Edu was appointed early in the year, made official in the summer due to contract with Arsenal. It was Nuno that shouldn't have sign a new contract in June if he didn't want to work with Edu and not waste a pre season nd then engineer an exit.
Dyche out
- Thread starter Will.NFFC
- Start date
Just got an assist taking a freekick chap!
BlackGold
Vital Football Hero
Thewolf/jimmygordon
Vital Champions League
I didnt. The wider football world didnt. Im certain he didnt.
Internally at our club and most of our fanbase I believe weve been lulled into believing we are a lot better than we are.
I bought that thinking most of last season. And assumed the new signings would improve us.
We are in the process of getting a rude awakening I think. If we do stay up next season could be just as tough or even worse
Our whole club needs a reality check I think.
Need a more realistic evaluation of what our players are actually capable of doing well
The closer we get to the opposition goal the worse we are in general I think.
Also last season we had the best finisher in Europe and a keeper who was rightfully considered one of the best in Europe. Everything aligned for us.
You lose that up top and behind the defenders and the games are twice as hard to win
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I agree on most of the above ( thinking that we are better then we are), still I think we are much better then in our first season in the Premiership. Last year " performance " came too early, but let's be honest expecting to be like a Fulham, Brentford or similar is not too much to ask.
forestfire_59
Vital Football Hero
You’re assuming that Nuno was fully appraised of the role that the Emu would play in transfers. I don’t know but I would have thought that Nuno wouldn’t have realised the level of interference that Emu would have had until July / August when targets were being chased.
Indeed the fact that we “apparently “ were still in for Traore in August would suggest how little influence on recruitment that he had.
Thewolf/jimmygordon
Vital Champions League
Yes for sure but you need to be as competition is harder this season
Edu came to Forest to do what he did at Arsenal, so Nuno knew why EM was bringing Edu here, definitely not to be " an advisor".
The Troare thing is just an episode, a baby throwing toys out of the pram, nothing more.
Adults and professionals don't behave like that, especially in modern day football.
Only for his behaviour Nuno deserves to get relegated, so HD doesn't bag a survival bonus.
If he saves W Ham he would do it at the expense of Forest, the team that gave him a new lease of life.
BlackGold
Vital Football Hero
WOLIFE EDIT 2:
Excellent coverage to his central defenders, to play the ball off Ramsey.
Down to ten, and looking in control, with Luiz at the centre of it all.
Well done Dyche, you dino ball moron.
Will.NFFC
Vital Champions League
You know what, the longer I’m left to dwell on this, the happier I am that this fakers left. That article @AdebolaCornflakes shared really did sum it all up perfectly. He’s got nothing about him. He’s better than Ange because he got more points but he’s been total shit since that early bounce and I’m glad I won’t have to suffer watching us play football under him any longer.
Yeah fine if we go down, i’ll have all you Dyche lovers on here telling us he was brilliant and our squad was shit, but then you’re just a victim of all the the nonsense that article refers to. It’s perfect for him that he’s been sacked - if we stay up, he’ll take credit for giving us stability and putting us outside the drop zone and if we go down he’ll be able to say it’s cus we sacked him.
If we go down, I’ll still refuse to accept it’s the squad - I will squarely blame 3 dreadful appointments in a row. It’s not exactly inconceivable that we’ve simply appointed poor managers is it? We were outside the top flight for 23 years - of the managers we appointed in those 23 years, how many went on to prove they weren’t awful? I’m not sure any of them?
I’d rather risk going down with the spin of the dice to change things than watch us play like we do every week under Dyche and go down anyway.
By the way, for some perspective because people go a bit overboard about how adrift we were under Ange… Dyche took over after just EIGHT games - we were 2 points off 16th and 4 points off 12th…. Fast forward 4 months and we’re 2 points off 16th and 7 points off 12th… what a job
Yeah fine if we go down, i’ll have all you Dyche lovers on here telling us he was brilliant and our squad was shit, but then you’re just a victim of all the the nonsense that article refers to. It’s perfect for him that he’s been sacked - if we stay up, he’ll take credit for giving us stability and putting us outside the drop zone and if we go down he’ll be able to say it’s cus we sacked him.
If we go down, I’ll still refuse to accept it’s the squad - I will squarely blame 3 dreadful appointments in a row. It’s not exactly inconceivable that we’ve simply appointed poor managers is it? We were outside the top flight for 23 years - of the managers we appointed in those 23 years, how many went on to prove they weren’t awful? I’m not sure any of them?
I’d rather risk going down with the spin of the dice to change things than watch us play like we do every week under Dyche and go down anyway.
By the way, for some perspective because people go a bit overboard about how adrift we were under Ange… Dyche took over after just EIGHT games - we were 2 points off 16th and 4 points off 12th…. Fast forward 4 months and we’re 2 points off 16th and 7 points off 12th… what a job
AdebolaCornflakes
Vital Football Legend
Just Will saying what a superb link I shared
forestfire_59
Vital Football Hero
If it’s the article I’m thinking of (by the wolves fan), it has changed my view on Dyche. The suggestion that Dyche didn’t understand proper wing play struck a chord with me. When posters on here mentioned the 6-1 man chance, I thought they were exaggerating. The notion that lucca was stretching for it was rediculous , he just had to tap it in, it was embarrassing. However I certainly have more sympathy for the players who have been schooled in the nobler arts of the game and were struggling to do what was asked of them.
Apparently Kali went because Dyche didn’t know how to play him. Dyche probably would have got us over the line . . . Just but it wouldn’t have been pretty. I don’t know whether periera can get a tune out of these players, he needs to hit the ground running.
If we stay up I’d keep Kali and hopefully we have a manager who can get him going
Pope John XXIII
Vital Football Legend
This is really disingenuous
Because, for all the nonsense about Dyche-lovers and what they will supposedly say when we go down, those that hated Dyche from the start will do the same from day one of this random new guy
We lose at Fenerbahce? Tough place to go, he had no time, not his fault
Lose to Liverpool? To be expected
Fail to beat Fenerbahce at home? Because of the away leg, a shame but we need to concentrate on the league anyway
Lose at Brighton? Hard away game, not his fault
Lose at Man City? Expected
Fail to beat Fulham? Bogey team
Lose at Spurs? Hard place to go, new manager bounce for them
Lose to Villa- they are a good side, but we are basically down already anyway, and it's all Sean Dyche's fault
End of the season, we finish 18th, 7-8 points adrift
Finally people will admit Peirera was shit, but caveat it with "he wasn't as shit as Dyche" even if the actual PPG doesn't support that
This is 100% how it will go
pebble
Vital Football Hero
Except we were 3 points off 16th, 2 points off 17th, 7 points off 12th when Dyche took over.
22 from 18 under Dyche, leaving us 3 points above the bottom three (rather than 2 points and five goals short of safety). Quite a big improvement in a relegation battle.
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Will.NFFC
Vital Champions League
In all my years of posting on here and our debates, have you ever known me to disingenuously suggest somethings better than it is to suit my narrative? You’ve actually accused me of being too quick to judge performances harshly before.
I’ve also been clear that pereira could be awful - I’m not saying here confidently that we’ve appointed a winner - I’m merely emphasising that I don’t think Pereira’s potentallly poor appointment makes Dyche’s exit any less appropriate.
parking your scepticism of Pereira for a minute, were you not concerned at how little belief the team seemed to have in Dyche? You know as well as I do that psychology and belief is as important as ability at this time of the season and Dyche was clearly instilling none of that into this team.
To be clear, of pereira is shite, I’ll call it out no problem… but I’ll at least give him a chance to let me say that like we all did Dyche
There’s nothing you, or any of us can do now but support and hope we stay up.
What’s done is done and if the players weren’t having him, they ‘may’ respond to the new guy
Let’s see. I think the healthy debates will continue but the key debates and strategy are for May 23rd or whenever the last game is
Redchops
Vital Squad Member
just how is Rod Hull chap
Pope John XXIII
Vital Football Legend
That's all fair enough Will, but you are not the only person who posts on this forum, and there are plenty of others who absolutely WILL do exactly as I have described to fit their narrative and say they "called it".
I mean, we still have some clowns defending Postecoglou because it fits their narrative of hating Dyche.
As for Dyche, I personally did not feel the team lacked that belief that you have described as a fact. Not pulling rank here, but remember I do go to all the home games. I see the body language a lot more than most on here with their giant satellite dishes or dodgy fire sticks.
From my perspective, it's only a game or so since they destroyed Ferencevaros. It's only a game since they were cruising against Palace (I know you dispute that, but I am as pessimistic a fan as you will find and I was supremely comfortable that we were going to win that until the red card). Leeds was terrible, but the last terrible game I personally saw live was Everton way back in December.
So I dispute that.
What I don't dispute is that the players, when behind, lacked imagination and strategies to unlock a defence and get back into the game against a team willing to defend deep. I think most sides struggle against that, we struggled under Nuno too- but I DO accept that it is the manager's responsibility to coach patterns of play and work on those solutions.
I DO accept that Nuno, with his little triangles, was a lot better at this than Dyche
I DO accept that we lost our counterattacking ability under Dyche. In fairness, we lost it under Postecoglou, along with our defensive ability. We got the latter back under Dyche but not the former. What we were left with was Nuno's side, minus the ability to counterattack, hence why we failed to pull away.
I DO accept also that, if there is any truth to any of the rumours that he lost the dressing room, ostracised certain players, or the senior players felt his methods were too basic and he didn't have the answers, and said this to the owner- then yes, he had to go in any of those circumstances. These are rumours and I would like to see some facts first.
Our results were between 1.2 and 1.4 PPG, which is entirely adequate for what we need. Our last 12 fixtures are harder - and these are the games where Dyche has generally done well. Arsenal, Man Utd, Man City, Liverpool, Spurs- all games where we performed really well, most of them we got results from. Even Brentford were flying high and unbeaten at home for ages when we won there.
On that basis, Dyche was certainly the man to finish the season with us IF none of the rumours above were true. Like I say, I am yet to see the facts.
But my main gripe is with this absolutely appalling appointment. Given the kinds of games we have in our last 1/3 of the season, it's even worse. Pereira has a shocking record against these kinds of sides. He has only one game against the kind of side he was ok at beating (last season, not this) with Wolves.
Let's not pretend that this fact was looked at. It took me 5 minutes on Google to look that up and express that concern. I seriously, seriously doubt that anyone at the club was aware of that or even looked it up. I doubt in this case there was any serious discussion of merits, because you have to be considering other candidates for that.
No, I don't think this appointment has much thinking behind it at all.
I think this is Marinakis's choice. I think it has more to do with rapprochement with Jorge Mendes and the fact that he has worked with him before than it does any detailed thinking about whether his style will fit the players or whether he is the right man for the games we have left. I seriously doubt there was any discussion at all- like with Postecoglou, I suspect Marinakis literally just told everyone this was happening and to sort the logistics.
That is not the basis for survival. You deserve to be relegated if you have four managers in a season anyway, and we will be. I don't see any way out of it
It will take ages for this guy to improve our attacking, and it is extremely questionable that he even will. But it will only take him a game to make our defence far worse, and think he will certainly do that compared to Dyche
