Brentford away - Boxing Day - 7:30pm

Hogan seems to have divided opinion. I'm a bit in between on him. I do think he needs to do more to get himself into the game but we've given the bloke nothing at all. Have we played a single through ball to him in a year? He looks so far short of confidence it's untrue. As for Davis people seem to be turning on him now. For me if you've got a bloke who is big, strong, reasonably quick and can hold the ball up but isn't a great finisher then you get bodies around him fast for him to lay off to and create chances. Not leave him isolated. You look at what players you have and pick a way of playing that suits them. Instead we just send 11 men onto the pitch with no plan other than don't lose if possible.
 
At the base of our midfield we had Jedi and Whelan. Brentford had The Little Ginger Lad and he was worth both of them put together.
 
JW85 - 27/12/2017 11:03

Hogan seems to have divided opinion. I'm a bit in between on him. I do think he needs to do more to get himself into the game but we've given the bloke nothing at all. Have we played a single through ball to him in a year? He looks so far short of confidence it's untrue. As for Davis people seem to be turning on him now. For me if you've got a bloke who is big, strong, reasonably quick and can hold the ball up but isn't a great finisher then you get bodies around him fast for him to lay off to and create chances. Not leave him isolated. You look at what players you have and pick a way of playing that suits them. Instead we just send 11 men onto the pitch with no plan other than don't lose if possible.
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The irony of that post is to give Davis and Hogan half a dozen games together and see where it takes us.

We’ll be able to quickly tell if they can work it out, but more importantly as individuals whether they are any good playing alongside someone.

That said, I don’t recall Hogan playing with someone up top at Brentford, it was their usual 4-3-3/4-5-1 whatever you want to call it but then I don’t remember him being that effective against us.
 
The Fear - 27/12/2017 10:34

onlyteaminthemids - 26/12/2017 21:31

For the umpteenth time, what goes on at BMH?

Can’t pass
Can’t press
Can’t control
Can’t shoot
Can’t head
Can’t attack
Can’t defend

.
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This...
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Plus

can't take throw-ins
Can't take corners
Can't take free kicks

I won't insult parks players because I have generally seen more and better of the above when I used to watch Park games near my home in Bournemouth.
 
The really worrying part in all of this is that as fans, whether we have played the game at any level or not, whatever our understanding of the game, we can all see the same problem with the team.
Steve Bruce was a top class pro playing at the highest level and is hugely experienced as a manager and doesnt seem to see the same as us. You must therefor assume that as he does the same thing every game that he is happy to play this way and will not change, or he knows no other way.
Whichever it is its not very encouraging for the rest of the season.
What is even more worrying is that nobody on the coaching staff or club hierachy has had a word with him.
Can a leopard change its spots? I think we are about tofind out.
 
villasince67 - 27/12/2017 11:09

CDX_EIRE - 27/12/2017 00:29
Someone post the Hogan goals from Brentford again please.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PxXwWINeVBU

Are you watching SB
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That’s interesting, virtually every goal comes from within the width of the 6 yard box and also no further out than the penalty spot.

He was visibility frustrated yesterday with the service he was getting.
 
By the sound of things, Bruce has now finally lost the brilliant away fans and when that usually happens it means adios.......I hope so anyway?
 
While I get where people are coming from with the Hogan criticism (and I disagree with it) I don't get how Bruce would be blameless or maybe people agree he is to blame.

Bruce fawned over this fella as the best natural finisher he's seen and wanted to sign him a load of times therefore it would seem logical that he knew this player inside out and had grand plans to give him every opportunity to succeed.

Every manager after Houllier has been a carbon copy of the previous in terms of play style. They play two wingers on their weaker side forcing them to cut in and full backs to overlap. Both full backs are not good enough in possession to be a focal point in our attack. Taylor must touch the ball more than anyone else on the team but is very reluctant to play it into the box he often comes back inside looking for Hourihane when he is playing. I think we've put more crosses in the box than any other team but the quality of delivery is shocking and we don't get enough people in the box. This is the one valid drawback of playing Grealish he sits on the edge of the box when a cross comes in so half the time you're only getting two attackers in there, the CF and the opposite winger.
 
Diabolical performance (yet again)!!! Predicted a 2 nil defeat, so no surprise that we lost, still utterly disappointed with the performance.

At home to Millwall a couple of weeks ago, we spent the 1st 15 minutes playing hoof-ball to Davis, who never won a flick-on, time to change tactics you would have thought, but, no, Bruce spends the rest of the match trying the same thing.

Said after that game that our position of 5th was a false on & that we would slide, out of the paly offs by the turn of the year.

No pace in our attacking play, poor/ non-existent movement, clueless attacking play & another team who played on the fact that Hutton defends the edge of the penalty area, not his man, therefore allowing the player to get an early cross in or be at full speed when Hutton gets close.

Bruce's football is prehistoric, he is never going to get us promoted, predict a 9th/ 10th position finish, sadly.
 
Terrible performance again. The last few weeks for me the football and results have been shocking since the Sheffield Wednesday defeat. The only time we showed any urgency was after going behind 1 nil then in the last 10 minutes. Previous posters have highlighted all the problems we seem to have. But its the lack of goals from forward positions I know we have been thin on the ground but whoever plays up front gets no service at all.

Teams around us with less experienced managers unknown and less experienced players play us of the park with the ability to pass to a team mate who is in space, and they make it look simple. Its frustrating to say the least, I didn't want Bruce but saying that I didn't think it would be this dour and I am shocked at how limited our team looks with his tactics which ever 11 are selected.

 
We lacked energy in our play with little or no movement off the ball. I was at VP for the reverse fixture and Brentford should have beaten us easily and it was only some great saves from johnstone that got us a point. They play with pace and to feet and this is something that is just alien to us at the moment. Whelan and Jedinak are good at breaking down the play (most of the time) but then there is no one who can quickly move the ball forward and spot a defence splitting pass to the strikers. Therefore we look to slow it down and loft the ball forwards in a hopeful way. Grealish runs with the ball but the others just stand still and admire his control instead of giving him an opportunity for a pass - as such the opposition can crowd him out and we are back on the defensive. There needs to be some youngsters introduced soon as other teams have worked us out and just up their game with bursts of energy that we cannot cope with.

I said last night that it was a good thing that we have dropped out of the play-off places as we are not in a position to go into the PL - what we have available to play would be annihilated in the top flight and it would be an embarrassing drop back down again. Another season in the Championship with the bringing through of some of the youngsters would not be such a bad thing

VTID
 
colavfc - 27/12/2017 01:51

I may be wrong here but hasn't our recent poor form coincided with the return of jack grealish
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Didn't see last night's game but he's been our best player when I've seen us recently. He's our only creative spark in a team of substandard workmen so I think it's very unfair to blame him
 
Watched some of MOTD last night. Most of it was in a different world from us. Burnley, players not on the radar of most clubs, playing superbly because of a brilliant manager. Teams reflect their manager. Ours isn't good enough for the players he's got. I saw this coming; it was obvious two or three weeks ago that we needed a step up in performance to move higher, or even stay in the same place. It wasn't going to happen; instead we've stepped downwards.
 
I can't believe that SB is still here today. He hasn't changed he won't change so we need to change him for someone who will get the best out of the players.

Also people are saying this bad run of form has coincided with the return of JG. I would say this run has started since the return of a certain Mr Aston Villa.

We used to have the perfect player for Scott Hogan and that is Marc Albrighton and until we get a proper winger things will be the same for Scott. Albert is a wide playing goalscorer and I've no idea what Snodgrass is, but neither are wingers.






 
Well he's not wrong is he. It was this time last season where we fell apart for a couple of months, can't afford to allow that to happen now.
 
Thomas Holte - 27/12/2017 11:12

The Fear - 27/12/2017 10:34

onlyteaminthemids - 26/12/2017 21:31

For the umpteenth time, what goes on at BMH?

Can’t pass
Can’t press
Can’t control
Can’t shoot
Can’t head
Can’t attack
Can’t defend

.
Click to expand...

This...
Click to expand...

Plus

can't take throw-ins
Can't take corners
Can't take free kicks

I won't insult parks players because I have generally seen more and better of the above when I used to watch Park games near my home in Bournemouth.
Click to expand...

Talking of Bournemouth, do you think they sent us Elphick's twin brother when we bought him? Because this bloke surely isn't the previous captain of that south coast team who beat us 2-1 at VP in the last PL match I bothered to watch that season.
As for last night ...you could see that defeat coming from as far away as ...er,....Bournemouth......playing those two old men in midfield was like watching two mistake ridden traffic cones. Bruce thinks a 'press' is something that sorts his trousers out in those expensive hotel rooms this lot frequent.
Next stop is a 3-0 thumping at Boro, on to a 1-2 'crisis' defeat by Bristol City...and we are halfway down the league, about where were were in early January LAST YEAR...and January worked so well for us last time, din't it........
 
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