Creationism a fallacy......according to the Pope

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Villan Of The North

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Sorry, it just had to be done.

Pope Francis declares evolution and Big Bang theory are right and God isn't 'a magician with a magic wand'

The theories of evolution and the Big Bang are real and God is not “a magician with a magic wand”, Pope Francis has declared.

Speaking at the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, the Pope made comments which experts said put an end to the “pseudo theories” of creationism and intelligent design that some argue were encouraged by his predecessor, Benedict XVI.Francis explained that both scientific theories were not incompatible with the existence of a creator – arguing instead that they “require it”.“When we read about Creation in Genesis, we run the risk of imagining God was a magician, with a magic wand able to do everything.

Full article:- http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/pope-francis-declares-evolution-and-big-bang-theory-are-right-and-god-isnt-a-magician-with-a-magic-wand-9822514.html6


 
Villan Of The North - 28/10/2014 16:52

Speaking at the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, the Pope made comments which experts said put an end to the “pseudo theories” of creationism and intelligent design that some argue were encouraged by his predecessor, Benedict XVI.
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I bet it doesn't put an end to anything. Those leading this movement make too much money from it.
 
The amount of religious threads that we get on here, it would have me almost thinking that you guys need to convince yourselves if you believe or not. Especially you VOTN - the battles that are going on inside your head must be immense.

Sometimes you just have to go with how you feel & to Hell with the rest of em!!

The Pope, The scientist, The creationist, The intelligent design advocate - they are all only just people. They are not special super human beings.

Religion is dead anyway. I cant see how the Pope coming out with this strengthens the Catholic religion. Basically throwing out scripture - you may as well bring down the walls of all organised religion that preach Biblical narrative.
 
Seems strange to me a Pope would say this and declare the Bble story as not true, GT dude is right religion especially Christianity is dying fast, why do they seem happy about this and want it? Something is defo wrong you would never hear an Islamist declare this about there religion as being wrong would you???
 
We all know the magic wands that those at the Vatican like to use, the day I listen to that lot is the day that I shall be committed.

'You guys' GT... so you've not started any / joined in with all?

Religion, in case it has escaped your notice, is one of the most talked about, argued over, debated and at times divisive subjects know to mankind.

It is also fascinating.
 
ClivetheVillan - 28/10/2014 17:37

Seems strange to me a Pope would say this and declare the Bble story as not true, GT dude is right religion especially Christianity is dying fast, why do they seem happy about this and want it? Something is defo wrong you would never hear an Islamist declare this about there religion as being wrong would you???
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As far as I am aware, Islam has always been a bit more flexible on the Bible and it's teachings. It takes what it likes, and rejects what it doesn't. It also interprets many of the stories differently, taking a more allegorical view.

Christians, on the other hand, were forced to accept it as fact for many hundreds of years. Over the last 500 years Science has proven it wrong on so many counts, they now have no choice but change their minds.
 
May be the case Heath dude, just may be the case that the Pope and co am realising unless they ''keep in with the times'' they will decimate for sure anyway
 
Which is probably why Islam is now the fastest growing religion on the planet. Their teachings are to "respect" biblical scripture but the works to follow are the Hadith and the Koran. The story has it, that many parts of scripture are tainted so Muhammad brought the truth.
 
ClivetheVillan - 28/10/2014 18:12

May be the case Heath dude, just may be the case that the Pope and co am realising unless they ''keep in with the times'' they will decimate for sure anyway
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By making their belief system so inflexible and intractable, they have left themselves open to attack. If they had opened up to new ideas more easily from day one, they would be better placed now.

There was a time I would have been tortured and then executed for the things I say, even though they have been proven to be true. Perhaps a slightly less rigid viewpoint would have made them more relevant?
 
Keeping with the times - goes against the story of creation.

The funny thing is, that the followers of Islam listen to a lot of creationist material because their religion also believes in the creation story as told in Genesis. But the Catholic Church now going against the creation story, will only surely add further to it's own demise.

Even if you tear Genesis from the Bible, you can find the creation story listed in other parts of scripture. So the Pope is basically saying in layman's terms - that the Bible, Creation & God is all just a fairy story.
 
In Islamic copies of the Torah, they use to word "youm" for day. This actually means a long period of time, so they don't stick to a timeframe when talking about Creation. This is common in many of the creation stories, and many believe a mistranslation to "day" in the Bible.

They believe in an Old Earth, mainly because there is no definitive mention in the Quran of timeframes, and they were more advanced and open minded when it came to Science.

By setting out definitive data, you leave yourself open to being proven wrong. That is what the Bible purports to do, and it has been shown for the fraud it is.
 
There is alot of beauty in The Bible to Heath: You only have to look at Psalms, Ecclesiastics and Song of Songs for a few instances.

The problem is the literalistic's of The Bible who take everything literally instead as by interpretation.
 
When I say they believe in the Creation story as told in Genesis, that is, that they believe God created man in his own image - we did not come from apes. The translation for day/time is irrelevant in this case. Muslims use a lot of research(in fact they hijack it) that the creationists in America have come up with, in regards to evolution being a myth, or at least macro-evolution(a change from one species to another).
 
That is true Heath dude no doubt you would have been strung up by ya danglies for going against the beliefs of the creation and other beliefs, now it does seem as though they am desperately trying to attract modern folk with the modernisation of the religion brining in evolution theories and binning the old creationist story they am thinking to get younger open minded folk on board hmmm still think they should keep to there guns as now they look hypocrites

Or they could have adopted KK's take on things if they was smart and used old stories etc and event's to allow brining in the science way of thinking, this way of just saying ''God has no magic wand'' is a floor imo, they have just undermined the very thing they am preaching, game over me thinks for them.
 
kefkat - 28/10/2014 18:46

There is alot of beauty in The Bible to Heath: You only have to look at Psalms, Ecclesiastics and Song of Songs for a few instances.

The problem is the literalistic's of The Bible who take everything literally instead as by interpretation.
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I'm not denying the first statement, there Kef. As a spiritual document that helps you and others, I'm sure it does a great job.

Your second statement is also correct, but there are many that still believe it. When I call it a fraud, I mean in terms of it's historical accuracy. To then use that to dictate to others has always been it's major problem in the modern World.
 
Green Tea - 28/10/2014 18:48

When I say they believe in the Creation story as told in Genesis, that is, that they believe God created man in his own image - we did not come from apes. The translation for day/time is irrelevant in this case. Muslims use a lot of research(in fact they hijack it) that the creationists in America have come up with, in regards to evolution being a myth, or at least macro-evolution(a change from one species to another).
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They believe that Evolution is a myth because Evolution takes away the need for creation, and hence takes away the need for religion. That would kill Islam, so they supress it.

Once you actually start talking to individuals, they are surprisingly open to the subject. As with Catholics for so long, it is the leaders need for control that stops it being widely accepted.

This makes interesting reading on the subject

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16258-how-to-stop-creationism-gaining-a-hold-in-islam.html#.VE_hfXQqWOU
 
If you want to talk about the historical accuracy of the Bible I think Reza Aslan puts it better than I ever coukd in this interview. I love this interview and masticating his thoughts and ideas so I'd recommend watching it all but the section I'm referring to starts at about 3:45.


[youtube=HL6E4eMX-4k]


 
This statement is false - "Logically speaking, if you believe in a 6000 or 10,000 year-old Earth, then you have to reject evolution".

Scripture tells us that God created each kind.

Over the course of 1000's of years each kind will adapt(evolve) to its surroundings - this is known in creationist terms as micro-evolution. Its is observed it is fact! Wolf - poodle is proof of micro - evolution both still the same kind, yet they differ.

What creationists do not believe, is change from one kind to another - eg; bacteria into a human. The bacteria(even though it changes form) still remains bacteria.

Evolution = change.

Now according The Bible, God and the creation story, we did not come from apes - this is non negotiable.

So the very moment you believe we came from an ape - is the moment you throw away all faith in God(at least the one described in the Bible)

Therefore Evolution(unless small changes within it's kind) & faith in the creation story cannot co-exist.

 
Villan Of The North - 28/10/2014 19:11

If you want to talk about the historical accuracy of the Bible I think Reza Aslan puts it better than I ever coukd in this interview. I love this interview and masticating his thoughts and ideas so I'd recommend watching it all but the section I'm referring to starts at about 3:45.


[youtube=HL6E4eMX-4k]
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What a very nice man, and what a great way of putting it all into words. I might see if I can get hold of his book. Thanks, Ian.
 
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