Electric Cars | Vital Football

Electric Cars

Nick Real Deal

Vital Football Legend
I heard an idea so simple I kicked myself for not assuming it.

You don't charge the car up at a garage point or at home. You just exchange the battery in seconds at exchange garages.

Being trialed in Israel apparently. They can replace 2 batteries and get 2 cars back on the road in the time it takes to fill up one petrol car.

It just needs standardized battery sizes ...one size fits all.





 
Nick it's not a new idea it's been kicking around for nearly a decade, I can't at the moment recall what they were called but this was tried once before in Israel - and (from memory) went bust after spending a billion or so....I think they went bust in 2013/14?

Maybe this time, they'll get it right ?
 
The plug in idea is the one being used at present here but it seems so time consuming. The other problem is battery cost and lifespan. If you are continually swapping the battery it won't be a problem but the cost has to be passed on to the consumer each time .

So what will it cost to charge, fit and replace when dead as a cost at the pump as it were. How much per mile compared to fossil fuel. Also the cost of the vehicle has to be factored in compared to traditional ones.

Will electric cars be as cheap per mile as we think ?
 
Hopefully the A9 is available when I trade the 7 in. :15:
 
Nick Real Deal - 11/7/2017 18:39

The plug in idea is the one being used at present here but it seems so time consuming. The other problem is battery cost and lifespan. If you are continually swapping the battery it won't be a problem but the cost has to be passed on to the consumer each time .

So what will it cost to charge, fit and replace when dead as a cost at the pump as it were. How much per mile compared to fossil fuel. Also the cost of the vehicle has to be factored in compared to traditional ones.

Will electric cars be as cheap per mile as we think ?

A common misconception is that Electric cars have a lower carbon footprint (they don't or it's marginal once you take the battery production into account - and of course it's disposal/recycling) and that it's cheaper to run - which they really aren't....

The big issue for the UK is that if just 25% of the cars on the road become electric, our grid will have to have rolling power cuts until the two new nuclear power stations are fully up and running at capacity in around 10-15 years....

We can buy capacity from France, but they too are now acting like the Russians are upping infrastructure costs on ongoing demand costs on an almost annual basis...

As for the batteries just being swapped out of a car, doesn't really make too much sense to me when the new fast-charge points aim to have you fully charged in less than 30 mins - which may well be about the same time as it takes to swap batteries out the costs of which means to me it economically makes little sense..
 
Super capacitors and recyclable batteries. And more efficient energy consumption by the cars themselves. All factors in the future.
 
found this, which is who I was trying to recall:

https://qz.com/88871/better-place-shai-agassi-swappable-electric-car-batteries/
 
I heard they can swap out two battery cars in the time it takes to fill one with petrol. So around 2 minutes each perhaps. I guess it will involve a hydraulic lift of some type.
 
Nick Real Deal - 13/7/2017 19:28

I heard they can swap out two battery cars in the time it takes to fill one with petrol. So around 2 minutes each perhaps. I guess it will involve a hydraulic lift of some type.

You're right the article link I point to above says it can happen in around 3 minutes - if there isn't a queue of cars in front of you - each swapping station was costing around half a million dollars to start - that's a big hurdle to jump and a very long payback when all you can charge for is low cost labour...

Looks to me as if it's one of those ideas where unless you can automate the execution and charging structure the margins will remain stubbornly low - hence it's demise?
 
Nick Real Deal - 14/7/2017 13:24

How are the govt going to tax it. ? The fuel duty will already be in decline and eventually severely cut.

The one thing you can absolutely take to the bank is governments creative ability to dream up new taxes or to simply increase existing one's to compensate.

Look at the decades long debate and scare tactics that the tobacco industry undertook - they said without it's tax revenue governments across the World would be struggling to replace the receipts - but of course, they haven't - they just bring in new consumption taxes and asset taxes as needed...

My guess is they'll bring in more / bigger road use tolls - the technology is highly reliable and it's relatively straight forward to retro fit to all our roads...
 
Nick Real Deal - 17/7/2017 15:05

Still got to transport goods though. Electric vans and hgvs not so easy.

Not really, we're already headlong into developing credible electric only planes and electric engines - yes, it will take time, but not as long as you think, perhaps 20 years before we see bigger new jets being electric of a hybrid mix...

So trucks and vans really won't be that big a problem to solve:

http://www.theatlantic.com/sponsored/thomson-reuters-why-2025-matters/electric-flight/208/

The solutions are well on their way...


http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-news/first-official-pictures/mercedes-benz/meet-the-whispering-lorry-mercedes-benzs-electric-urban-etruck/
 
Electric car chargers could be switched off remotely at peak times
Emily Gosden, Energy Editor

July 18 2017, 12:01am, The Times

Owners would be encouraged to charge their cars at off-peak times or on days when there is plenty of renewable energy available


Electric car chargers could be switched off remotely or turned down by energy companies if owners refuse to use them at off-peak times.

UK Power Networks, which delivers electricity to 18 million people in London, the southeast and the east of England, is calling for the right to remotely control vehicle charging as a “last resort” to prevent power cuts.

Forecasts suggest that electric vehicles could increase peak demand far beyond the level that existing power stations can generate and cable networks can transmit.

To tackle the problem the industry and government plan to encourage “smart charging”, whereby households agree to allow their vehicles to charge automatically at off-peak times when the system can cope.

Suleman Alli, director of safety and strategy at UK Power Networks, said he hoped that pricing tariffs would persuade people to charge cars at off-peak times only, but that the company needed the powers to intervene if they did not. “One of our key roles is to keep the lights on,” he said. “If we start to see uncoordinated or uncontrolled charging, that may jeopardise the network security and safety. We need to be able to step in and manage it.”

Last week National Grid estimated that unmanaged electric car charging could add 18 gigawatts to peak demand by 2050, equivalent to the power output of six big new nuclear plants similar to Hinkley Point C. Smart charging could reduce this extra demand to six gigawatts, it said.

“In the future we could face a position where everyone comes home and starts charging at the same time,” Mr Alli said. “We would need to invest in improving the network to be able to handle that additional load. The more money we spend, that effectively translates to higher bills.”

He expects “time-of-use” tariffs that vary prices with demand to become the norm. “If people feel that they want to charge whenever they want, there’s a cost associated with that and the people that use the network in that way should pay their fair share of that cost,” he said.
 
Wales just launched their hydrogen car.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-35595240

I would expect a few breakthroughs here too in the future.
 
Welshtel - 25/7/2017 23:52

Wales just launched their hydrogen car.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-35595240

I would expect a few breakthroughs here too in the future.

I expect there will be too, but I do recall that these fuel cells / engine have an even bigger reliance on REM's - and that may well be a huge issue as the rate at which we're consuming them is problematic even now.
 
To clarify what people are fearing. The govt is suggesting ending the sale of new petrol and diesel cars by 2040. That's NEW cars . They have a guideline of 2050 for phasing out the cars. That's 33 years time and it's a target, not set in stone. So if you buy a car in 2039 you will have 11 years to run it into the ground by which time it won't be worth much anyway.
 
So when are they upgrading the national power grid to cope with all this extra consumer demand on electricity ?
It can hardly cope now when all the kettles are switched on at H/T during big World Cup matches.