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#COVID19

i am a tree

Vital 1st Team Regular
Again BS with one tweet taken from a number to present a narrative. The far left really are as bad as the right, just less competent.
What does this have to do with what i wrote? I'm not trying to present a narrative based on one tweet taken from a number. Where did I do that? What does it have to do with competency of far left or far right groups?

Kuenssberg provides zero analysis of Cummings here in this instance. On the BBC site there is analysis, which claims that Cummings' actions have caused 'much debate', which is a pathetic way of analyzing the response to his breaking of the lockdown rules.

If you trust the BBC to truly hold the government to account, as journalists should be doing, that's your call. I don't. I don't think the BBC is actual journalism, but more of a PR company for the government when it comes to these issues. You never see a BBC journalist actually investigate whether the government has done something wrong, they just report the accusation and the give the government's response.

I'd rather read journalism from sources that actually allow their journalists to be honest in their analysis instead of hedging absolutely everything just in case the government pulls funding.
 

i am a tree

Vital 1st Team Regular
"Today, Germany has been accused of attempting to start a war when they invaded Poland. The German government spokesman has said the invasion was essential because they needed the living space.

Their actions have caused much debate among the Polish people."

edit: no i'm not comparing Cummings to the nazis, i'm showing what a BBC report would look like in that instance.
 

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
"Today, Germany has been accused of attempting to start a war when they invaded Poland. The German government spokesman has said the invasion was essential because they needed the living space.

Their actions have caused much debate among the Polish people."

edit: no i'm not comparing Cummings to the nazis, i'm showing what a BBC report would look like in that instance.
And again, you need to recognise why the BBC are treading on eggshells around Johnson's government.

Cummings and his people will have had very frank and threatening conversations with the BBC where it will have been made clear what will happen if they criticise the government.

An obvious fear of upsetting this government very clearly runs through everything they do.

And whenever any bit of analysis does get done that is in any way critical of the government, what do we hear?some government spokesman or anonymous source raises "questions" about the BBC license fee and whether it will be renewed.

I think the criticisms of the BBC's softball approach to this government are valid to point out, but it is unfair to actually criticise the BBC for this. What else can they do in the face of the most vindictive, anti democratic and mafia like government in recent history?
 

i am a tree

Vital 1st Team Regular
And again, you need to recognise why the BBC are treading on eggshells around Johnson's government.

Cummings and his people will have had very frank and threatening conversations with the BBC where it will have been made clear what will happen if they criticise the government.

An obvious fear of upsetting this government very clearly runs through everything they do.

And whenever any bit of analysis does get done that is in any way critical of the government, what do we hear?some government spokesman or anonymous source raises "questions" about the BBC license fee and whether it will be renewed.

I think the criticisms of the BBC's softball approach to this government are valid to point out, but it is unfair to actually criticise the BBC for this. What else can they do in the face of the most vindictive, anti democratic and mafia like government in recent history?
I do understand that. My criticism of the BBC is not that they are partisan, I have never thought that they are, I just think they are toothless. When it comes to reporting dry facts, the BBC is very good, but when it comes to investigative journalism they absolutely suck. Why do you think whistleblowers never, ever go to the BBC first? They would rather go somewhere that will take their side and tell the truth to power.

I mean you can take that as a criticism of the BBC or a criticism of government policy towards to the BBC, but I feel like its both. If the BBC stood up to the government and the government took revenge, at least SOME of the public would really care about that.

I guess as a Corbyn supporter i feel extra frustrated by it because they were perfectly happy to give honest analysis of Corbyn and the reaction to him (as they were with Johnson before he got into government), and I don't feel they would ever be that honest against a sitting government.
 
The BBC is absolutely shit scared of attacking the government for fear their license fee will be taken away.

I am.sure that has been explicitly stated behind closed doors, in unminuted meetings; tow the line or we destroy you.
So that in itself is asking the bbc to be biased. And the bbc have done everything to be on the side of the govt.
 
What are you babbling on about? Their first two stories are about Cummings.

I'm unsurprised that you value tabloid journalism and twitter sound bites above actual investigative reporting or unbiased news.
You were calling Morgan for trying to hold the tories to account.
I was sticking up for Morgan. What's your problem?

Also I'm still waiting for you to state where I've distorted the truth. And I also asked you that you must admire Corbyn for taking on the establishment.
Again BS with one tweet taken from a number to present a narrative. The far left really are as bad as the right, just less competent.
Here we go again the far left!!! While the tories have governed with some far right policies.
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
I've been wondering what big story Cummings might have been saving for a day like today. Time will tell I guess.

Plan A is suppressing your name trending on Twitter.

Plan B is to roll out Gove, Raab and 'Number 10' (himself).

He has had Raab and Gove's balls in a vice for a long time so it was no surprise they have jumped to his defence. A few others in his pocket too. I'd expect JRM to point out that this is absolutely fine and any plebs that don't understand why it is absolutely fine should defer to those who went to Eton for proper guidance on such matters.


Any bets on Boris delivering the daily briefing today?? :rotfl:
And now we have JRM with precisely the condescending tone I predicted.
"..obviously reasonable.." (you idiot plebs).
"Surely any parent..." (only parents count and all parents know this is fine).

Since Priti Patel has retweeted Raab, I think that's numberwang! With an added Suella Braverman for good measure.
 

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
The press conference is going well. They are explaining how Cummings followed the rules perfectly, because what the rules were back then wasn't what everyone thought/ was told they were.

FB_IMG_1590250095049.jpg
Apparently, when they said "stay at home" they meant "remove yourself from society", not "stay at home". If we all had common sense, we would have known that the government's direct instruction was not a direct instruction.

If only the "protective ring thrown around care homes" had matched the one thrown around Cummings (not my phrase, but an excellent example of what is going around twitter)
 
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Ingy

Vital Football Legend
Let's say that what Cummings is supposed to have done is correct then what would you do if you had a 4 year old with both parents ill? Personally if this is the true events and someone I knew did that,who wasn't involved in government, for the concern of their vulnerable child I wouldn't see it as being as the wrong thing to do.I would be more concerned if they didn't put their child first.
 
Let's say that what Cummings is supposed to have done is correct then what would you do if you had a 4 year old with both parents ill? Personally if this is the true events and someone I knew did that,who wasn't involved in government, for the concern of their vulnerable child I wouldn't see it as being as the wrong thing to do.I would be more concerned if they didn't put their child first.
How's Jason chap?
 

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
Let's say that what Cummings is supposed to have done is correct then what would you do if you had a 4 year old with both parents ill? Personally if this is the true events and someone I knew did that,who wasn't involved in government, for the concern of their vulnerable child I wouldn't see it as being as the wrong thing to do.I would be more concerned if they didn't put their child first.
Hold on a minute.

Cummings was absolutely central in making the rules on this. This isn't a case of someone wanting to obey government rules but finding them too rigid for his circumstances. This guy made the rules, and could have made them absolutely any way he wanted, to take account of any situation he wanted.

The scenario of a young child with two very ill parents was not a difficult one to envisage. He and the rest of his clan didn't bother to account for it. They didn't bother to tell us, Johnny public, that it was ok to completely disobey the guidance in those circumstances.

We were sat at home, reading stories of police patrolling "non essential" aisles, dying lakes black and ordering small shops not to stock Easter eggs.

For all of us on the ground, it didn't look like the authorities wanted any loopholes, no matter how sick we got.

Why didn't they announce allowances for that scenario, even if it was after Cummings's experience? Presumably because he was alright and had done what he wanted, so fuck the rest of us.

Know what else is strange? His wife wrote an article about their experience, which said they had been in London. I remember reading it.

It was also allegedly Cumming's mother's birthday at that time. What a remarkable coincidence
 

Ingy

Vital Football Legend
Hold on a minute.

Cummings was absolutely central in making the rules on this. This isn't a case of someone wanting to obey government rules but finding them too rigid for his circumstances. This guy made the rules, and could have made them absolutely any way he wanted, to take account of any situation he wanted.

The scenario of a young child with two very ill parents was not a difficult one to envisage. He and the rest of his clan didn't bother to account for it. They didn't bother to tell us, Johnny public, that it was ok to completely disobey the guidance in those circumstances.

We were sat at home, reading stories of police patrolling "non essential" aisles, dying lakes black and ordering small shops not to stock Easter eggs.

For all of us on the ground, it didn't look like the authorities wanted any loopholes, no matter how sick we got.

Why didn't they announce allowances for that scenario, even if it was after Cummings's experience? Presumably because he was alright and had done what he wanted, so fuck the rest of us.
Calm yourself down chap I am not hanging around for anything. I am not looking at it from a political points scoring angle I am saying that personally his response to put the child first is not a bad decisi on.There is no doubting the government have not been good at putting the rules/advice across.
 

Lienking

Vital 1st Team Regular
Out of interest, what is it about him that you can't stand? Surely not competence. Do you think he would be a better pm than the current idiot?
Firstly we didn't get a choice of Starmer or Boris, so there's no way he could actually have been PM. I don't believe he would be a better PM anyway though. There's a massive difference in standing in Parliament asking questions in a manner that he has earned a living at, and running a country. Like all MPs he stood on a mandate of respecting the Brexit vote, then spent years leading the campaign to stop it (whilst JC sat on the fence). He may be a nice bloke in real life, but just comes over as a typical lawyer with little personality.
 

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
Calm yourself down chap I am not hanging around for anything. I am not looking at it from a political points scoring angle I am saying that personally his response to put the child first is not a bad decisi on.There is no doubting the government have not been good at putting the rules/advice across.
Every other parent who has had COVID has had to stay at home and cope, because that was what we were told to do. The guidance was that this was to save lives.

Screenshot_20200523-182202_Twitter.jpg It says "stay at home" three separate times, not "do whatever you think best, even if that means driving 264 miles".

How many families have just done their best to cope because of this? Everyone who has followed these rules should be incandescent about this.

And every one of us is now wondering whether to bother with following the letter of these restrictions when the ones making the rules do whatever they want and the government aggressively defend them for doing so.
 

Pope John XXIII

Vital Football Legend
This is the Spectator today; hardly a leftie rag; Cummings's wife is an executive for this magazine.

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-dominic-cummings-must-go/amp?__twitter_impression=true

The suspicion remains that somewhere, deep in their hearts, the cabinet’s collective reaction to this scandal – for such it is – is predicated on a still darker appreciation of an unwelcome political reality. Namely that the Prime Minister, whatever his other talents, is not actually up to the job of running the country in a moment such as this. I suspect they know this too and this leads them to a situation in which they decline to concede anything for fear that a single concession might topple the entire rickety edifice.
 
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i am a tree

Vital 1st Team Regular
This is the Spectator today; hardly a leftie rag

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-dominic-cummings-must-go/amp?__twitter_impression=true

The suspicion remains that somewhere, deep in their hearts, the cabinet’s collective reaction to this scandal – for such it is – is predicated on a still darker appreciation of an unwelcome political reality. Namely that the Prime Minister, whatever his other talents, is not actually up to the job of running the country in a moment such as this. I suspect they know this too and this leads them to a situation in which they decline to concede anything for fear that a single concession might topple the entire rickety edifice.
I was literally just about to post that i'm a little worried about what would happen if Cummings is sacked.
Who's in charge then, Johnson?
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
Firstly we didn't get a choice of Starmer or Boris, so there's no way he could actually have been PM. I don't believe he would be a better PM anyway though. There's a massive difference in standing in Parliament asking questions in a manner that he has earned a living at, and running a country. Like all MPs he stood on a mandate of respecting the Brexit vote, then spent years leading the campaign to stop it (whilst JC sat on the fence). He may be a nice bloke in real life, but just comes over as a typical lawyer with little personality.
So it's just the brexit thing.