Europe In Out Shake it all about | Page 160 | Vital Football

Europe In Out Shake it all about

Well here we are...the thread is almost 3 years old, 159 pages long with over 3,000 posts!

I can honestly say that I have read every page of this thread and probably every post, (sad bastard, yes I know).

Yet this is, to my knowledge, my first post in thread. Why? Well basically I am normally too busy to be bothered. So why bother now?

Well it's following KefKat's post last night, which contains so many inaccuracies and lies I did not feel, on this occasion, I let them go unchallenged.

Firstly, item 9/ WTO. We have been members of the WTO since 1st of January 1995. We currently trade with 24 countries under WTO rules. We have therefore NOT applied to join and have NOT therefore been refused membership and we can trade under WTO rules from the day after we leave the EU or the transition period ends.

Could you please name the countries that have said they are not happy to trade with the UK because we intend to control our border (quotes and evidence please).

As far as I am aware, no formal trade negotiations have taken place between India and the UK, so how do we know that free movement of people will be a condition put forward by India, let alone it being agreed. If we are stopping free movement of people from the EU, it is highly unlikely to be granted to India.

Likewise regarding New Zealand. No formal negotiations have taken place. In fact we cannot formally negotiate with any country until we have left the single market/customs union.

With regards to NZ lamb. I can still remember before we joined the Common Market we used to import large quantities of NZ lamb( and very succulent it was too!). What I don't remember, is that it was ruining British agriculture.

I do some business in NZ and when I spoke to a colleague about this subject, he told me that after we joined the Common Market in 1972 NZ had to find new markets for their lamb and now don't particularly need the UK. But if we do a deal with them and the price is right, come on down is what I say!

Regarding the Schengen agreement/treaty. You are correct, with have never joined this scheme and never will. So your mentioning of it, is totally irrelevant.

I may come back on some of the other points that you mentioned when I have more time.

But Kefkat you really must get your facts right before you start preaching.

Talk about politicians telling lies to suit their agenda's.
 
Another lie!

Excuse me Q telling me I lie! Who the flying fcuk do you think you are? I am actually out atm so I will respond to you in full later.

If you seriously think any of them care about the Irish border then you need to see a therapist. Ì am not the only one to aay tgat either. You have women issues by the looks of it? Funny how you haven't picked out anything of what the men said.

If you don't like my attitude don't come it with me as I am not some little girl who will sit in a corner and take your attitude

I am out right now. When I get in I will show you the proof which is available online. Ì will be posting up the links to it later
 
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If someone is mistaken, it doesn't mean they are lying. Lets keep the tone above what we see in Parliament please.
 
There isn't evidence re India / trade deal / wanting immigration quotas (wouldn't be free movement) but it isn't a stretch to think it would be wanted either.
 
most of the 'facts' presented are nothing more than stretches of the imagination which you could spin out to virtually any scenario you'd like to suit your argument.
Some are just incorrect (or lies if you prefer) which is a touch ironic given they've been putting right those leave voters who don't know these facts apparently.
 
Returning to the present impasse in parliament I watched P.M.Q s today. Once again Jeremy Corbyn trotted out his demands regarding the desirability of ruling out a 'No Deal,' option before he will deign to cross the threshold of Number 10 and discuss the way forward on negotiations with Europe. While May's comments on his willingness to talk to all sorts of other groups without preconditions is a regurgitation of this topic from various sources it obviously struck a chord. Personally, I think the reason he won't engage face to face with May is because he has so little understanding of the issues he's championing that he's afraid to put his case to the test. He seems to trot out phrases from a script that have been prepared for him. If he had to actually discuss the merits of his proposals he would be unable to argue his case. He would need his minders to feed him his lines.
The Labour Party needs a greater intellect than Corbyn and the second raters he's surrounded himself with to debate on equal terms with the leaders of almost all the other parties.
 
As already stated I voted for brexit but feel no animosity towards anyone no matter how they voted I see some comments of abuse be they in word or cartoon form and wonder at the intellect of those who post them. My biggest disappointment that the politicians could not work together for the good of the nation. My only regret is the N.Ireland border not something I was aware of at time of voting if i am honest and is still my biggest concern because if ever a community deserved peace and a chance to recover from the horrible decades they have had it is that one. I bare no resentment to the countries within the E.U. but have a lot of concerns regarding the organisation itself and where it was heading at the time of the vote. As a former strong Labour supporter I am utterly appalled at the way the party has stood by made absolutely stupid demands which the E.U. itself said was impossible to achieve (the 6 tests) then done much the same thing when May albeit tongue in cheek offered to talk. Sorry I have a strong dislike of both far right and far left and at the moment the majority of politicians especially those who harp on about democracy and then vote against the wishes of those who elected them be they remain or leave constituencies these are the same MPs who say Parliment is sovereign. Much talk of another vote have no problem with that but even if remain win it cannot see how that solves the problem as it will no doubt become a best of 3 or more.
I do fear the rise of a far right party in this country as is happening in Europe do not want to see it happen here,if history teaches us anything it is that extremes bring disaster.
 
I did not really want to get involved but Re, the Irish border. Its not called the Conservative and unionist party for no reason. the Brexiteers care passionately about the Irish border. Its the reason they are supporting the DUP,s position ( rightly or wrongly ) They want N Ireland treated the same as the rest of this country. That means no backstop. I maintain its all posturing and brinkmanship.
 
I’ve read today in an Independent article that “that a no deal Brexit could force the cancellation of up to 5 million flights”.

The article then talks about 5 million seats (not flights) and it’s suggesting that current flight status will likely be fine, however extra capacity may no be put on.

https://apple.news/AHTI-KpM2T3eO1UUjfymMbA

The media will have a field day with apocalyptic headlines and even stories over the next 2 months, plenty of potential click bait out there I reckon. Flight to Benidorm being cancelled, Baked bean shortages, queues at fuel stations to name three - that’ll get the punters clicking those website pages. And the apocalypse will all be reported by the Daily Mail & Express!
 
I've been told the weather might change. Apparently they won't allow us to have any share of their sunshine if we leave with a no deal.

Worrying.
 
Interesting link danvilla...

Still pretty sure we won't be allowed to do French kissing anymore though. Sad times mate. Sad times.
 
This article in today's IRISH TIMES refutes Fintan O'Toole's analysis.

"The most determined labeller of imperialism as a major factor in the vote for Brexit is a columnist of this newspaper, Fintan O’Toole – whose distinction as a journalist at home and abroad lends resonance to his arguments, but doesn’t improve them.
His book of two months ago, Heroic Failure (Apollo), is a sustained attempt to fix on Britain – or as he more precisely defines it, England – a grand debilitating delusion, the state in the iron mask of imperial nostalgia."



More at -
https://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/why-fintan-o-toole-has-got-brexit-all-wrong-1.3766746
 
There isn't evidence re India / trade deal / wanting immigration quotas (wouldn't be free movement) but it isn't a stretch to think it would be wanted either.

Here you go JF re various on what is happening re trade deals:

BBJ thank you for posting your link/s too

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For The Q, thank you for apologising too

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BringBackMON they are not stretches if you are referring to my post. They are information that is out their in the public arena. Granted I know there is a hell of alot of info out there, so it is often hard to sieve through it. However I haven't quoted anything I haven't read. I am not talking the stereo type tabloid cr*p read either of The Scum/The Xpress and the like.


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My link on the WTO

https://www.export.org.uk/news/424378/UK-fast-track-application-for-WTO-agreement-fails.htm

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The link on India which also includes Australia and what they want

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ax-immigration-rules-free-trade-deal-eu-visa-

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The N-Z lamb I can't find the link atm. I thought I had saved it. I will find it and post it up later.