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China warned there will be a reckoning ..

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Michael Gove accuses China of hiding true scale of coronavirus crisis amid mounting diplomatic row

The initial reporting from China was "not clear" about the scale or the infectiousness of Covid-19, Mr Gove said

By Gordon Rayner, Political Editor 29 March 2020 • 9:00pm
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Credit: Paul Grover for the Telegraph


China’s failure to give “clear” information about the spread of the coronavirus has been blamed for worsening the spread of the disease amid a growing diplomatic row with Beijing.
Michael Gove said China had not shared accurate data about the “scale, nature and infectiousness” of the disease, as Downing Street sources suggesting the Communist superpower would face a “reckoning” when the pandemic is over.
Tory MPs have used the anger towards China to renew calls for the Government to rethink its policy on using Huawei to build part of the 5G mobile phone network.
But there were also accusations that ministers are using China as a convenient scapegoat to deflect criticism from the Government’s failure to ramp up testing in the way that many other countries have done.
Britain has only just reached the 10,000 tests per day mark, whereas Germany, which has a much lower death rate from coronavirus, does 500,000 tests per week, seven times as many as the UK.
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Asked why Britain was so far behind some other countries in the scale of its testing regime, Mr Gove said: “The first case of coronavirus in China was established in December of last year, but it was also the case that some of the reporting from China was not clear about the scale, the nature, the infectiousness of this.” Credit: Reuters
The Government says it will increase that number to 25,000 tests per day, without giving a specific timescale, and is unable to say when it will be able to test all NHS workers.
Asked why Britain was so far behind some other countries in the scale of its testing regime, Mr Gove said: “The first case of coronavirus in China was established in December of last year, but it was also the case that some of the reporting from China was not clear about the scale, the nature, the infectiousness of this.”
Government sources have accused China of “spreading lies” about the virus to escape blame, including an attempt to suggest that a US Army delegation which visited Wuhan, the source of the pandemic, could have been to blame.
Ministers have privately expressed anger at the way China’s obsession with secrecy has hampered the global response to the virus, with suggestions from scientific advisers that the true number of infections could be 40 times higher than Beijing has admitted.

Tom Tugendhat, the Tory chairman of the foreign affairs select committee, said: “It’s quite clear that the relationship with China has got to change.
“The idea that we can import cheap goods and not import the consequences of slave labour, of silencing opposition and government repression, including of the truth about pandemic outbreaks, is clearly not true.”

While civil servants are understood to have urged the Prime Minister to stick to his current policy on China, some Cabinet ministers and close aides are increasingly uncomfortable with the closeness of the UK’s relationship with Beijing.
Iain Duncan Smith, the former Tory leader who has led calls for Huawei to be locked out of 5G contracts, said that the virus should lead to a “rethink” of how dependent Britain has become on China and a shift in foreign policy.
He said: “It is bigger than just Huawei. China dominates everything and this should be a massive wake-up call to the Government.”
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Wuhan: Workers wearing protective suits carry out a disinfection at Wushang Plaza Shopping Center Credit: China News Service
On the question of why Germany was so far ahead of the UK in its testing regime, Mr Gove said: “It’s certainly the case that the Germans have had success in testing. There are other countries that are also ramping up testing, but the acceleration here in the UK is significant.
“Frankly the most important thing is not to look backwards but to look forwards and to do everything that we can to increase the number of tests.
“Once this dreadful epidemic is over there will be an opportunity to look back and to learn appropriate lessons.”
Tony Blair, the former prime minister, said the “constructive” answer was to test “virtually everybody” in Britain to enable healthy people to get back to work and end the current lockdown.
 
At least Blair is stating the obvious, but all the government ministersvwhen questioned about the lack of testing obfuscate their answers avoiding the critical part of what is the reason we are not doing large scale testing.

i can think of two reasons, one being that they haven’t bought anywhere near enough testing kits or established a mechanism for testing the population at large and secondly they worry that if they do that the results will show that this has all been a massive over-reaction Stemming from bad science and a lack of common sense.
 
At least Blair is stating the obvious, but all the government ministersvwhen questioned about the lack of testing obfuscate their answers avoiding the critical part of what is the reason we are not doing large scale testing.

i can think of two reasons, one being that they haven’t bought anywhere near enough testing kits or established a mechanism for testing the population at large and secondly they worry that if they do that the results will show that this has all been a massive over-reaction Stemming from bad science and a lack of common sense.

It could also be that it was found that of all the China tests kits bought by Italy and Spain (and by extraction elsewhere), only 30% were accurate - and there is no question that this spooked us badly and we're determined to not make the same mistake, for example I know we're looking to predominantly (if not all) European/uk based test kit manufacturers and we had to review their production facilities and batch test what they were producing, one such Dutch manufacturer I know has only been able to do small runs up until lately, but will be producing nearly 5 mill units in April (although even then their sales will be on allocation only) - the secondary but just as big a problem is all the swab/wound wipes manufacturers were caught out and are only now ramping production, and it's no good having test kits without the wipes to go with them.

These are exactly the same reasons that the US have been caught out for test kits.

That is the real actual reasons why we've been slow to ramp up testing - why they do not want to not answer this directly, I do not understand.

I know for a fact that I'm right, as I am now dealing with a manufacturers agent in the uk and he is a long time friend.

The UK has placed orders with 6 manufacturers. My dutch friend's company is not yet one of them.
 
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So we get thru the virus then kick off world war three to make sure the human race truly gets wiped out......FFS....

That's not what he's saying at all.

It's a pointed reference to their truthness, their standards and following international protocols; China will have to give the World cast iron verifiable guarantees of how they will behave in future - if they don't, then and only then will you see more non-china investment and investment opportunities, for example, Huawei, for one, will perhaps now see their rollout of 5G modified by force of trade.

https://telecoms.com/503362/huawei-faces-fresh-threat-from-us-china-spat-over-covid-19/

No doubt the Americans will lead that reassessment (to our shame), but I hope now we too will have a long hard look at our trading relationship with China, which is after all a murderous dictatorship and no better than any other in the World we've railed against.

We all now should understand the real price of 'cheap' Chinese components and assembly and it goes way beyond the point of sale price.
 
It could also be that it was found that of all the China tests kits bought by Italy and Spain (and by extraction elsewhere), only 30% were accurate - and there is no question that this spooked us badly and we're determined to not make the same mistake, for example I know we're looking to predominantly (if not all) European/uk based test kit manufacturers and we had to review their production facilities and batch test what they were producing, one such Dutch manufacturer I know has only been able to do small runs up until lately, but will be producing nearly 5 mill units in April (although even then their sales will be on allocation only) - the secondary but just as big a problem is all the swab/wound wipes manufacturers were caught out and are only now ramping production, and it's no good having test kits without the wipes to go with them.

These are exactly the same reasons that the US have been caught out for test kits.

That is the real actual reasons why we've been slow to ramp up testing - why they do not want to not answer this directly, I do not understand.

I know for a fact that I'm right, as I am now dealing with a manufacturers agent in the uk and he is a long time friend.

The UK has placed orders with 6 manufacturers. My dutch friend's company is not yet one of them.
I’m not doubting what you say EX but how then are Germany doing 500,000 a week as reported today and apparently keeping the lid on the problem...are they using faulty tests?
 
Anyone who didn't have their head completely up their own ass, had more than enough lead time to manufacture an adequate amount of accurate tests locally, but they didn't.

The reason the Spanish Flu is called Spanish Flu, is not because that is where the disease originated, it's because that the first place that freely reported the problem they were dealing with. The rest of the Allied world tucked their heads in the sand, and successfully conspired to keep the general public in the dark about the real danger they were facing.

Some of these world leaders are just not up to the task.

.
 
I’m not doubting what you say EX but how then are Germany doing 500,000 a week as reported today and apparently keeping the lid on the problem...are they using faulty tests?

No, they had and still have their own manufacturing capacity and the first thing they did was ban all exports, so what they produce, they can use and their manufacturing was given massive financial aid to ramp up/switch production.

the problem for other producers outside of Germany was getting their hands on the reagents (the stuff needed for the tests) and BASF had in spades, but weren't allowed to let anyone outside of Germany to get their hands on it, they did the same with their PPE - nice EU solidarity right?!
 
Not illnesses thankfully mate..... just not being able to share birthdays/activities etc with our grandchildren...the wife is so depressed at not being in their company and it rubs off on me a bit ....two grandchildren and one sons birthdays coming up in April that we will miss out on. They live too far away anyway to justify any sort of
a journey even if we could go given the lockdown!..
 
Not illnesses thankfully mate..... just not being able to share birthdays/activities etc with our grandchildren...the wife is so depressed at not being in their company and it rubs off on me a bit ....two grandchildren and one sons birthdays coming up in April that we will miss out on. They live too far away anyway to justify any sort of
a journey even if we could go given the lockdown!..

Are you managing to video conference/face time with them?
 
Not illnesses thankfully mate..... just not being able to share birthdays/activities etc with our grandchildren...the wife is so depressed at not being in their company and it rubs off on me a bit ....two grandchildren and one sons birthdays coming up in April that we will miss out on. They live too far away anyway to justify any sort of
a journey even if we could go given the lockdown!..
I know how you feel mate , we missed one of our grandsons eighth birthday this week . We shared it on WhatsApp but it ain’t the same .
 
But just think about how you'll both feel when you do see them in real life again!

And when you have, just remember....

...That's the mindset you need now!!

Yep I am always positive it was my missus that dragged me down a bit cos she is really missing them...onwards and upwards...just cheered her up buying pressies online for them to their addresses.
 
But just think about how you'll both feel when you do see them in real life again!

And when you have, just remember....

...That's the mindset you need now!!

This is the early signs of the mental side of isolation. I am already feeling it, not so much the staying in but having no diversion from reality. I am now worrying about what's waiting on the other side of this. Plus my health issues being pushed back. My vulnerability due to my health etc. I'm not cracking as I'm pretty resilient but we are all different and some will feel it more than others.