Coronavirus vaccine | Page 66 | Vital Football

Coronavirus vaccine

Billy_Bleach

Vital Squad Member
After Johnsons positivity at the beginning of the week a more sobering assessment by JVT at yesterday's briefing. Cases rising in many areas after weeks of falls. Lots of ups and downs before we are out of this.

Schools back will no doubt see an increase. I still don't see why we don't just write off this academic year and have everyone repeat the same year in September
No education or social interaction for kids from December 2020 to September 2021? Madness.
 

jogills

Vital 1st Team Regular
I don't know why.you are being so obtuse? There is plenty of evidence linking religion and coronavirus - the highest covid rate in the world is in Stamford Hill in North London which just happens to be (jhtb) populated by deeply religious orthodox Jews. It might jhtb coincidence, or it might be religion that is the reason.

If you are rights and it's a "poverty lag" then the massive difference in take up rates will be corrected in a few weeks time. We'll soon see who is right.
Looks like we are both being obtuse then. I specifically said that some might be motivated to quote religion as a reason for not taking the vaccine. I just don't share your view that it's the main, or even a very widespread reason. I don't look for that angle in everything I see. Take up rates are improving already, keep up.
 

Tarian

Vital Squad Member
Unless you believe that all black people are evangelical christians, who believe in god rather than medicine, your earlier suggestion wobbles. Those figures from the BBC do not give an idea of why the take up varies so much and researchers, who have asked more detailed questions, have discovered reluctance rather than opposition. I would guess that alongside all other considerations that our records for these groups are less good. Less settled domiciles, lower registration with GPs etc. It will be interesting to see the figures once local health professionals and local administrators have done their thing.
You are onto something ....
....nuances that the Commentariat rarely bothers with.

Where is the evidence that ethnicity is relevant - re: infection or vaccination take-up ?

Surely culture and behaviour are the dominant factors ?
For example, it seems that Indians (in the UK) are less likely to be infected...
...and more likely to embrace vaccination than their Pakistani neighbours ?
Isn't this same ethnicity but different culture ?

And given the well-known (at least they should be) differences between Caribbean Africans and African Africans ....
...which further sub-divide by culture and tradition....

I await the evidence that "race" is the determining factor rather than culture behaviour and for infection, living conditions....
(e.g. higher density living and multi-generational families.)
 

madrid_gill

Vital Squad Member
Schools back will no doubt see an increase. I still don't see why we don't just write off this academic year and have everyone repeat the same year in September
The trouble with that is that it'll have a knock-on effect , from children who've not started school yet right the way down to children who've not even been born yet. If the children who started school (or were supposed to) in September 2020 end up actually starting in September 2021, that means there are very few places available for those who are supposed to be starting in September 2021. So they get pushed back to start in September 2022, those who are supposed to start in 2022 pushed back to 2023, etc.

To avoid that you'd need to find a huge number of extra school places, teachers, etc., because with that plan, somewhere along the line, you're going to have two years' worth of kids trying to complete the same school year. Either that, or try to streamline the curriculum - try to cram the work they'd normally do in 3 years down into 2 or something like that.
 

markinkent

Vital 1st Team Regular
No education or social interaction for kids from December 2020 to September 2021? Madness.
120,000+ dead. Madness. Schools increase the spread of it

The point of repeating the year is that they won't miss out on Education.

Lack of social interaction is a major issue but for those with access to it social media is the way most kids socialise anyway e.g. on line gaming. Kids will be socialising outside like the rest of us in the coming months so September 2021 is a bit of exaggeration.
 

markinkent

Vital 1st Team Regular
The trouble with that is that it'll have a knock-on effect , from children who've not started school yet right the way down to children who've not even been born yet. If the children who started school (or were supposed to) in September 2020 end up actually starting in September 2021, that means there are very few places available for those who are supposed to be starting in September 2021. So they get pushed back to start in September 2022, those who are supposed to start in 2022 pushed back to 2023, etc.

To avoid that you'd need to find a huge number of extra school places, teachers, etc., because with that plan, somewhere along the line, you're going to have two years' worth of kids trying to complete the same school year. Either that, or try to streamline the curriculum - try to cram the work they'd normally do in 3 years down into 2 or something like that.

Or we just start one year older at 6 and those that would have started in September defer to September 22. Most of Europe start school at 6. Very few start as early as we do.

It might not be ideal but neither is the impact on everyone at school right now.
 

madrid_gill

Vital Squad Member
Or we just start one year older at 6 and those that would have started in September defer to September 22.
That's what I said, the knock-on effect of every year group having to start a year later.

Most of Europe start school at 6. Very few start as early as we do.
Don't know about elsewhere in Europe, but here in Spain they start infant school in the year they turn 3 (so the youngest are starting aged 2). Infant school isn't compulsory, but I don't know of a single family that hasn't sent their child to infant school.

120,000+ dead. Madness. Schools increase the spread of it
Don't know if you saw it, but a few pages back in this thread I put up some figures from my sons' school regarding Covid cases so far this year. As long as they take reasonable measures, there's nothing in the figures to suggest that schools are a major problem in terms of spreading. Biggest concern for me would be the fact that they're saying masks aren't going to be compulsory in schools.
 

Billy_Bleach

Vital Squad Member
120,000+ dead. Madness. Schools increase the spread of it

The point of repeating the year is that they won't miss out on Education.

Lack of social interaction is a major issue but for those with access to it social media is the way most kids socialise anyway e.g. on line gaming. Kids will be socialising outside like the rest of us in the coming months so September 2021 is a bit of exaggeration.
How old are your kids mate?
 

jogills

Vital 1st Team Regular
You are onto something ....
....nuances that the Commentariat rarely bothers with.

Where is the evidence that ethnicity is relevant - re: infection or vaccination take-up ?

Surely culture and behaviour are the dominant factors ?
For example, it seems that Indians (in the UK) are less likely to be infected...
...and more likely to embrace vaccination than their Pakistani neighbours ?
Isn't this same ethnicity but different culture ?

And given the well-known (at least they should be) differences between Caribbean Africans and African Africans ....
...which further sub-divide by culture and tradition....

I await the evidence that "race" is the determining factor rather than culture behaviour and for infection, living conditions....
(e.g. higher density living and multi-generational families.)
All that really concerns me is that we reach the maximum number of people in each and every group and get them vaccinated. It's going well so far, the groups that were expected to be hard to reach are beginning to be reached and I remain hopeful that we will vaccinate the overwhelming majority of all our people. I think it's the sort of thing we do well when national politicians keep out of the details. I think we will learn more about ourselves that will prove useful in the future.
 

markinkent

Vital 1st Team Regular
How old are your kids mate?
Only one at school now is 17. This was his A level exam year so totally disrupted although at least it's teacher assessment and not that algorithm of last year.

It's really tough with those with younger kids who need homeschooling I get that but the last thing anyone needs is this lockdown to drag on for any longer through increases again
 

markinkent

Vital 1st Team Regular
That's what I said, the knock-on effect of every year group having to start a year later.



Don't know about elsewhere in Europe, but here in Spain they start infant school in the year they turn 3 (so the youngest are starting aged 2). Infant school isn't compulsory, but I don't know of a single family that hasn't sent their child to infant school.



Biggest concern for me would be the fact that they're saying masks aren't going to be compulsory in schools.

Infant school sounds like the equivalent of kindergarten/nursery rather than primary school here. Would that be right ?

Not making masks compulsory is crazy. The far Eastern countries were masks are the norm have shown us the benefits.
 

ThreeSixes

Vital 1st Team Regular
It's really tough with those with younger kids who need homeschooling I get that but the last thing anyone needs is this lockdown to drag on for any longer through increases again
When's it going to end then? The 120k dead are not coming back, and coronavirus is unlikely to go.

My boys are 17 and 15. The oldest is doing ok, but the youngest isn't. I know other parents and families that aren't doing well either.

I think the young have done their bit and sacrificed enough
 
I havd an 8 year old who is fairly bright and likes school and learning in general but even she's had enough of home schooling. A few of her friends parents have had relentless battles trying to get their kids to even log on to their online lessons let alone complete any of their work set online.

Think it's time for the kids to go back I just wish the teachers had got priority vaccinations to protect them. Having said that there are other people/groups who could argue they should get priority too. If schools are to remain open though it's a gamble to send them all back in one hit IMO. If all goes wrong it could set us back weeks at best. It's been a long hard slog for the kids, teachers and parents and everything should be done to ensure it goes as smoothly as possible, that includes vaccinating teachers.
 

madrid_gill

Vital Squad Member
Infant school sounds like the equivalent of kindergarten/nursery rather than primary school here. Would that be right ?

Not making masks compulsory is crazy. The far Eastern countries were masks are the norm have shown us the benefits.
Strictly speaking, not really, as there are also nurseries here, for babies from around 6 months old through until they start infant school. But obviously, given the ages of the children, what they're doing in infant school here is probably similar to what kids are doing in nursery in the UK.

Over here they have 3 years in infants, 6 years in primary and 4 years in secondary school (starting in the year they turn 3, 6 and 12 respectively).

And every child over the age of 6, I think it is, has to wear a mask all day at school.
 

jogills

Vital 1st Team Regular
My children are in their 40s and I have a peripheral interest in my grandchildrens' education. I don't need a strong opinion about what schools, teachers and pupils should be doing and I don't have much current, relevant experience and information. Why are pensioners invited to jump up and down about this issue by politicians and the media. We are stuck with the legacy of the government's initial posturing on this issue and the attempt to frame it as ideologically driven unions against families and schooling. Attention everybody, sit up and listen! Calm down and if it's nothing to do with you get on with your own work quietly.
 

GillsBluenose

Vital 1st Team Regular
Although everyone knows that lockdown and home schooling has been damaging for schoolchildren and their parents, we are talking about the one section of society that, as things stand, will never get a vaccine.

They would needed to be tested every day as a test is only accurate at the time it is done, but at the end of every day they go back from mixing with their mates and teachers, to mixing with their, often extended, families. I also often saw crowding at the school gate in December.

On that basis, I do not see any possibility that cases will NOT rise from towards the end of March, allowing for the gap representing the normal incubation period (between 5 and 14 days).

The race against the speed of the vaccination programme will then truly be on.
 

LancsGordoRoad

Vital 1st Team Regular
You are onto something ....
....nuances that the Commentariat rarely bothers with.

Where is the evidence that ethnicity is relevant - re: infection or vaccination take-up ?

Surely culture and behaviour are the dominant factors ?
For example, it seems that Indians (in the UK) are less likely to be infected...
...and more likely to embrace vaccination than their Pakistani neighbours ?
Isn't this same ethnicity but different culture ?

And given the well-known (at least they should be) differences between Caribbean Africans and African Africans ....
...which further sub-divide by culture and tradition....

I await the evidence that "race" is the determining factor rather than culture behaviour and for infection, living conditions....
(e.g. higher density living and multi-generational families.)

The World Health Organisation monitors vaccination programs around the globe and collates data on uptake etc. Your point about culture, which may be well founded, will likely be proved or disproved when the next batch of data are released - think that will be in July 2021. WHO already has evidence that, in general, slow or low vaccination uptake isn`t restricted to poor countries.
 

Nobby_66

Vital 1st Team Regular
F***ing Sky are at it again, the PM has set out a clear road map to easing of restrictions. Has explained each step in detail and added that we could only take the next step if the four tests allow. He has also explained that the dates set are the "earliest possible" dates that that step could be taken.

Step forward Ms Sophie Ridge to ask Rishi Sunk "If the data was better than expected, the PMs Road map could happen quicker?"

Ffs, don't these people realise they have some semblance of responsibility and that the public cling onto everything they say? This is seriously starting to get on my nerves. It's bad enough that parks and seafronts are packed like it was a summers day, without the MSN outlets pushing and pushing for earlier release.
We are at a stage where, I believe, the government and scientists are singing from the same hymn sheet and are starting to get most things right without buckling to pressure. Let's not f*** it up now.

http://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-...wn-release-chancellor-tells-sky-news-12231444