EU strategy to destroy the Chequers ‘agreement’... | Page 158 | Vital Football

EU strategy to destroy the Chequers ‘agreement’...

chris who said:
Personally I think the plan Theresa May appears to have is if she losses the vote in the commons.Then I think she may well go for a people's vote .But I suspect there may well be just two choices my deal or no Deal?
That of course I believe could be her plan to get us to back her.The thing with that is it depends on if she can hold on to power and take her party with her.A lot of if's but I do think there is something else to this country wide tour that she has undertaken that we have not been told.
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It has all the hallmarks of going to the people but she has said she will not do that. Therefore she should resign if there is a referendum.
 
I have just read this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...el-Tories-risk-destroying-historic-party.html

and while many I am sure will disagree. I fully believe Peter Osborne in the Mail .The current Tory party itself is in real danger of self destruction.I am sure there are many who would certainly be delighted if this were to happen. In some ways I would. However I seriously worry for the future direction of this country. I honestly feel that we need the EU in some capacity to keep this country from total failure.All very well bringing power back to Westminster but if Westminster is a shambles what then?
 
Gills 58 said:
Tarian, I also think you are somewhat deranged.
Your apparent loathing of the EU is irrational. .....
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So.... Waldo, Wa ne.Kerr, Gills58 ..... "deranged" "irrational" "hysterical".....
Is that what it has come down to?
Can't deal with rational argument anymore......?:hmmm:
(Slightly surprised not to have seen the slurs "waycist" or "far right" ... but hey ho ! )

Gills 58 said:
"endangering the future of my children"
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The thing is ....
Those of us who have seen the Common Market morph into the EEC .....then EU.... and since the Single European Act 1986:
* thousands of non-trade rules being imposed on countries in the name of the "Single Market "....
- with the S.M. requiring countries to allow mass migration,.... thus putting up house prices and pressuring public services and transport .....
(..... when no other regional trade deal imposes either .....)
* The impact the Euro on southern Europe - with mass youth un-employment ..... and the Greek debt crisis....

Then one has to wonder why some people are willing to: "endanger their children's future"
..... by staying in such an authoritarian and costly construct as the EU ??
 
Corbyn on tonights news now finally declaring 'Remain' should be an option for people as a 2nd Referendum gains cross party support. A pro Brexit demo attracts a tiny % of the size of the Peoples Vote march in London. Some Leave voters starting to go public on TV and social media to confirm they would now vote differently based on a better understanding of the consequences.
If May's leave deal is rejected then I can see hard line Leavers being swept aside by the 'bullsh*t backlash' that is growing daily.
IMHO of course!
 
Alderman, Wayne, tarian is a troll. You've both been brilliant at answering his deranged postings with facts and common sense, but my advice would be to let the troll wallow in his own demented world and starve him of the oxygen of credibility he desperately needs.
 
chris who said:
I have just read this https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.da...el-Tories-risk-destroying-historic-party.html

and while many I am sure will disagree. I fully believe Peter Osborne in the Mail .The current Tory party itself is in real danger of self destruction.I am sure there are many who would certainly be delighted if this were to happen. In some ways I would. However I seriously worry for the future direction of this country. I honestly feel that we need the EU in some capacity to keep this country from total failure.All very well bringing power back to Westminster but if Westminster is a shambles what then?
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If the Tories split , the only party that will benefit is UKIP.
 
For a strong democracy you need options to vote for.

New Labour blairites took over the Labour party and gained votes by moving more to the centre by adopting tory policies. The tories responding by moving to the same space ending up with little between the two parties.

With the move back to Labour party policies by Corbyn, people started to have a choice. If the tories move back to their traditional policies through this brexit fiasco then voters will definitely have real choices. At least it shows us the real character of many of our politicians lol.
 
shotshy said:
Your children will be fine 58, as will everyone else's.
Folk on here should be far more concerned with the rise of the far right all across Europe that the poxy EU.
Do a bit of reading and research.
It's frightening that a country that is held up as a bastion of European civilisation like Sweden has more that 20% of it's parliament controlled by far right. Denmark, Austria, Italy, Hungary, Germany and many more have huge right wing influence
That actually will endanger your children's future should it continue to rise.
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It's the far right that are pushing for Brexit. Look who's pushing for it. The ERG, Putin, Trump and these sinister nutty far right groups in the USA (Bannon's mob), Murdoch. I could go on.

I agree the rise of fascism is a concern. Us leaving the EU won't do a jot to stop it. We'll be at their mercy. Our very own VG will be ecstatic - says it all.
 
valenciagill said:
If the Tories split , the only party that will benefit is UKIP.
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UKIP is effectively finished now Tommy Robinson is involved. They played a hugely significant role in British political history by campaigning enough to encourage Cameron to promise a referendum but once that was achieved their significance was always going to diminish.

Now they are just becoming an openly fascist party and will occupy the political space that the BNP used to occupy. The minority fringe of nasty, hate-filled racists. All your mates, valencia.
 
Tarian, deranged I said and deranged I meant. To take one of your issues. Youth unemployment in Greece is sod all to do with the EU and everything to do with Greek national policies. Their austerity is a direct result of the bail outs they needed. You can hardly blame the bankers. Without the bankers Greece would have been facing the sort of complete economic meltdown that happened in Argentina. You’re still in the mode of blaming the EU for things that are completely the fault of national governments. If the EU were to intervene to prevent these issues you’d be the first to complain about their interference in national sovereignty.

Study after study has shown that migration has not had the effect on house prices and wages that you claim. I haven’t anything more to go on than academic studies carried out to examine these specific issues. What evidence do you have, a man down the pub ?
 
LancsGordoRoad said:
Low turn-out may well have had something to do with the strong possibility of violence. Both lots (marches) of extremists are as bad as one another imo. Undoubtedly cost the taxpayers a fortune, hope both groups felt it was worthwhile. I dare say there was a mass of media there also. Some of whom no doubt hoping or baying for violence to make their news reports more "interesting".
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It was a UKIP organised affair with young Tommy in tow; with their far right views, they're not everyones cup of tea.
 
Gills 58 said:
It's the far right that are pushing for Brexit. Look who's pushing for it. The ERG, Putin, Trump and these sinister nutty far right groups in the USA (Bannon's mob), Murdoch. I could go on.
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You can go on as far as a little matter of 17.4 million voters and recent polls shows that position has hardly changed.

Strange that UKIP have been occupying the most far right position of any party and yet they do not have a single MP, let alone 17.4 million votes.
 
Therealwaldo said:
Study after study has shown that migration has not had the effect on house prices and wages that you claim. I haven’t anything more to go on than academic studies carried out to examine these specific issues. What evidence do you have, a man down the pub ?
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For Tarian - inward migration is a sign of a healthy economy; it's the economic law of supply and demand.
 
Therealwaldo said:
Tarian, deranged I said and deranged I meant. To take one of your issues. Youth unemployment in Greece is sod all to do with the EU and everything to do with Greek national policies. Their austerity is a direct result of the bail outs they needed. You can hardly blame the bankers. Without the bankers Greece would have been facing the sort of complete economic meltdown that happened in Argentina. You’re still in the mode of blaming the EU for things that are completely the fault of national governments. If the EU were to intervene to prevent these issues you’d be the first to complain about their interference in national sovereignty.

Study after study has shown that migration has not had the effect on house prices and wages that you claim. I haven’t anything more to go on than academic studies carried out to examine these specific issues. What evidence do you have, a man down the pub ?
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It's how he interpets what he reads and conclusions he comes to. He should do a course in Critical Thinking (I've had a go at some exam questions and it was very interesting, challenging, educational and revealing).

It asked what facts could be discerned from certain information. Tarian seems to be at stage one. The Sun is yellow so Tarian may think it is made of butter. The Moon a milky white so it's Vanilla ice cream.

As for thoroughly researched facts compared to bloke down the pub, sadly I think we know which Tarian and others rely on now. The "no deal" Brexiteers just don't believe anything that does not fit their dream world no matter how well founded the contrary arguments are. They don't believe in facts.

Finally, Tarian's assertion re the housing crisis. Immigration may play a minor part but it is a political decision by successive governments not to house it's people properly. This isn't an EU policy. Further we've just had a quarter of a million migrants from outside the EU in the last year (far more than from inside).. Why? Don't they have an impact on housing or is it only EU migrants that do - somehow.
 
'Strange that UKIP have been occupying the most far right position of any party and yet they do not have a single MP, let alone 17.4 million votes'

They are the fastest growing party at the moment.
At their peak , they had circa 40,000 members.
I expect that figure will be exceeded this time around.
 
valenciagill said:
'Strange that UKIP have been occupying the most far right position of any party and yet they do not have a single MP, let alone 17.4 million votes'

They are the fastest growing party at the moment.
At their peak , they had circa 40,000 members.
I expect that figure will be exceeded this time around.
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As of April 2018, Labour had 540,000 members, compared to just under 125,500 SNP members as of August 2018, and 124,000 Conservative members reported in March 2018. As of August 2018, The Liberal Democrats had 99,200, Green Party 39,400, UKIP 23,600 and Plaid Cymru 8,000 members. So, away to go but then party membership is not a measure of how votes will be cast overall. Clutching at straws especially after to-day's march to end all marches.
 
Tarian said:
So.... Waldo, Wa ne.Kerr, Gills58 ..... "deranged" "irrational" "hysterical".....
Is that what it has come down to?
Can't deal with rational argument anymore......?:hmmm:
(Slightly surprised not to have seen the slurs "waycist" or "far right" ... but hey ho ! )



The thing is ....
Those of us who have seen the Common Market morph into the EEC .....then EU.... and since the Single European Act 1986:
* thousands of non-trade rules being imposed on countries in the name of the "Single Market "....
- with the S.M. requiring countries to allow mass migration,.... thus putting up house prices and pressuring public services and transport .....
(..... when no other regional trade deal imposes either .....)
* The impact the Euro on southern Europe - with mass youth un-employment ..... and the Greek debt crisis....

Then one has to wonder why some people are willing to: "endanger their children's future"
..... by staying in such an authoritarian and costly construct as the EU ??
Click to expand...
Take a course in Critical Thinking. It will help you draw accurate information and conclusions from what you are reading. Another option is the Law National Aptitude Test (LNAT) that I've just been helping some Oxbridge candidates with. You might then understand what you read a little better and discover what conclusions can be drawn from given information.

It's not just a matter of reading, one also needs the ability to understand and process information accurately.

Altermatively, stick to your straight bananas (or was it bent?).
 
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