Dockyard - Great Pics and stats in today`s KentOnline

[markinkent]

Perhaps, but I think the wider area of Medway is still scarred to this day by the Dockyard closure, with relatively high unemployment and attendant social problems still lingering even through to today.

I'm not sure I agree that the dockyard closure is root cause of medways current problems.

Overspill of problem families from London, rise of county lines drug gangs and a lack of law and order being any real deterrent to anti social behaviour are far more relevant I suspect.

The towns now have three universities, great connections to London and some high skilled job opportunities for locals.

What it needs is a council that moves beyond its obsession with dickens and invests in the future to attract more job opportunities.

To me the towns are no worse than any other town in the UK. They are some deprived areas but that's the same everywhere.

 

[Jerryattrick]

I'm not sure I agree that the dockyard closure is root cause of medways current problems.

Overspill of problem families from London, rise of county lines drug gangs and a lack of law and order being any real deterrent to anti social behaviour are far more relevant I suspect.

The towns now have three universities, great connections to London and some high skilled job opportunities for locals.

What it needs is a council that moves beyond its obsession with dickens and invests in the future to attract more job opportunities.

To me the towns are no worse than any other town in the UK. They are some deprived areas but that's the same everywhere.

If you look at the latest medway plans you will see that there is little in real terms re dickens or any history further than what is there now. They are looking at infrastructure and job growth at long last.

How can the loss of around 40,000 jobs (not just dockyard) not have been the main impact on the towns?
Its the same as the other areas and communities in the country that were decimated at the same time period and have never recovered. Much of this resulted in the large backing for brexit and mass desertion of labour voters in these areas.

We escaped an even worse impact being within commuting distance from London.

 

[markinkent]

If you look at the latest medway plans you will see that there is little in real terms re dickens or any history further than what is there now. They are looking at infrastructure and job growth at long last.

How can the loss of around 40,000 jobs (not just dockyard) not have been the main impact on the towns?
Its the same as the other areas and communities in the country that were decimated at the same time period and have never recovered. Much of this resulted in the large backing for brexit and mass desertion of labour voters in these areas.

We escaped an even worse impact being within commuting distance from London.

I don't disagree that at the time and for years after it was the main impact on the towns for that generation.

I am suggesting that's flushed through now and subsequent generations have moved into other industries. If I look at deprived areas in Medway now I wouldn't associate that with the dockyard closure but with different social issues.

What the area has missed out in is a real big employer to replace the early careers opportunities for the next generation of school leavers.

Putting the environmental impact to one side for the moment the grain airport could have been a huge employer at all skill levels. We missed out on that opportunity for generation changing job creation.

Maybe the ebbsfleet theme park will offer something

We lost a huge employer in the dockyard and its a real shame that something didn't come along to replace it for the school leaver opportunities at least.

My son is looking for an apprenticeship now but he has to look into London for the industries he is after.

Hopefully something will come of the proposed innovation park at Rochester Airport.

 

[Jerryattrick]

Agreed, we have many other issues in the towns now.
The large employer is about right, the last was GEC at the airport (6000 when i was there) but overall we lost around 40 factories.

The loss of these employers meant we also lost real apprenticeships (5 years trade ones). The yard had the best scheme where you took the dockyard exam and dependent on your result they offered you one of the numerous trade apprenticeships.

Most employers offered apprenticeships with CAV and kent alloys maybe the most (cannot remember all of them). So you lose skilled workers and you stop training anyone as its a self fulfilling prophesy that the skills are not required as there are no jobs lol.
Eventually the excuse is that we had to move jobs overseas because we cannot attract employers as we don't have the skills locally - derr. Still doing it now.

I had to wait for my car mot in strood a few months ago so walked from the bridge (wingets) round and up knights road and recalled the factories now long gone. 15 strood factories just off the top of my head - gone.
The same thing when you look at the esplanade and other areas of medway plus the missing army and naval/marine barracks.

i would say we were the worst hit area in the south. Nothing compared with a lot of the northern cities and many people there did not forgive and forget the loss and subsequent lack of interest or investment resulting as i said in the brexit and labour vote losses.

 

[PhilK66]

Agreed, we have many other issues in the towns now.
The large employer is about right, the last was GEC at the airport (6000 when i was there) but overall we lost around 40 factories.

The loss of these employers meant we also lost real apprenticeships (5 years trade ones). The yard had the best scheme where you took the dockyard exam and dependent on your result they offered you one of the numerous trade apprenticeships.

Most employers offered apprenticeships with CAV and kent alloys maybe the most (cannot remember all of them). So you lose skilled workers and you stop training anyone as its a self fulfilling prophesy that the skills are not required as there are no jobs lol.
Eventually the excuse is that we had to move jobs overseas because we cannot attract employers as we don't have the skills locally - derr. Still doing it now.

I had to wait for my car mot in strood a few months ago so walked from the bridge (wingets) round and up knights road and recalled the factories now long gone. 15 strood factories just off the top of my head - gone.
The same thing when you look at the esplanade and other areas of medway plus the missing army and naval/marine barracks.

i would say we were the worst hit area in the south. Nothing compared with a lot of the northern cities and many people there did not forgive and forget the loss and subsequent lack of interest or investment resulting as i said in the brexit and labour vote losses.

But did your car pass?

 

[Jerryattrick]

But did your car pass?

yup no problem there except at the time it was hard to get a booking due to covid lol.
was strange strolling around the old haunts. Notably a loss of a few pubs and for some reason the main bus stop at Strood church has moved - very strange.
Youth club closed etc so no actual improvements that I could see but at least the recreation ground was still there - used to play football virtually every day with many fellow gills fans (most used the john leeds and charlie boardman blues away service).

 

[jokerman]

yup no problem there except at the time it was hard to get a booking due to covid lol.
was strange strolling around the old haunts. Notably a loss of a few pubs and for some reason the main bus stop at Strood church has moved - very strange.
Youth club closed etc so no actual improvements that I could see but at least the recreation ground was still there - used to play football virtually every day with many fellow gills fans (most used the john leeds and charlie boardman blues away service).

For two years 1960-62, I'd hike down from English Martyrs, then along Gun Lane, and wait outside that church for the 26 (latterly also 26A) Sittingbourne/Faversham or the 37 or 38 (I forget) Lower Halstow to head home to Rainham. Then I shifted to the train.

 

[markinkent]

Agreed, we have many other issues in the towns now.
The large employer is about right, the last was GEC at the airport (6000 when i was there) but overall we lost around 40 factories.

.

I was a GEC apprentice in 1984. One of nearly 100 I reckon that year. Far fewer taken on now. Its about 10-15, a very different apprenticeship to what I did.

They are definitely making a comeback though and lots of young people seem to be choosing them over university due to the levels of debt.

I suspect GEC (BAE) are the biggest private employer in the towns now, around 1,500 now well down on the 6000 of the past.

 

[Jerryattrick]

For two years 1960-62, I'd hike down from English Martyrs, then along Gun Lane, and wait outside that church for the 26 (latterly also 26A) Sittingbourne/Faversham or the 37 or 38 (I forget) Lower Halstow to head home to Rainham. Then I shifted to the train.

around that period i would have been catching any bus from the church to chatham and change buses for tje journey to chatham tech.
opposite the church bus stop was the church primary school (later demolished) and the local forge (cannot remember when it closed).