Aston Villa v Leicester City Match Thread | Page 35 | Vital Football

Aston Villa v Leicester City Match Thread

1958Villan

Vital Football Hero
Playing with a lone central striker means, that striker has to be willing to physically bully the two centrebacks or, has to come deeper to receive the ball, or play on the shoulder and have movement.
Both of the first two need runners from midfield willing to bust a gut to get past that striker, who, if he's going to drop deeper to receive the ball, has to have the vision and ability to play runners through.
If the striker plays between the centrebacks on the shoulder of the deepest he needs to be a bully and have good movement, pulling defenders out of position and making space.
Harry Kane is the best in the premiership at coming deeper to receive the ball. While Neal Maupay at Brighton is one of the best at playing on the shoulder, he has great movement.
I'm afraid Wesley has exhibited none of the abilities needed to be a central striker nowadays.
The step up to the premiership has and continues to be a step, or two, to big for Wesley.
 

garygaryshaw

Vital Squad Member
I'm absolutely loving the 'if only we had...' revisionism that's starting to creep in as the doom mongers get some personal validation from our crap performance yesterday, fans leaving early, and our league position.

'If only we had played two different defenders from the start...'
'If only we hadn't signed Wesley...'
'If only we had signed better players in the summer...'
'If only we had signed a better manager than Smith...'

Problem is - we are where we are. Its what we do from here that matters most. Sorry guys but there's no 'do-over' for the decisions of the past now, so going on and on about them is neither constructive or helpful.

There is plenty we can agree on though -
* We concede way to many goals to win matches - this needs sorting
* Many of the players brought in are young/ inconsistent/ not good enough yet (or might not make it)
* We are tragically light and toothless upfront, and this is two fold, Wesley hasn't performed/ is a dud; we haven't got ready replacements in the squad
* Deano isn't performing well in terms of team selection/ subs/ tactics and changing the game

We have a run of games now which we have to see a much better points return from -
- Sheff Utd away
- S'oton home
- Norwich home
- Watford away
- Burnley away
Really we need 9 pts from those 5 games to steer us away from the relegation trapdoor

And so its what we do with what we've got now is important. But its increasingly obvious that doing the same thing every week and expecting a different result is very likely not going to cut it.

These are the things I'm hoping to see from the players and coaching staff in the next month - we can't bring any new players in during this period, so its down to this group alone to sort it.

1. More flexibility from Deano
He's either got to drop Wesley or change the formation and overall approach to get more from him, either by playing someone off him, or getting other forwards close to him - no pumping the ball up as its clear he can't handle those kind of balls.

Maybe 3-5-2 or 3-4-3 (not 442 as I just don't think we have the players to dominate the middle). I think its now time for Dean to try something different.

2. Tighten things at the back
We can't keep giving away easy goals, especially from set pieces, and expect to get results from games. This team is not good enough up front to outscore the opposition toe to toe. I think our players are good enough but they are not organised and protected as a complete unit

3. Get the real John McGinn back
Its noticeable that when we play well, SJM is bringing loads of energy and running to the play, and this allows Jack to stay further forward where he's most effective. I don't know whether its instructions, fatigue or injury but we need the SJM we know to be affecting games, as its very noticeable that when SJM doesn't turn up that the team looks flat.

It goes without saying that in January - and the beginning not the end, we need top class proven reinforcements up front. Its time for our rich owners to go spend whatever it takes to keep us in this division. If we don't then I'm afraid that the pessimists will be proven right and we will take another drop to the Championship and have missed a terrific opportunity to establish the club in the top flight.
I think a lot of the defensive issues are caused from a lack of holding onto the ball further up the pitch and a lack of cover from the midfield/wingers. In most games our defence seem to be under pressure from midfielders not being tracked when they run through the middle and over lapping players out wide that again are not being covered properly.
I'd be tempted to do away with the wingers and see if it tightens things up. 4141 or 4411 maybe. It does mean our mids would need to work harder to get forward though
 

wittonite

Vital 1st Team Regular
Playing with a lone central striker means, that striker has to be willing to physically bully the two centrebacks or, has to come deeper to receive the ball, or play on the shoulder and have movement.
Both of the first two need runners from midfield willing to bust a gut to get past that striker, who, if he's going to drop deeper to receive the ball, has to have the vision and ability to play runners through.
If the striker plays between the centrebacks on the shoulder of the deepest he needs to be a bully and have good movement, pulling defenders out of position and making space.
Harry Kane is the best in the premiership at coming deeper to receive the ball. While Neal Maupay at Brighton is one of the best at playing on the shoulder, he has great movement.
I'm afraid Wesley has exhibited none of the abilities needed to be a central striker nowadays.
The step up to the premiership has and continues to be a step, or two, to big for Wesley.
I posted similar to you and crimson above re Wes and we are in agreeance that he needs to impose himself a bit more. I did however read an article last week on a site doing a resume of Wes when we first signed him and they made a big thing of the fact that at his previous club his aggresive behaviour was over the top and getting him into trouble. It said they had gone to great lenghts to coach it out of him because he was always in touble with referees.
 

1958Villan

Vital Football Hero
I posted similar to you and crimson above re Wes and we are in agreeance that he needs to impose himself a bit more. I did however read an article last week on a site doing a resume of Wes when we first signed him and they made a big thing of the fact that at his previous club his aggresive behaviour was over the top and getting him into trouble. It said they had gone to great lenghts to coach it out of him because he was always in touble with referees.
There's aggressive and there's aggressive though mate. A centre forward can be aggressive bullying a centreback without being aggressive in a way that gets him booked or sent off, it's called controlled aggression.
 

crimsondonkey

Vital Squad Member
This ^. If its being coached then they've gone too far the other way. I'd prefer he throws his weight about and gives 100% than the lacklustre and weak performances we've seen from Wes to date.

He needs to learn the dark arts - shame Duncan Ferguson isn't available to teach him!
 

wittonite

Vital 1st Team Regular
There's aggressive and there's aggressive though mate. A centre forward can be aggressive bullying a centreback without being aggressive in a way that gets him booked or sent off, it's called controlled aggression.
Yes totally agree. He seems to have gone the other way, possibly as a result of previous experience at his last club. I know us old uns go on about Peter Withe, but in that department he had it all.
 

Wurzel

Vital Football Legend
Yes totally agree. He seems to have gone the other way, possibly as a result of previous experience at his last club. I know us old uns go on about Peter Withe, but in that department he had it all.
TBF as an old one there isnt a single player in our current team that is as good as that Championship winning side. I am not being disparraging about the current crop, they just arent as good.
 

wittonite

Vital 1st Team Regular
TBF as an old one there isnt a single player in our current team that is as good as that Championship winning side. I am not being disparraging about the current crop, they just arent as good.
No, and although I know its petty, that was why I was so pissed off yesterday when our current team couldnt even get the salute to that manager, and by definition his team right at the minutes applause.
 

crimsondonkey

Vital Squad Member
This is not the article I found, but reading this did they have it wrong or have we used him wrong.
www.90min.com › posts › 6420175-wesley-moraes...
27 Jul 2019
I stopped reading when it said 'His physicality, blistering pace and ability to bully defenders out of the game are valuable assets in any league, let alone the Premier League.' :lol:

Clearly that is a different Wesley to the one we signed?
 

Wurzel

Vital Football Legend
The difference between Vardy and our front players is desire and determination. We have some very talented ball jugglers, but do they have the determination and desire, the sheer bloody mindedness to score and win that Vardy has? I think we know the answer.
 

zaijianforth

Vital Reserves Team
I think that's the first time this season the team looked resigned to losing. We allowed them to create too much time and space, as soon as we had the ball they were on us. I hope they can get over this before we face Sheffield Utd, or we could be in a bit of bother.
I think Maddison won the battle of the #10's. The harder Jack tried his passes got sloppier.
Wesley while not helping is not the sum of all of our problems.
 

crimsondonkey

Vital Squad Member
Wesley while not helping is not the sum of all of our problems.
This really is ban worthy and anti forum stuff - don't you know that after a poor performance you're supposed to single out someone to blame for that and everything else that you can remember that you don't like, and when disproved, quickly shift this blame to someone else?

If you can't get anything else to stick blame wise, then proclaim that you knew all along that this was going to happen last summer/ when the new owners took over/ decimalisation/ 1874 etc.

Up your game zaijianforth!
 

gmvillan

The Shackles Are Off!
I think Maddison won the battle of the #10's. The harder Jack tried his passes got sloppier.
.
This got me thinking - in the past two games Jack has been on the pitch with two of the players supposedly keeping him out of the England team - Maddison and Mount. I wonder if that has been on his mind? Trying too hard to prove he's better than them? And unfortunately, Mount scored a Worldie and Maddison ran our midfield ragged....
 

wittonite

Vital 1st Team Regular
This got me thinking - in the past two games Jack has been on the pitch with two of the players supposedly keeping him out of the England team - Maddison and Mount. I wonder if that has been on his mind? Trying too hard to prove he's better than them? And unfortunately, Mount scored a Worldie and Maddison ran our midfield ragged....
I touched on him trying too hard earlier, but to be fair if he was in either the Chelsea or Leicester midfield he would be in better overall company and wouldnt have had to try as hard as he does to lift our lot sometimes.