Anyone. But. Liverpool.... | Page 56 | Vital Football

Anyone. But. Liverpool....

i am a tree said:
FWIW I wasn't there and I'm only 36 so all I have to go on is my family's experience of Hillsborough and the news coverage I have got to see.

Those two accounts contradict each other. That's all I'm saying.
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THIS 100% also there was footage on YouTube of people with scouse accents on the pitch at the game moaning about fake tickets & actually showing them. That footage amazingly isn’t there anymore but I know I saw it as I was there when I saw it.

Not that Forest are in a great position to criticise on tickets as I was lifted over turnstiles repeatedly as a child & was old enough to be at the league cup final vs Man Utd.

You can’t just blame Liverpool fans obviously as there were clearly failings at the ground & the police were criminally negligent (South Yorkshire police have always been terrible with football fans & remain so to this day, as well) but the idea that Liverpool didn’t contribute is in my opinion disrespectful to those who died.


Again I would also say all the idiots who thought it was a good idea to fight at the football (whichever club they support) have to carry some of the blame as football fans were treated badly because of the actions of the idiots who drone on about mobs, manors, kicking off etc. Possibly Liverpool’s reputation, as well as the disgusting behaviour at Hysel didn’t help with their treatment by police.

The fact they invaded the pitch at the final only a few weeks after the disaster, when fences were taken down as a mark of respect & that a good few stormed through empty gates at Istanbul, whilst wearing shirts with the torches on says a great deal about personal responsibility & contrition.


It was obviously an awful thing to happen & my heart goes out to those innocent people that died & they didn’t die well it must have been a truly horrific way to die.

I don’t like Liverpool because of who they are & what they have done but I don’t like people beating them with this as something they did. They didn’t help but they didn’t do it. It was and this is an understatement a shitty situation where everyone failed & was a culmination of years of neglect, bad behaviour, incompetence & stupidity by many if not all involved.

I’m sick of it being dredged up all the time including by the scouser themselves. They & everyone should actually let the dead rest in peace.
 
Woanz said:
THIS 100% also there was footage on YouTube of people with scouse accents on the pitch at the game moaning about fake tickets & actually showing them. That footage amazingly isn’t there anymore but I know I saw it as I was there when I saw it.

Not that Forest are in a great position to criticise on tickets as I was lifted over turnstiles repeatedly as a child & was old enough to be at the league cup final vs Man Utd.

You can’t just blame Liverpool fans obviously as there were clearly failings at the ground & the police were criminally negligent (South Yorkshire police have always been terrible with football fans & remain so to this day, as well) but the idea that Liverpool didn’t contribute is in my opinion disrespectful to those who died.


Again I would also say all the idiots who thought it was a good idea to fight at the football (whichever club they support) have to carry some of the blame as football fans were treated badly because of the actions of the idiots who drone on about mobs, manors, kicking off etc. Possibly Liverpool’s reputation, as well as the disgusting behaviour at Hysel didn’t help with their treatment by police.

The fact they invaded the pitch at the final only a few weeks after the disaster, when fences were taken down as a mark of respect & that a good few stormed through empty gates at Istanbul, whilst wearing shirts with the torches on says a great deal about personal responsibility & contrition.


It was obviously an awful thing to happen & my heart goes out to those innocent people that died & they didn’t die well it must have been a truly horrific way to die.

I don’t like Liverpool because of who they are & what they have done but I don’t like people beating them with this as something they did. They didn’t help but they didn’t do it. It was and this is an understatement a shitty situation where everyone failed & was a culmination of years of neglect, bad behaviour, incompetence & stupidity by many if not all involved.

I’m sick of it being dredged up all the time including by the scouser themselves. They & everyone should actually let the dead rest in peace.
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👏👏👏👏👏👏

Well said that man
I will reiterate my point no one woke up that day thinking 96 people would die or be blamed for it
And it is horrific still thinking about it now
 
Woanz said:
THIS 100% also there was footage on YouTube of people with scouse accents on the pitch at the game moaning about fake tickets & actually showing them. That footage amazingly isn’t there anymore but I know I saw it as I was there when I saw it.

Not that Forest are in a great position to criticise on tickets as I was lifted over turnstiles repeatedly as a child & was old enough to be at the league cup final vs Man Utd.

You can’t just blame Liverpool fans obviously as there were clearly failings at the ground & the police were criminally negligent (South Yorkshire police have always been terrible with football fans & remain so to this day, as well) but the idea that Liverpool didn’t contribute is in my opinion disrespectful to those who died.


Again I would also say all the idiots who thought it was a good idea to fight at the football (whichever club they support) have to carry some of the blame as football fans were treated badly because of the actions of the idiots who drone on about mobs, manors, kicking off etc. Possibly Liverpool’s reputation, as well as the disgusting behaviour at Hysel didn’t help with their treatment by police.

The fact they invaded the pitch at the final only a few weeks after the disaster, when fences were taken down as a mark of respect & that a good few stormed through empty gates at Istanbul, whilst wearing shirts with the torches on says a great deal about personal responsibility & contrition.


It was obviously an awful thing to happen & my heart goes out to those innocent people that died & they didn’t die well it must have been a truly horrific way to die.

I don’t like Liverpool because of who they are & what they have done but I don’t like people beating them with this as something they did. They didn’t help but they didn’t do it. It was and this is an understatement a shitty situation where everyone failed & was a culmination of years of neglect, bad behaviour, incompetence & stupidity by many if not all involved.

I’m sick of it being dredged up all the time including by the scouser themselves. They & everyone should actually let the dead rest in peace.
Click to expand...
I think the main issue is people are sick of the apologists constantly trying to absolve the Liverpool fans of any blame whatsoever.

The inquiry hasn’t helped with that but while you have people trying to rewrite history it will continue to be dredged up.

As DF says, nobody meant to kill those fans but it doesn’t change the reality that they contributed to the tragedy.
 
Woanz said:
THIS 100% also there was footage on YouTube of people with scouse accents on the pitch at the game moaning about fake tickets & actually showing them. That footage amazingly isn’t there anymore but I know I saw it as I was there when I saw it.

Not that Forest are in a great position to criticise on tickets as I was lifted over turnstiles repeatedly as a child & was old enough to be at the league cup final vs Man Utd.

You can’t just blame Liverpool fans obviously as there were clearly failings at the ground & the police were criminally negligent (South Yorkshire police have always been terrible with football fans & remain so to this day, as well) but the idea that Liverpool didn’t contribute is in my opinion disrespectful to those who died.


Again I would also say all the idiots who thought it was a good idea to fight at the football (whichever club they support) have to carry some of the blame as football fans were treated badly because of the actions of the idiots who drone on about mobs, manors, kicking off etc. Possibly Liverpool’s reputation, as well as the disgusting behaviour at Hysel didn’t help with their treatment by police.

The fact they invaded the pitch at the final only a few weeks after the disaster, when fences were taken down as a mark of respect & that a good few stormed through empty gates at Istanbul, whilst wearing shirts with the torches on says a great deal about personal responsibility & contrition.


It was obviously an awful thing to happen & my heart goes out to those innocent people that died & they didn’t die well it must have been a truly horrific way to die.

I don’t like Liverpool because of who they are & what they have done but I don’t like people beating them with this as something they did. They didn’t help but they didn’t do it. It was and this is an understatement a shitty situation where everyone failed & was a culmination of years of neglect, bad behaviour, incompetence & stupidity by many if not all involved.

I’m sick of it being dredged up all the time including by the scouser themselves. They & everyone should actually let the dead rest in peace.
Click to expand...

I remember, as Liverpool fans were spilling onto the pitch, the assumption among us was they were fighting again; this suspicion was confirmed when a group of about 15-20 ran over to the Kop end giving it the 'come on' with arms outstretched in that aggressive manner we're all aware of.

I was wrong in my recollection of this, as I was later told that they were merely asking for help.
As the years have passed, it keeps amazing me how wrong I was about not just this, but most other things I saw that day.
 
Basha73 said:
I think the main issue is people are sick of the apologists constantly trying to absolve the Liverpool fans of any blame whatsoever.

The inquiry hasn’t helped with that but while you have people trying to rewrite history it will continue to be dredged up.

As DF says, nobody meant to kill those fans but it doesn’t change the reality that they contributed to the tragedy.
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Yes but people always want to absolve themselves of blame, you can sort of understand why as well given what’s happened.

It was a terrible accident & I just don’t see what penance some want from Liverpool fans will achieve although the same could be said about them & their attitude to the police.

Lessons have been learnt & there’s no fences, seating & if it is introduced safe standing would stop a crush, gates now open outwards & the Danny Dyer wannabe idiots are rightly seen as the stupid wankers they actually are rather than the authors in waiting they once were.

Let the dead rest & remember them respectfully rather than this stick to beat each other with.
 
Woanz said:
Yes but people always want to absolve themselves of blame, you can sort of understand why as well given what’s happened.

It was a terrible accident & I just don’t see what penance some want from Liverpool fans will achieve although the same could be said about them & their attitude to the police.

Lessons have been learnt & there’s no fences, seating & if it is introduced safe standing would stop a crush, gates now open outwards & the Danny Dyer wannabe idiots are rightly seen as the stupid wankers they actually are rather than the authors in waiting they once were.

Let the dead rest & remember them respectfully rather than this stick to beat each other with.
Click to expand...
Just an acknowledgement would do. You only need to look at their behaviour last week though to see what their mentality is...
 
The year before we played Leyton orient away in the FA cup , I was there and coming down the back stairs to get out after the match there was an almighty crush. Too many people penned into these terraces the country over , week in week out. It was bound to happen sooner or later IMO.
 
Basha73 said:
Just an acknowledgement would do. You only need to look at their behaviour last week though to see what their mentality is...
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That was my original context for getting into this Hillsborough thing, namely that despite it being the anniversary of the deaths, and the blaming of Liverpool fans that took place, there are some that are so deluded and hell- bent on stupid behaviour that they attack the Real Madrid bus. It is very disappointing.
 
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