Aston Villa vs Stoke City Sat 15th Dec 3pm
- Thread starter Villan57
- Start date
McParlandTheGreat
Vital Champions League
Pitch looks green. Stoke looked as though they were playing well. Thought Nyland did OK for his saves.
holtelower
Vital Football Hero
I have been criticised on here (I think) for being fickle, well I presume it was for me.
Apparently, we cant win every game, and if we dont, we shouldnt moan.
Unfortunately, and this is a result of years of decline and lack of both ambition, and an acceptance of mediocrity can I tell people this.
Whether you are in the Premier League, Championship, League 1, 2 , Scottish , Italian, Spanish or ANY league - if you want success, and for Man City or Liverpool that is winning the league, for us , Leeds, Albion it is automatic promotion, for Barca, Madrid, Juve, it is winning the league, for Sunderland it is automatic.......
You DO have to win basically every game. That is what success is about.
This is where football has changed. When we won the league, we lost 8 games and drew 8, now if a team loses 4, they cant win the league. liverpool are still unbeaten going into Xmas.
There is no doubt we are playing better now, there is no doubt we are more exciting - I think a 5-5 cant be argued with there.
But over the past few weeks, I have seen things that I stated I was worried about 3 months ago, Smith's tactics can be very niaive, and we cannot afford (literally) to be niaive.
Leeds have not been playing well recently, but they are grinding out wins, 1-0, 2-1 whilst we are dropping points that should not be dropped.
So call me fickle but we are Aston Villa, I DO expect us to win almost every game, I EXPECT promotion and to get promotion you need 90 points, which is basically win 3 out of every 4 games - every other club that has been promoted recently has done it so I expect us to, and if we dont, then dont ecpect us to get promoted anytime soon. "Hard run of games" give me strength, we have played Middlesborough, Albion, Nottm Forest and Stoke not bloody Man City, liverpool and Spurs. Granted , Saturday was a strange scenario because when their team was announced I actually did think "Bloody hell, I have heard of virtually all of them" , usually, I have heard of one or two at most.
I am also not going to "not" criticise Smith just coz he is a Villa fan, he has made errors, at 5,4 he should have shut up shop, at 2,1 at Albion he should have, Bruce was lambasted for not playing kids and putting in journeymen , and on Saturday , that was the perfect opportunity to put O'Hare in, if not from the start, from the bench. Bruce and Lambert were lambasted and mocked for the desperate tactic of throwing on 4 forwards with no thought of how they would fit in - Smith did exactly the same on Saturday but that us apparently "showing ambition". The better vhange on Saturday would gave been switch Kodjia to centre, Abragham n Bolassie supporting and take Whelan off for the mire creative and mobile OHare not just put hogan on and tell 4 forwards to chase balls in the channels.
That was a poor performance and result on Saturday, which on its own, isnt a catastrophe, but when you also draw at home to Forest and draw when we should have beat the Albion then YES, it means we now have to win basically EVERY fame from niw until Late February just to even have a chance of top 2 !!!.
Sunday is totally and utterly history defining now, and that us nit being dramatic. Win on Saturday, we still hang on in there. Draw or lose, and we could be 13th or even 14th in the league and for all the good football will be back at square one - and that is why I am angry, because less niavity against Forest and Stoke and this game wouldnt have so much pressure on it.
Apparently, we cant win every game, and if we dont, we shouldnt moan.
Unfortunately, and this is a result of years of decline and lack of both ambition, and an acceptance of mediocrity can I tell people this.
Whether you are in the Premier League, Championship, League 1, 2 , Scottish , Italian, Spanish or ANY league - if you want success, and for Man City or Liverpool that is winning the league, for us , Leeds, Albion it is automatic promotion, for Barca, Madrid, Juve, it is winning the league, for Sunderland it is automatic.......
You DO have to win basically every game. That is what success is about.
This is where football has changed. When we won the league, we lost 8 games and drew 8, now if a team loses 4, they cant win the league. liverpool are still unbeaten going into Xmas.
There is no doubt we are playing better now, there is no doubt we are more exciting - I think a 5-5 cant be argued with there.
But over the past few weeks, I have seen things that I stated I was worried about 3 months ago, Smith's tactics can be very niaive, and we cannot afford (literally) to be niaive.
Leeds have not been playing well recently, but they are grinding out wins, 1-0, 2-1 whilst we are dropping points that should not be dropped.
So call me fickle but we are Aston Villa, I DO expect us to win almost every game, I EXPECT promotion and to get promotion you need 90 points, which is basically win 3 out of every 4 games - every other club that has been promoted recently has done it so I expect us to, and if we dont, then dont ecpect us to get promoted anytime soon. "Hard run of games" give me strength, we have played Middlesborough, Albion, Nottm Forest and Stoke not bloody Man City, liverpool and Spurs. Granted , Saturday was a strange scenario because when their team was announced I actually did think "Bloody hell, I have heard of virtually all of them" , usually, I have heard of one or two at most.
I am also not going to "not" criticise Smith just coz he is a Villa fan, he has made errors, at 5,4 he should have shut up shop, at 2,1 at Albion he should have, Bruce was lambasted for not playing kids and putting in journeymen , and on Saturday , that was the perfect opportunity to put O'Hare in, if not from the start, from the bench. Bruce and Lambert were lambasted and mocked for the desperate tactic of throwing on 4 forwards with no thought of how they would fit in - Smith did exactly the same on Saturday but that us apparently "showing ambition". The better vhange on Saturday would gave been switch Kodjia to centre, Abragham n Bolassie supporting and take Whelan off for the mire creative and mobile OHare not just put hogan on and tell 4 forwards to chase balls in the channels.
That was a poor performance and result on Saturday, which on its own, isnt a catastrophe, but when you also draw at home to Forest and draw when we should have beat the Albion then YES, it means we now have to win basically EVERY fame from niw until Late February just to even have a chance of top 2 !!!.
Sunday is totally and utterly history defining now, and that us nit being dramatic. Win on Saturday, we still hang on in there. Draw or lose, and we could be 13th or even 14th in the league and for all the good football will be back at square one - and that is why I am angry, because less niavity against Forest and Stoke and this game wouldnt have so much pressure on it.
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Holtelower, you are not fickle....you are being realistic. Some people on this site will 'attack' anyone who dares to suggest Smithy might have made a tactical error. You would think we were 10 points clear at the top of the table not in mid table mediocrity. We also have a defence like a Colindar but again it is heresy to mention this.
There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism. So thank you for making so many valid points.
We all want our club to be successful but that does not mean we should be intimidated into not expressing our opinion.
It does not take any intelligence to simply chant the ' get behind the team ' mantra.
UTV
G.T.
There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism. So thank you for making so many valid points.
We all want our club to be successful but that does not mean we should be intimidated into not expressing our opinion.
It does not take any intelligence to simply chant the ' get behind the team ' mantra.
UTV
G.T.
sirdennis
Alert Team
So G.T .You are blaming Smith for our poor defence then ?
sirdennis
Alert Team
Hmmm. Not Smith's defence though is it ? Also 18 points from his 10 games in charge with us playing some of the best football we have seen for for years isn't too shabby either. Nearly 2 points per game average since he joined and that is accepted as the norm to get promoted.
I hope you are right, sorry about the not very funny joke, couldn't resist it.?
G.T.
sirdennis
Alert Team
No worries.
For the record I would have played O'Hare on Saturday and I said that before the game . I think our midfield combination didn't work hence a below average performance.
We didn't lose though.
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Silhillvilla
Vital Football Legend
The biggest mistake smith is making is continually selecting Nyland. H
sirdennis
Alert Team
More than that Fulford. We also lost at Middlesborugh and Brighton from memory.
SAUNDERS OUT.
sirdennis
Alert Team
And Spurs away , prompting my favourite Ron Saunders quote
The press then wrote us off and he wrote in the programme for the following home game
"I quote from Confucius"
When you hark to the voice of the knocker
and listen to his hammer fall
Remember the fact
That the knockers act
Requires no brains at all.
The press then wrote us off and he wrote in the programme for the following home game
"I quote from Confucius"
When you hark to the voice of the knocker
and listen to his hammer fall
Remember the fact
That the knockers act
Requires no brains at all.
Villan57
Alert Team
Hindsight is a wonderful thing too
McParlandTheGreat
Vital Champions League
HL, you're right in that we should EXPECT to win every game, and should set out to do just that. I think DS does that, and it rubs off on the team, which is why we are now not giving up until the whistle blows.
If we don't win a game, should we or should we not moan? Be disappointed, bitterly disappointed, yes. But moaning if there's no substance behind it becomes self-destructive. You thought DS had got it wrong and so moaned; fine. I didn't think he had it wrong; I thought the defence, which has proved much better than under Bruce, is nevertheless still brittle and two mistakes from the full backs cost us two points. Credit to the team it was only two points; I didn't moan.
You say DS is naive. I don't think he is. He puts a hell of a lot of thought into how he approaches each game, something totally foreign to Bruce. He puts a lot of thought into each player, how they play, how they're used, and they go into matches much better prepared. Sometimes he doesn't do things we want him to, but he's the one who knows how things are and maybe his judgement is better. How many people thought playing El Ghazi 3 matches ago was a good idea? I'd like to see O' Hare get onto the pitch, but the fact is there's a lot of competition, and maybe DS is waiting for the right moment.
You thought he should have shut up shop against Forest and Albion. How often have we complained in the past how we've shut up shop, handed the initiative to the opposition, and paid the price? Maybe trying to get another goal to put the game to bed is actually safer.
Winning against Leeds would be great for us; we'd be that bit closer. But, realistically, this season has a long way to go, and we'd still be in the frame if we didn't; at this stage, single matches are never critical. Whatever, let's go and win, for the sake of it if nothing else!
If we don't win a game, should we or should we not moan? Be disappointed, bitterly disappointed, yes. But moaning if there's no substance behind it becomes self-destructive. You thought DS had got it wrong and so moaned; fine. I didn't think he had it wrong; I thought the defence, which has proved much better than under Bruce, is nevertheless still brittle and two mistakes from the full backs cost us two points. Credit to the team it was only two points; I didn't moan.
You say DS is naive. I don't think he is. He puts a hell of a lot of thought into how he approaches each game, something totally foreign to Bruce. He puts a lot of thought into each player, how they play, how they're used, and they go into matches much better prepared. Sometimes he doesn't do things we want him to, but he's the one who knows how things are and maybe his judgement is better. How many people thought playing El Ghazi 3 matches ago was a good idea? I'd like to see O' Hare get onto the pitch, but the fact is there's a lot of competition, and maybe DS is waiting for the right moment.
You thought he should have shut up shop against Forest and Albion. How often have we complained in the past how we've shut up shop, handed the initiative to the opposition, and paid the price? Maybe trying to get another goal to put the game to bed is actually safer.
Winning against Leeds would be great for us; we'd be that bit closer. But, realistically, this season has a long way to go, and we'd still be in the frame if we didn't; at this stage, single matches are never critical. Whatever, let's go and win, for the sake of it if nothing else!
