All VAR Discussions Here Please | Page 22 | Vital Football

All VAR Discussions Here Please

Walthamstow wanderer said:
I think the big problem yesterday was the bloke sat in front of the monitors . It was commented on that he was a fairly new addition to the “Premier”’(and I use that term very loosely) list and may have been reticent to overturn or assert his views on senior refs . They are not my thoughts but those of the pundits in the BT studio. It was remarked that he had 50 premier games experience whilst Michael Oliver had over 250 games . The lack of experience certainly showed with the release of the “ human error “ statement . They must be cringing on the Stockley Park bench . What a can of worms that can open up .
There were other glaring errors yesterday , Matics comment on Giroud being offside . He was deemed offside against Utd on Monday but not against us . Similar incidents with the same amount of “ offsideness” ( I think I’ve made up a new word there ?) have been poured over for minutes and minutes and given offside .Maybe they didn’t want to incur Lampards wrath again , after his midweek rants , The Lo Celso Stamp , I’m still of the opinion it was a red but obviously a lot of you don’t ,. Oliver’s entire handling of the game was atrocious, he let far too much go unpunished and allowed niggles to expand to far worse “contests” . The push in the back now seems to go unpunished and the the fake claim and subsequent dive of a push in the back now gets rewarded , with commentators saying how “ he cleverly won the free kick by inviting contact “ . Refs must a get a grip of games , they are losing control by allowing the cameras to do their job too much and it’s creeping into their general decision making .
The other TV game was even worse . Debruynes hand ball conformed to all the new guidelines of handball , as debuted , and kindly demonstrated, by Sissoko in Madrid , but was ignored by the ref and Var .Exactly how could that be ignored , was it accidental ? Was it a normal position of the hands ?

. How on Earth was the keepers “taking out” of Inheacho not looked at .I don’t think it was even a corner , as given by the ref , the keeper was nowhere near the ball . He just took him out but it wasn’t even looked at .

Then there was Walkers assault on the Leicester left back . Can anyone tell me that wasn’t reckless . He came steaming in , got the ball, i admit , but took the player totally . Just got ignored .
VAR hasn’t had many , if any , good days but yesterday was a bad one . I’ve heard there were other stupid incidents as well in other games . Haven’t seen those , kept well away from MoTD
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What I would add that like all commentators, Fletcher and Hoddle should feel thoroughly ashamed of their commentary around the VAR incidences. It was if Hoddle had never played the game in his entire life the way he spoke about them.

It's such a shame that the influence of The FA on the TV companies has meant that the punditry is like a wet lettuce. They all know they won't have a job if they go too strong especially if the commentator and co-commentator start calling it how it really is during the game.

I stand by my statement that anyone that has ever played football knows that if Gio wanted to hurt Azpilicueta then he would have left in an ambulance. He refused the opportunity to hurt the Chelsea captain who clearly is a coward as he tried to get a fellow professional sent off. Lampard also knew what really happened and showed absolutely no class in what he said.

I am enjoying the rugby today. Nice to watch some real men play and commentate on sport.
 
Felt compelled to post this. Just watching the RM vs City match and 5'9" Jesus magically out jumps Ramos to score a headed goal. The entire watching world knew that VAR had to check the push in the back. Nope, the referee was having none of it and it wasn't reviewed.

Isn't it comforting to know that it's not just in England that this VAR things is completely messed up?
 
Offside and handball laws under Ifab review along with concussion substitutions

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Wolverhampton Wanderers have had four goals ruled out by VAR this season due to offside decisions
Football's rule-makers are to review the offside law in order to "foster the spirit of attacking play".
The decision was made at the annual general meeting of The International Football Association Board (Ifab).
The organisation, meeting in Belfast, also approved clarifications to the handball law to "differentiate more clearly" between the arm and shoulder.
And substitutions for concussion cases are to be trialled, potentially at the Tokyo Olympics this summer.
It appears likely that permanent substitutions would be the preferred option rather than a temporary substitution while a 10-minute assessment is carried out.
Offside decisions have come under closer scrutiny in the Premier League this season following the introduction of the video assistant referee.
The time spent reaching a decision over marginal calls earlier in the season prompted Ifab general secretary Lukas Brud to reiterate that VAR systems should only be used to correct "clear and obvious errors".
Earlier this month, Fifa's chief of global football development Arsene Wenger said there might be room to the change the offside law "a little bit" in response to video assistant referee controversy.
The former Arsenal manager wants to refine the rules to favour the attacking player, saying they should be deemed onside if any part of their body that can score a goal is at least level with the defender, even if other parts are in front.
Wenger's calls for the introduction of what has been dubbed a 'daylight' offside rule have since been backed by Fifa president Gianni Infantino.
He said that principle was backed by the rest of the Ifab.
"It has been received very positively," said Infantino after Saturday's meeting. "That is why we decided to study this further, to debate it in different panels and with different stakeholders to elaborate a protocol.
"Obviously the philosophy of fostering attacking football always has to guide us. We have to be aware of tradition but it is true the offside rule has evolved over time.
"We will look into providing strikers more goalscoring opportunities and that's why I think the feeling in the room and the feedback in the room was positive. But we have to test it."
 
Handball rule adopts the 'T-shirt line'


Bournemouth manager Eddie Howe on the way VAR decisions affected his side against Burnley
The most significant change to the laws of the game to come out of today's Ifab annual general meeting concerned the handball rule.

From the start of the 2020/21 season, the point at which the arm stops and the shoulder begins will now be written into the laws of the game as the "T-shirt line".

The new ruling aims to allow match officials to "differentiate more clearly" between the arm and shoulder.

Confusion about where the line is drawn was evident in Burnley's 3-0 win at home to Bournemouth last weekend.

The Cherries had a Joshua King goal ruled out by a VAR check for a handball by Philip Billing that manager Eddie Howe claimed came off his shoulder.

And the match swung in the second-half on another handball decision, again made by VAR, against Bournemouth's Adam Smith, who was judged to have used his upper arm to control the ball.

The "T-shirt line" is the latest in a number of clarifications to the handball rules, which, like the offside laws, have been put under the microscope by the use of VAR.

The last amendment, which has been in force since last season's Champions League final, said handball would be given against a player if their arms extend "beyond a natural silhouette" - even if it is accidental.
 
So now you WILL be able to score with your shoulder! So your shoulder WILL be used to determine if you’re offside or not . So all the talk of doing away with “ armpit offsides “ has been changed to shoulder offsides ,. Am I going mad
 
It's still a disgrace to me that IFAB and FIFA didn't pick up on these so very obvious flaws when business requirements were being proposed as technical solutions before anything was even built. Think 5 years ago. Anyone with half a brain could have seen what would happen and we've paid the price with a season or two marred by VAR controversy.

This all being said, this won't fix the problem we have in this country with a generation of very poor officials. There is clearly a cultural challenge at PGMOL where ego's, bias, arrogance, own agendas etc are allowed to prosper in their setup. We will still continue to see yellow cards not given for stonewall yellow offences and we'll see see no penalty for stonewall penalties. Nothing FIFA or IFAB can do about our own problems with these officials.

As for the VAR specific changes, I like the offside one and have been advocating for it for a while. The rules state level is onside so the technology solution should respect that.

The handball change is not even addressing the issue though. It's not about where it hits around the shoulder area as much as whether it was deliberate or not and arms were in a natural or unnatural position. The silhouette rule also creates debate. Part of me thinks for the defender they should forget the deliberate / accidental aspect and focus on distance from the kicker and whether it denies a clear cut goalscoring chance. With the attackers hand, it should be about whether they gain a clear advantage as well.
 
muttley said:
It's still a disgrace to me that IFAB and FIFA didn't pick up on these so very obvious flaws when business requirements were being proposed as technical solutions before anything was even built. Think 5 years ago. Anyone with half a brain could have seen what would happen and we've paid the price with a season or two marred by VAR controversy.

This all being said, this won't fix the problem we have in this country with a generation of very poor officials. There is clearly a cultural challenge at PGMOL where ego's, bias, arrogance, own agendas etc are allowed to prosper in their setup. We will still continue to see yellow cards not given for stonewall yellow offences and we'll see see no penalty for stonewall penalties. Nothing FIFA or IFAB can do about our own problems with these officials.

As for the VAR specific changes, I like the offside one and have been advocating for it for a while. The rules state level is onside so the technology solution should respect that.

The handball change is not even addressing the issue though. It's not about where it hits around the shoulder area as much as whether it was deliberate or not and arms were in a natural or unnatural position. The silhouette rule also creates debate. Part of me thinks for the defender they should forget the deliberate / accidental aspect and focus on distance from the kicker and whether it denies a clear cut goalscoring chance. With the attackers hand, it should be about whether they gain a clear advantage as well.
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Couldn’t agree more . It’s almost as if we expect referees to actually adjudicate and manage the game . Huh , as if !! !!!!!!!!!!
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
Couldn’t agree more . It’s almost as if we expect referees to actually adjudicate and manage the game . Huh , as if !! !!!!!!!!!!
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Can you imagine a game where after 3 mins a stonewall yellow card is committed and given, and nobody bats an eyelid? That should have been our game today with Neves and Attwell. The problem is, there was not even a thought of a yellow. Neves has completed 180 mins with Attwell in charge this season, and hasn't even got near a yellow.

I'm sure they will be sending each other Xmas cards again :-)
 
Mutters , I haven’t seen the game , not even the motd highlights which is why I haven’t commented at all . I heard it on the radio that he pulled Moura back when he was through and both the commentators on there were incredulous that he wasn’t cautioned .
It really is winding me up . I did see the Watford game and what the team in red were doing was unbelievable , but carried out in such arrogance. Lovren in particular . Oliver was his usual self . How he did not give a penalty on the stroke of half time I do not know .
The standard of our referees is really poor and it was reflected that none of them were selected for the last World Cup . The Euros will be interesting as well , can’t imagine any of them being chosen for that either .
 
You know , I’m really grateful for VAR ,,really pleased we have it in our game . It’s shown me that having watched , played , coached , managed , lived and breathed football for the last sixty three years , I know exactly fuck all about our beautiful game !!!
I don’t know the offside law , don’t know what handball is , don’t know what a foul is , and absolutely don’t know what dangerous play is .
I have VAR to thank for educating me . Until next week when everything I’ve just learnt gets altered under new interpretations by different idiots
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
You know , I’m really grateful for VAR ,,really pleased we have it in our game . It’s shown me that having watched , played , coached , managed , lived and breathed football for the last sixty three years , I know exactly fuck all about our beautiful game !!!
I don’t know the offside law , don’t know what handball is , don’t know what a foul is , and absolutely don’t know what dangerous play is .
I have VAR to thank for educating me . Until next week when everything I’ve just learnt gets altered under new interpretations by different idiots
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Don't be so harsh on yourself lol! 'Progress' is never linear and the c***s that run this game have to keep moving the goal-posts to justify the huge enoumous sums they take from it.

It was once a simple game, but that's exactly why they have to complicate it - you can't earn 2.5 mill a year as an administrator if you keep it simple and we wouldn't want to rob him of his income, would we?!!!!
 
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Spursex said:
Don't be so harsh on yourself lol! 'Progress' is never linear and the c***s that run this game have to keep moving the goal-posts to justify the huge enoumous sums they take from it.

It was once a simple game, but that's exactly why they have to complicate it - you can't earn 2.5 mill a year as an administrator is you keep it simple and we wouldn't want to rob him of his income, would we?!!!!
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Good point well made Ex ha ha
 
80deg16minW said:
VAR - taking controversial decisions and delaying them before another controversial decision is made.
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You couldn’t , in all honesty , make it up , could you .,
I saw a game last night , can’t remember which one , centre forward went up for a scissor kick near the six yard line , crowded area , centre half put his hand up to protect his face , ball hits his arm , VAR agrees its a penalty . No intent was made or deemed to have been made .
crazy crazy crazy
 
Walthamstow wanderer said:
You couldn’t , in all honesty , make it up , could you .,
I saw a game last night , can’t remember which one , centre forward went up for a scissor kick near the six yard line , crowded area , centre half put his hand up to protect his face , ball hits his arm , VAR agrees its a penalty . No intent was made or deemed to have been made .
crazy crazy crazy
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I keep saying this but until football remove the words "clear and obvious", those video refs will keep misbehaving in this way. If those words weren't there to hide behind then all they could do is follow the rules rather than protect their mate in the middle.

The fans are programmed to only quote the rules when making their judgment on decisions which makes us right 90% of the time.
 
I think bad luck, Bournemouth weren't far behind us and they've not done anything to upset anyone afaik.

We got our fair share of luck in the CL run with VAR (Aguero and Llorente goals) but it stings a bit to think we now have evidence we could have been in the top 4 despite our pretty poor form for most of this season if a handful of bad calls had gone the correct way.
 
I would love half an hour in a locked room with michael
Oliver and mike dean . Not to do anything nasty , honest , just to ask questions and get an answer out of them , an honest answer !
 
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