completely differently.

Top 4 should be our only priority now.

 

[Spursex]

EX with even a modicum of forethought we would and should not be in this situation.

maybe, but then if we'd been privileged to what might have happened in the summer and had to make the decision to do nothing and wait - I wonder what decision we might have come to?

I have perhaps some understanding of what the internal 'debate' was/is.

I think we took a risk, but believed we had options that could and would work.

I am not yet convinced they won't work out.

 

[Spursex]

One thing that I don't think has been mentioned here is that Fulham's pitch was shit, they'd let the grass grow and in places (in the middle) where much of our game is played it looked like a ploughed field - at halftime I swear Fulhams ground staff were actually making it worse!!

We won, they played well, but were also as dirty as fuck, if any of them look like they can get out of trouble, it's fulham.

Well done Winksy.

If only he would run beyone the oppositions midfield more (as I keep begging him to do) I know he'd get more goals.

 

[spurdon]

maybe, but then if we'd been privileged to what might have happened in the summer and had to make the decision to do nothing and wait - I wonder what decision we might have come to?

I have perhaps some understanding of what the internal 'debate' was/is.

I think we took a risk, but believed we had options that could and would work.

I am not yet convinced they won't work out.

They have already not worked out. Harry Kane is a once in generation world class talent an asset that adequate squad cover should have been purchased to protect. You don't get gifted a Ferrari and use it like an Uber in Bangalore. Your in business, forget club internal policy, just clearly appraise this scenario. I don't care if you have to over pay a real player to sit on the bench 80% of the time. Llorente was clearly not that. Once that was determined a world class young option should have been acquired whatever the cost. Because it pails into the attrition on Kanes value chronic ankle injuries will do.

 

[Spursex]

They have already not worked out. Harry Kane is a once in generation world class talent an asset that adequate squad cover should have been purchased to protect. You don't get gifted a Ferrari and use it like an Uber in Bangalore. Your in business, forget club internal policy, just clearly appraise this scenario. I don't care if you have to over pay a real player to sit on the bench 80% of the time. Llorente was clearly not that. Once that was determined a world class young option should have been acquired whatever the cost. Because it pails into the attrition on Kanes value chronic ankle injuries will do.

You're assuming we didn't try and that who we approached was happy to be a bench warmer.

 

[muttley]

After a tough summer, another international campaign, injuries, a ridiculous number of games that we are barely equipped to deal with after such a bad injury run - below par performances shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, at least not to anyone that's played the game at any level and understood the toll 2/3 games a week at a high tempo takes from you both mentally and physically.

I'm perhaps prepared to be more forgiving for Llorente as one or two touches that could have gone the other way - and he'd be lauded as short term answer by many.

Strikers play on confidence, they need sharpness that comes from fitness - if we can sneak through a couple of more games where he fins that, in a months time we may just be looking at him completely differently.

Top 4 should be our only priority now.

You might be right Ex. The issue most of us had was his application in the game. The guy wouldn't even move 10 yards for aerial balls despite one of their centre halves only being 5'10". He wouldn't shut players down and wasn't showing for the ball. His touch wasn't there and clearly a pass rate of 26% reported by Sky sort of proved that. I think that's a point you're making. Well guess what, if you don't bust a gut and get fit then your touch won't follow.

Even at 33 years old, is it unfair to ask him to leave it all out there and go through the pain barrier for THFC? Never happened in 2 seasons at the club.

Him fluffing his lines in front of goal wasn't really the issue. They all did that last week against Utd. We can surely forgive him for it in his first game back in the league team for a while.

 

[Spursex]

You might be right Ex. The issue most of us had was his application in the game. The guy wouldn't even move 10 yards for aerial balls despite one of their centre halves only being 5'10". He wouldn't shut players down and wasn't showing for the ball. His touch wasn't there and clearly a pass rate of 26% reported by Sky sort of proved that. I think that's a point you're making. Well guess what, if you don't bust a gut and get fit then your touch won't follow.

Even at 33 years old, is it unfair to ask him to leave it all out there and go through the pain barrier for THFC? Never happened in 2 seasons at the club.

Him fluffing his lines in front of goal wasn't really the issue. They all did that last week against Utd. We can surely forgive him for it in his first game back in the league team for a while.

For now, I'd trust in his proven talent - how quick or even if it will return to show us what he can do - is the multo million pound question.

IF another PL striker was available, I think I'd sell him back to la liga (what he was expecting) and cash in for whatever I can get for him, but unless that elusive PL ready striker can be found before Som/Moura return, I've no idea.

 

[Harry-Kari]

After a tough summer, another international campaign, injuries, a ridiculous number of games that we are barely equipped to deal with after such a bad injury run - below par performances shouldn't be a surprise to anyone, at least not to anyone that's played the game at any level and understood the toll 2/3 games a week at a high tempo takes from you both mentally and physically.

I'm perhaps prepared to be more forgiving for Llorente as one or two touches that could have gone the other way - and he'd be lauded as short term answer by many.

Strikers play on confidence, they need sharpness that comes from fitness - if we can sneak through a couple of more games where he fins that, in a months time we may just be looking at him completely differently.

Top 4 should be our only priority now.

Agree regarding Lorente....but confidence apart he needs to be used in a way that plays to his strengths which we hardly ever do....opportunities to cross from the FBs were there but spurned in favour of playing backwards and sideways...similarly he pulled away from the defender asking for a ball into feet for a lay off only to be ignored for the great sideways pass.

On the radio commentary, Jeans pointed out that when we did begin to mix it up and pumped some balls in his general direction, it didn’t matter whether he won them or not because his presence forced defenders to make poor clearances which in one case lead to our first goal. As you said Ex, on another day he could have had a couple of goals from headers when he received the service.

I’ve only seen highlights but it didn’t appear that after the own goal any teammate went to him and gave him the hard luck son, get up the other end and score pep talk which shows lack of real leadership on the pitch.

 

[Spursex]

Agree regarding Lorente....but confidence apart he needs to be used in a way that plays to his strengths which we hardly ever do....opportunities to cross from the FBs were there but spurned in favour of playing backwards and sideways...similarly he pulled away from the defender asking for a ball into feet for a lay off only to be ignored for the great sideways pass.

On the radio commentary, Jeans pointed out that when we did begin to mix it up and pumped some balls in his general direction, it didn’t matter whether he won them or not because his presence forced defenders to make poor clearances which in one case lead to our first goal. As you said Ex, on another day he could have had a couple of goals from headers when he received the service.

I’ve only seen highlights but it didn’t appear that after the own goal any teammate went to him and gave him the hard luck son, get up the other end and score pep talk which shows lack of real leadership on the pitch.

I don't recall anyone giving a 'hard luck Son' - but suspect that's because all we wanted to do was not dwell on it? But I'm guessing.

My biggest problem yesterday was that I thought Trippier was once again very very poor and the burden fell to Rose and his final ball just wasn't good enough.

 

[vinniecopenhagen]

Good win in the end but that was one bad ball away from being an absolute disaster of a game, in fact I would say it probably still was given the Dele injury which I guess we will be without him for a number of weeks now.

We were terrible lets be honest, Fulham are probably the worst team in the league and we made them look alright, I'm not even going to start blaming the players (apart from Llorente) as that team is not even close to being our first team, Poch is either a soft touch or an absolute mug, all his interviews he says we don't need signings or we have enough quality to cope, today's game was clear to see that is far from the truth. We need at least 3 new signings this window to just about cope but we all know we ain't signing no one.

Oh and Llorente is awful, we haven't got a hope with him playing up top against the likes of Chelsea, Dortmund etc. I honestly expect us to be out of the League Cup and FA Cup by this time next week and a few weeks we will be out of the CL and it's all Poch/Levy's fault.

Agree ,apart from Pochs fault

If you're too busy whinging to celebrate a winner by a homegrown Winks, against all odds, with all 3 of our top scorers out, with the last kick of the game what's the point.

Not aimed at anyone in particular but the negativity is insane amongst our fanbase.

I don't think anyone is begrudging the win freund,I think the negativity stems from the frustration we all feel about the situation we currently find ourselves in,a situation that could have been avoided if we had signed some cover in the TW.

 

[muttley]

I don't recall anyone giving a 'hard luck Son' - but suspect that's because all we wanted to do was not dwell on it? But I'm guessing.

My biggest problem yesterday was that I thought Trippier was once again very very poor and the burden fell to Rose and his final ball just wasn't good enough.

Agree about Trippier, but it was more than that for me. It didn't matter whether it was Trippier or Rose or alternatively Vertonghen or Toby just inside them or Dele, Eriksen or Lamela. They were all passing up opportunities to cross the ball and on the rare occasion they did, they were mostly awful balls.

This is becoming a disease with Poch's line-ups over the years. They are all so scared of losing possession and teams counter attacking them that they just will not cross. N'Koudou showed in an instant what it means to put in the early cross into a dangerous area just like every team does to us.

Only 4 great crosses in the game from us. 2 goals and Llorente nearly scored with another 2. I say it again, Llorente is 6'4" and was up against 3 centre halves with the tallest was 6'1. Odoi is 5'10" and Dele's goal totally exposed him when we finally put in a decent ball.

It was tactical ineptitude by Poch and his players in that line-up against the opposition.

 

[freundorfoe]

5% return on crosses to goals is about standard. Think we hit around 40 yesterday, 2 goals. It's definitely a riskier way of creating though as you're more likely to lose possession than keep it.

We're in a strange tactical cross roads where to play to Llorente's strengths we need to hit more crosses, but that will make us more susceptible to counter attacks and without Kane, Son and Dele at the other end we perhaps need to focus on being more defensively solid? Do we just commit less players forward, play deeper and leave Llorente and co with it all to do at their end Vs Chelsea with minimal support?

 

[Nick Real Deal]

Llorente knew he may have to play the whole game. He is 33 , a big unit and not 90 minutes conditioned. So I can understand why he wasn't running around like a terrier. He was probably pacing himself. I have seen his finishing ability and he was mortified he didn't put those chances away, especially the second one. The first I don't think he had much chance to direct it and the keeper did his job.

I'm not going to dismiss him based on that.

 

[Spursex]

Llorente knew he may have to play the whole game. He is 33 , a big unit and not 90 minutes conditioned. So I can understand why he wasn't running around like a terrier. He was probably pacing himself. I have seen his finishing ability and he was mortified he didn't put those chances away, especially the second one. The first I don't think he had much chance to direct it and the keeper did his job.

I'm not going to dismiss him based on that.

If I am critical of anyone, it would be Poch for not using him more in the last 18 months to keep him ticking over, sharp and perhaps closer to match fitness - of course he may not like him and so wouldn't give him more minutes, but lorente was a Poch pick and so that one is down to him.

 

[ScottDaYid]

Can't believe we didn't bring Sterling on for the last 10 minutes at least, I could understand if we were winning but we needed a goal, a young, hungry striker is surely what we needed. I know we got the winner but it still would have been nice to see him come on. He obviously has 0 faith in him.

 

[Spursex]

Can't believe we didn't bring Sterling on for the last 10 minutes at least, I could understand if we were winning but we needed a goal, a young, hungry striker is surely what we needed. I know we got the winner but it still would have been nice to see him come on. He obviously has 0 faith in him.

I couldn't help but think it wasn't a lack of faith, but more one of settling for the draw and not wanting to kick Lorente when he was down (who may become very important against the chav's) ?

But who knows, I often struggle with Poch's game management and late substitutions - but didn't Nkoudo do the trick?