Coronavirus | Page 74 | Vital Football

Coronavirus

plumbob

Vital Football Hero
Nope I blame the government who were told to do this two weeks ago, its all documented if you can be bothered. Boris tried to hang Manchester and failed, Well done Andy for sticking up for his constituents, and all of a sudden we have 80% furlough again.
The truth will be somewhere in the middle.
Personally, I didn't think the local thing would ever work. Yes, the govershould have taken the advice and jumped to lockdown much earlier.
One reason I thought local wouldn't work is said idiots (and there are a very, very large number of them) were never going to observe the rules, and a smaller number would look for ways around them. That can be said of full lockdown, plenty will just carry on and pay a fine, as some kind of medal.
A woman in Barnsley says "sod that" when asked about the rules, fucking idiot. An old couple down south say " where will we find the money to pay these fine?", fucking idiots. Government ignores advice of the very experts they recruited to help them, make continuous bad decisions, make targets they know they wont hit, make unclear rules, and put money before lives.
Parts of the population, idiots. People, of all ages, flooding the streets and bars when specifically asked not to, fucking idiots. Government, idiots. Maybe the task of government could be easier without the idiot quota in the general population. Maybe less idiots in government would enable better account being taken of the other group of idiots.
Finally, I suspect there are a reasonable amount of idiots in opposition of all political persuasions. Pretty sure we will find out at the next election, hopefully in a better place than we are now.
 

NottyImp

Vital Football Legend
As the old phrase goes, the people get the government they deserve.

Unfortunately, that government then reinforces the very failings and prejudices that elected it, causing a vicious cycle. Aided and abetted, of course, by large parts of the media that operate at the level of a 3-year-old having a tantrum.

Events like this either help a society pull together and make a better go of it (see WW2 and the government immediately afterwards, especially), or they expose the weaknesses and failings in society in sharp relief.

It's pretty clear what coronavirus is doing.
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Reserves Team
Simply brilliant by Slovakia.
And says they'll test the entire population again next weekend.
All positive tests put into quarantine.
That's how to really aim to eradicate virus.
Presume they must be doing strong testing at borders/airports to go with this.

It highlights too just how far far away we are from even having anything even remotely competent.
 

Sincilbanks

Vital 1st Team Regular
Simply brilliant by Slovakia.
And says they'll test the entire population again next weekend.
All positive tests put into quarantine.
That's how to really aim to eradicate virus.
Presume they must be doing strong testing at borders/airports to go with this.

It highlights too just how far far away we are from even having anything even remotely competent.
To be fair they are testing with only a 70% reliability, so you need to test extremely regularly, but if the test can be done in 30mins (while still a herculaen effort) then it's still better than testing only those with symptoms with a 98% reliability.

The good news is if they pull it off we will have some pretty definitive information about the asymptomatic rate...
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Reserves Team
To be fair they are testing with only a 70% reliability, so you need to test extremely regularly, but if the test can be done in 30mins (while still a herculaen effort) then it's still better than testing only those with symptoms with a 98% reliability.

The good news is if they pull it off we will have some pretty definitive information about the asymptomatic rate...
And 70% knowledge of absolutely everybody is many many times better than 98% knowledge of hardly anybody here.
 

simes69

Vital 1st Team Regular
The truth will be somewhere in the middle.
Personally, I didn't think the local thing would ever work. Yes, the govershould have taken the advice and jumped to lockdown much earlier.
One reason I thought local wouldn't work is said idiots (and there are a very, very large number of them) were never going to observe the rules, and a smaller number would look for ways around them. That can be said of full lockdown, plenty will just carry on and pay a fine, as some kind of medal.
A woman in Barnsley says "sod that" when asked about the rules, fucking idiot. An old couple down south say " where will we find the money to pay these fine?", fucking idiots. Government ignores advice of the very experts they recruited to help them, make continuous bad decisions, make targets they know they wont hit, make unclear rules, and put money before lives.
Parts of the population, idiots. People, of all ages, flooding the streets and bars when specifically asked not to, fucking idiots. Government, idiots. Maybe the task of government could be easier without the idiot quota in the general population. Maybe less idiots in government would enable better account being taken of the other group of idiots.
Finally, I suspect there are a reasonable amount of idiots in opposition of all political persuasions. Pretty sure we will find out at the next election, hopefully in a better place than we are now.
Some good points, and yes, there will always be idiots. But it is worth noting that during the first lockdown there was extremely high compliance and everyone behaved well.

I think it is a little unfair to blame 'the people'. Government sets examples. The Cummings affair (it wasn't just that he did it, but gave the appearance of feeling he was entitled to do it) broke the contract with the people and made them question why they should listen.

Then, the summer. Everyone was encouraged - literally incentivised in the case of Eat Out to Help Out' - to go out and - if not party - pretty close to it. People were encouraged to support the travel industry and book holidays to Spain etc. Boris literally told people to go back to the workplace or risk losing their jobs (I remember a Daily Mail headline 'They're back (schoolkids), why aren't YOU').

It was fairly obvious where all this was going to go. And now weeks of delay before the government listens to the experts. Well, if the government isn't going to listen to the experts, why should the people?

Final point about the localised measures. I think it's the right idea, badly executed. If testing, and also tracing and enforing (encouraging) self isolation was in the hands of local public health bodies then it might have worked better.

Final final point. I do think the government will be quite happy to blame non compliance by the public as part of the long term plan to deflect blame. It's part of the problem but not all of it.
 

HoofGrantBrown

Vital Reserves Team
Some good points, and yes, there will always be idiots. But it is worth noting that during the first lockdown there was extremely high compliance and everyone behaved well.

I think it is a little unfair to blame 'the people'. Government sets examples. The Cummings affair (it wasn't just that he did it, but gave the appearance of feeling he was entitled to do it) broke the contract with the people and made them question why they should listen.

Then, the summer. Everyone was encouraged - literally incentivised in the case of Eat Out to Help Out' - to go out and - if not party - pretty close to it. People were encouraged to support the travel industry and book holidays to Spain etc. Boris literally told people to go back to the workplace or risk losing their jobs (I remember a Daily Mail headline 'They're back (schoolkids), why aren't YOU').

It was fairly obvious where all this was going to go. And now weeks of delay before the government listens to the experts. Well, if the government isn't going to listen to the experts, why should the people?

Final point about the localised measures. I think it's the right idea, badly executed. If testing, and also tracing and enforing (encouraging) self isolation was in the hands of local public health bodies then it might have worked better.

Final final point. I do think the government will be quite happy to blame non compliance by the public as part of the long term plan to deflect blame. It's part of the problem but not all of it.
Totally spot on
 

NottyImp

Vital Football Legend
Some good points, and yes, there will always be idiots. But it is worth noting that during the first lockdown there was extremely high compliance and everyone behaved well.

I think it is a little unfair to blame 'the people'. Government sets examples. The Cummings affair (it wasn't just that he did it, but gave the appearance of feeling he was entitled to do it) broke the contract with the people and made them question why they should listen.

Then, the summer. Everyone was encouraged - literally incentivised in the case of Eat Out to Help Out' - to go out and - if not party - pretty close to it. People were encouraged to support the travel industry and book holidays to Spain etc. Boris literally told people to go back to the workplace or risk losing their jobs (I remember a Daily Mail headline 'They're back (schoolkids), why aren't YOU').

It was fairly obvious where all this was going to go. And now weeks of delay before the government listens to the experts. Well, if the government isn't going to listen to the experts, why should the people?

Final point about the localised measures. I think it's the right idea, badly executed. If testing, and also tracing and enforing (encouraging) self isolation was in the hands of local public health bodies then it might have worked better.

Final final point. I do think the government will be quite happy to blame non compliance by the public as part of the long term plan to deflect blame. It's part of the problem but not all of it.
Rishi Sunak's eat out scheme is estimated to have resulted in a 17% increase in infections.
 
https://www.theguardian.com/comment...id-infection-pupils-classrooms-test-and-trace

This makes me fucking angry.

Look, I don't expect you all to turn into a leftie like me - how could I? - but please stop voting for the fucking Tories.
I'm on the leadership team in a primary school; not a classroom based teacher, and although we've got year group 'bubbles' and re-jigged the whole structure of the day and routines to make us as COVID secure as possible, it is impossible to make the school run effectively without having to cross over constantly throughout the day.

e.g. the 4/5 year olds can't eat their lunch independently, and put their leftover food and cutlery away by themselves, so adults have to be there constantly to help. If this task was undertaken by their own class teachers, those teachers wouldn't get a lunch break to eat themselves, so it falls to the likes of myself to do this.
Multiply this by slashed budgets which mean that we have staff shortages across the school; the year groups which are having to eat in their own classrooms (in order to avoid crossovers in the cramped hall) need other adults pulling from other places in school in order to supervise them, or again, their teachers wouldn't get a break. Those teachers already currently don't have a designated quiet space where they can relax for their lunch as the staff room is technically not meant to be used...

We've already got kids sitting in coats in the classroom as we're keeping as many windows and doors open as possible. Can't wait to see the winter heating bill...
 

NottyImp

Vital Football Legend
I'm on the leadership team in a primary school; not a classroom based teacher, and although we've got year group 'bubbles' and re-jigged the whole structure of the day and routines to make us as COVID secure as possible, it is impossible to make the school run effectively without having to cross over constantly throughout the day.

e.g. the 4/5 year olds can't eat their lunch independently, and put their leftover food and cutlery away by themselves, so adults have to be there constantly to help. If this task was undertaken by their own class teachers, those teachers wouldn't get a lunch break to eat themselves, so it falls to the likes of myself to do this.
Multiply this by slashed budgets which mean that we have staff shortages across the school; the year groups which are having to eat in their own classrooms (in order to avoid crossovers in the cramped hall) need other adults pulling from other places in school in order to supervise them, or again, their teachers wouldn't get a break. Those teachers already currently don't have a designated quiet space where they can relax for their lunch as the staff room is technically not meant to be used...

We've already got kids sitting in coats in the classroom as we're keeping as many windows and doors open as possible. Can't wait to see the winter heating bill...
Good luck. You have my support.