Bit of Brexit info required. | Page 96 | Vital Football

Bit of Brexit info required.

Not at all. But I am presuming his innocence. That is a basic principle of our constitution. So accordingly there is no reason to delay anything. The onus is on your side to prove wrongdoing and that it affected the result.
Yes because the national crime agency just do stuff for fun. He is already being fined for wrong doing. The questions are around does it go further into criminality. If it does, as looks very likely, there is a question mark.
 
This will certainly change Europe. Whether we crash out entirely, stay in fully, stay in limbo, stay half in half out, be a rule taker, or whatever other outcome you can envisage.
The brexit referendum has been a game changer.
It would have reformed and evolved anyway. Partly because it needed it and partly just because it always will, but this spectacle has undoubtedly accelerated that markedly.
Possibly the only useful thing to come out of brexit but it could just as well be accused of accelerating nationalism of the far right kind
 
Honestly I don’t know.
The discussion I had was all about the Withdrawal Act, and getting to a point that Trade Deals and future relationships could be negotiated.

It seems as though the reality of what a disorderly exit would do, not only to our economy, but probably many other countries around the world eventually focused minds.
I think deep down there is concern that the world is facing another economic downturn, and all this uncertainty was not helpful.

The truth is, all the issues around the WTO rules and borders is correct.
Something had to change, the proposed transition does that.

Personally I think any Trade Deal will be many years in the making and will be significantly different to anything we are considering now.
I also think there will be a major evolution of the EU along the way.

We are seeing those changes happening now with the likes of Merkel moving on. And of course Juncker and co will be gone soon.

And of course we have to negotiate agreements with other countries at the same time.

I am hopeful that common sense has now broken out, and rather than being ideologically driven, this thing can be negotiated properly and professionally.

It will be sad if this progress stops this post getting to 100 pages.....
Methinks you are very optimistic. How often have u seen a genie get stuffed back in its bottle?

Every day after march is a day less to contain this madness. The latest plan is yet another deferral in a long and growing list of issues. Let's not forget orf other thread- IPCC says we have just 12 years to halt global warming before that can no longer be contained. What we are seeing here is our preference to adapt rather than change imo
 

Lienking

Vital Squad Member
Yes because the national crime agency just do stuff for fun. He is already being fined for wrong doing. The questions are around does it go further into criminality. If it does, as looks very likely, there is a question mark.
Interesting that the investigation says the Liberal Party sold their list to Britain Stronger in Europe for £100,000. The unbiased investigators will investigate this later, rather than carry out both investigations at the same time!
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
Methinks you are very optimistic. How often have u seen a genie get stuffed back in its bottle?

Every day after march is a day less to contain this madness. The latest plan is yet another deferral in a long and growing list of issues. Let's not forget orf other thread- IPCC says we have just 12 years to halt global warming before that can no longer be contained. What we are seeing here is our preference to adapt rather than change imo
I’m more optimistic than I was.
Let’s just say I would hope the person telling me this was more factual than optimistic.
If that’s not the case, I would be very worried!!

I’m not sure about stuffing the genie back in the bottle, this bit is about trying to catch him without bankrupting ourselves.

Once we’ve caught the genie we can figure out what to do with him.......
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
Everyone comes with their own preconceptions and desires though, Feco. The closer your source is to Dominic Raab or the PM, the more they will be desperate for a good result. That does tend to skew people's take on things.
It isn't far from, "I'm sure we've got the numbers" to "I hope we've got the numbers". The same is true for those promising they will vote the 'right way' when they're starting at a blood shot eyed chief whip.
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
Not sure preconceptions come into it ITTO.
What is being proposed is the only way for the Withdrawal Act, other than crashing out.
Ultimately the withdrawal is not the important bit, it’s the resultant Trade Deal.
This is a compromise now to get to that bit.
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
Not sure preconceptions come into it ITTO.
What is being proposed is the only way for the Withdrawal Act, other than crashing out.
Ultimately the withdrawal is not the important bit, it’s the resultant Trade Deal.
This is a compromise now to get to that bit.
I agree with all that. I just wonder about the parliamentary arithmetic.
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
I don’t know for sure, but I think it goes back happened at that 1922 Committee Meeting.
Whatever the PM said must have been devastating to the Hard Brexiteers, it totally wrongfooted the ERG, and brought the dissenters back in line.

They have the numbers.
 

toms

Vital Football Hero
My view is that the deal is better than hard brexiteers thought but it is interesting gove asked for legal advice on the backstop to be published
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
My view is that the deal is better than hard brexiteers thought but it is interesting gove asked for legal advice on the backstop to be published
Hopefully you are not alone in these thoughts, and this gets the parliamentary votes it needs.
We need rid of this uncertainty.

Gove is an interesting man. Aside from his politics which I don’t really agree with, he is quite capable.
Everything is done with a purpose even if it’s not always obvious.
I suspect this move is tied in with next years expected vacancy in SW1A.
 

toms

Vital Football Hero
Hopefully you are not alone in these thoughts, and this gets the parliamentary votes it needs.
We need rid of this uncertainty.

Gove is an interesting man. Aside from his politics which I don’t really agree with, he is quite capable.
Everything is done with a purpose even if it’s not always obvious.
I suspect this move is tied in with next years expected vacancy in SW1A.
My view is its planted. He has already seen the legal advice and it is strong. In the end the Government will relent and publish showing them to be on the good side. I might be being naieve but it is significant it's him doing the asking
 

toms

Vital Football Hero
I agree with all that. I just wonder about the parliamentary arithmetic.
This must be a terrible blow for you-a deal that has a decent chance to get through Parliament. Stop listening to yesterday's people and come with us on a new journey...one where divisions are healed, where we are an independent country, where business certainty returns.
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
This is Brino, Toms. The wool is being pulled over your eyes. Eternal transition.

I still haven't yet seen a solution to the backstop either. Last I saw we would be in/aligned with the customs union until, err, we aren't. Not so marvelous for uncertainty. As for divisions being healed we have to wait to see what the leaders of the OutMeansOut brigade say. Farage, Bone, etc are already calling it a betrayal. Hardly healing divisions even as a Brexit (of sorts) might be being delivered.

Anyway, I'd like to see the terms and come to a decision on how much damage has been done before popping the champagne corks. It also hasn't yet been passed by Parliament and we are yet to see how many from Labour will vote with the government.
I can count quite a few conservatives who won't.
 

in_the_top_one

Vital Football Hero
My view is its planted. He has already seen the legal advice and it is strong. In the end the Government will relent and publish showing them to be on the good side. I might be being naieve but it is significant it's him doing the asking
Or maybe he's worried that the Brexit dream is being shafted? More likely, I think.
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
My view is its planted. He has already seen the legal advice and it is strong. In the end the Government will relent and publish showing them to be on the good side. I might be being naieve but it is significant it's him doing the asking
The legal position is watertight, particularly when you consider all the alternatives open to the UK are illegal. Something that has been pointed out for weeks by people who know.

Mr Gove knows exactly what the legal situation is, he’s eyeing a new home next year and needs to keep friends on both sides of the divide.
 

Feco

Vital Squad Member
This must be a terrible blow for you-a deal that has a decent chance to get through Parliament. Stop listening to yesterday's people and come with us on a new journey...one where divisions are healed, where we are an independent country, where business certainty returns.
Don’t get to carried away. This is only about how we leave the EU. It has nothing to do with future trade deals. They could be many years in the making, and almost certainly the people involved now will not be involved.

All this has done is make sure we don’t crash out of the EU with all the consequences that entailed. Post Brexit day nothing much will have changed from where are now.

As ITTO says, the can has just had an almighty kick down the road again but this time it’s lost in the undergrowth.

Maybe a new Can will be needed post Brexit day.......