Coronavirus | Page 844 | Vital Football

Coronavirus

Numbers show it's not doing harm to the vast majority, it's made a massive difference to NHS levels and the vaccs are working and keeping people out of hospital, ICU and certainly deaths - even if we are seeing a spike again now which was fully expected as large gatherings geared up again properly.

So we can clearly rule out not doing any good and more harm - where's the more harm? And certainly looking at the numbers, where is the 'not required'.

There is an irony to your post there though mate. We were forced into this to do the right thing, but you're cherry picking sections of society who should be forced to protect you, whilst not acknowledging your role in helping to protect them.

Yet you're also commenting on Polio which was never eradicated, but was almost removed by vaccines?
My own personal experience wasn't great so I may be biased towards the other supporting arguments.
Vaccine 1 , I'm perfectly healthy pre vaccine , within 1 week of injection I'm in heartlands having chest x rays due to breathing difficulties.
Vaccine 2 , 24 hours after injection I caught delta.
Call me a cynic but I'm far from convinced
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
Honestly don't think it was forced, as Mike says, travelling is a luxury, not a right.

And the flipside, many were forced - by the virus - into hospital and many were forced - by the virus - sadly into an early death.

Not saying that flippantly and do understand the counter argument and the worries over any new medicines/vaccines. And also do get the question marks some have, as I've had all the vaccines and have had covid twice (once before, once after, being vaccinated)

Seemed the sensible route to me, to take the vaccine, I don't feel personally, forced or coerced. Then again, I wouldn't have cared if it had killed me, Rev Pete assures me I'd go to Devon. Think that is what he said anyway.
 
Well one of my best mates worked for Air Canada and was informed that everyone needs to get vaccinated or their contract will be terminated. And he didn't work on the plane itself or among the general public.

He also had a short time to get himself out of there and move back home before he couldn't fly, because you have to be vaccinated to fly out of Canada.

Nobody has a gun to their head, but you can't tell me there isn't pressure or coercion.
 

The Fear

A Wise Man (once sat next to him)
Nobody has a gun to their head, but you can't tell me there isn't pressure or coercion.
Yes, for some staff, for some companies, in certain industries, that is a fair point.

I guess flipside to that, is how many of those died?

But yes, I do get the underlying point.

Thing is, like all these things, sad though any death is, it is done on the basis of 'for the greater good' like many drugs, some fall foul of them and it is of course, tragic.
 

colavfc

Vital 1st Team Regular
My points above are relating to sueing from death by jab by the way.
Not in relation to having the jab at all.
Just to make that clear. I'm just trying to see it from the family of the deceased but like the point fear made, there are families of death by covid so it's a bit of a grey area isn't it.
 

Melon Donkey

I am a little bit perplexed
Didn't the Canadian truck drivers have their bank accounts froze? That's a pretty big threat is it not?
Don't know mate. I was responding to the suggestion that the UK government had forced people. No idea about abroad.

I know its picking but again 'threat' is not force. The word 'force' into the argument brings a whole different connotation. It's great for the effect of the argument but in the case of covid jabs it's just not true. Of course there were implications made about what could happen to those who didn't get jabbed but the buffoon and Co made it clear that it was not mandatory.

I don't think these so called 'threats' ever materialised. Certainly in the NHS I can tell you that no one got fired for not getting the jab despite the supposed rhetoric from the authorities.
 
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colavfc

Vital 1st Team Regular
Don't know mate. I was responding to the suggestion that the UK government had forced people. No idea about abroad.

I know its picking but again 'threat' is not force. Bringing the word 'force' into the argument then it has a whole different connotation to the argument. It's great for the effect of the argument but in the case of covid jabs it's just not true. Of course there were implications made about what could happen to those who didn't get jabbed but the buffoon and Co made it clear that it was not mandatory.

I don't think these so called 'threats' ever materialised. Certainly in the NHS I can tell you that no one got fired for not getting the jab despite the supposed rhetoric from the authorities.
Again. This is not my view per se. It is just for debate purposes.
There was loads and loads of public messages and media saying NHS staff were facing the sack if they weren't vaccinated. So for the general public (at the time) what message would that of sent?
And this went on for a long time. It wasn't just an empty threat for a week but it went on for months.
Then there's the travel. Alot of people have family and partners abroad. What so we can't see our partners if we don't get a jab? Because for two years more or less every country in the world demanded a vaccine certificate.
So the choice between not seeing your family or getting a jab that might or might not kill you?

Surely you see the other side of the coin here? If we are going to have an open and centralised debate at least open your eyes just a tad.

People were being told basically. Have the jab or don't see your family. That's what it boiled down to..... With no end date in sight. ???????? I'm not saying this is the right angle. I'm just saying this is a psychological standpoint that we should at least think about.
 

Melon Donkey

I am a little bit perplexed
Again. This is not my view per se. It is just for debate purposes.
There was loads and loads of public messages and media saying NHS staff were facing the sack if they weren't vaccinated. So for the general public (at the time) what message would that of sent?
And this went on for a long time. It wasn't just an empty threat for a week but it went on for months.
Then there's the travel. Alot of people have family and partners abroad. What so we can't see our partners if we don't get a jab? Because for two years more or less every country in the world demanded a vaccine certificate.
So the choice between not seeing your family or getting a jab that might or might not kill you?

Surely you see the other side of the coin here? If we are going to have an open and centralised debate at least open your eyes just a tad.

People were being told basically. Have the jab or don't see your family. That's what it boiled down to..... With no end date in sight. ???????? I'm not saying this is the right angle. I'm just saying this is a psychological standpoint that we should at least think about.
Don't need to be told to open my eyes thankyou . They are very wide believe me.
We are going round in circles here. It's quite simple. My point is and all I ever took issue with was the use of the word force. Its wrong and just sensationalist use of a word because as it sounds better. It has no place in your centralised debate unlike the word 'threat' which you then reason out , as others have and makes more sense to me and I understand the argument there.
 
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No. The biggest thing stopping the spread was lockdowns/ social distancing etc.
The vaccines mostly benefit the sick and the old. The vast majority of young healthy people would fight covid off through natural immune response. The vaccines have done a lot of damage to people that didn't need them.
The big unknown now is the impact of long covid.
 
No. The biggest thing stopping the spread was lockdowns/ social distancing etc.
The vaccines mostly benefit the sick and the old. The vast majority of young healthy people would fight covid off through natural immune response. The vaccines have done a lot of damage to people that didn't need them.
The big unknown now is the impact of long covid.
I can’t slice and dice this post any other way, what a load of shit Sil, you bored and on the wind up again?
 
No. The biggest thing stopping the spread was lockdowns/ social distancing etc.
The vaccines mostly benefit the sick and the old. The vast majority of young healthy people would fight covid off through natural immune response. The vaccines have done a lot of damage to people that didn't need them.
The big unknown now is the impact of long covid.
I'm not sure lockdowns etc helped as even in the most restrictive times there were 1000 people or so a day dying. Too much of a coincidence for me that as soon as the vaccines were rolled out the numbers went down.

Don't forget also that plenty of fit , healthy people also died from Covid so it wasn't exclusive to the elderly and those with ongoing health issues.
 
How many fit , healthy , young people died actually of covid though? A tiny percentage .
Anyway the vaccines aren't really working as we see new variants e.g. January this year was massive infection levels despite the vaccine roll out.
We will now see how it goes as people live with covid without bothering to take vaccines. It will generally just be the old and frail passing away not the others