The High Press - What Should We Be Doing? | Vital Football

The High Press - What Should We Be Doing?

mikeosullivan

Vital Squad Member
I included this in my player ratings. Overall, we are a mess. We have struggled badly against any team that comes to the Bank and plays a high press, yet we stubbornly stick to our guns and play out from the back with no tactics apparently to do anything else.

It doesn't affect us as much away from home as home teams rarely use a high press - the onus is on them to attack. At home it is just too easy for teams to counter our style. This has been going on for at least six months, and our home form has been both appalling as well as frustrating and slightly boring.

Griffiths doesn't help. Watch when he has the ball at his feet how many seconds it takes him to play a 15 yard pass to one of the centre backs. Its at least 3 or 4 seconds - and that gives a high press more than enough time to put the pass receiver under pressure.

Even when the centre backs do have time, the only midfielder who shows for a pass is McGrandles. There is no movement from the other midfielders, so often the only pass available is a long ball to a forward. And we just can't play a long ball, whether from the centre backs, from the full backs, or from Griffiths. We struggled with long balls even when Hopper was fit.

My question is why, when this has been going on through the whole of 2021, we have developed no plan B to play out in a different style? You can tell when Griffiths has to kick long that he is doing it as a total last resort with no planning apart from that silly kick out to the right aiming at Poole's head.

I can just imagine Danny & Nicky's team talk on Monday - probably the easiest tactical session they have ever had to take.

I am puzzled. We have an experienced coaching staff. Another poster mentioned the word "stubborn". Is that it? "My teams play out from the back. Full stop."
 
My take: we no longer have the players to pass out from back against a determined high press.

No Edun, no Grant in front of him, no Eyoma at RB playing well, no Walsh, no Jackson, no Bridcutt, no Johnson or Hopper dropping deep to pick up the ball.

Remember that game against Sunlan? We're back there. Hapless, hopeless and hilariously incompetent.
 
We had some quick, wide players. Elbouzedi, Archibald, Anderson and Brammal. Only one remains and he seems out of favour.

What we now have is a team of identikit "tidy", "technical" one-paced light-weight nothing players.

Did those players run too fast and fall out of favour as a result?
 
What should we be doing?
Playing faster! More Instinct, less over-thinking!

As was alluded to with Griffiths, and it's not just him, players dwell on the ball; it's as though they are trying to not only figure out what the best pass is for them, but what the next pass will be after that, and then after that, and then... Ohh bugger, I need to pass this backwards!!!
 
We had some quick, wide players. Elbouzedi, Archibald, Anderson and Brammal. Only one remains and he seems out of favour.

What we now have is a team of identikit "tidy", "technical" one-paced light-weight nothing players.
Not one of them wanted to run past the full back last night. Felt like head butting my programme
 
Three, four, whoops pass gone astray.
Cut the clever crap play football.
Get quick wide players.
The quick wide players are a decent starting point. Sadly, none of our "identikit tidy, technical one-paced light-weight nothing midfield players" show the slightest desire or urgency to drive into the box having given the ball to said pacey wide players.
Going forward, at times (becoming more frequently) we are an absolute joke.
 
I commented in the match thread about this but what is the alternative? We can't punt it long and give teams the ball all the time.

I think part of the problem is no Hopper / no one you can force the ball into feet of. Coupled with Bridcutt who is very good at dropping into a back three and picking the ball up?
 
I think our squad is too much like a premiership development team.

the league ones staples are too injury prone and when they are not available we struggle.

to be effective again we need to restore the balance.

we need more physicality in midfield and someone to win headers upfront and pacey players following up on the second ball.

the build up is too slow and deliberate when you look for the perfect play. Sometimes ugly is what you want.
 
The quick wide players are a decent starting point. Sadly, none of our "identikit tidy, technical one-paced light-weight nothing midfield players" show the slightest desire or urgency to drive into the box having given the ball to said pacey wide players.
Going forward, at times (becoming more frequently) we are an absolute joke.
Sorenson did but he puttered out of steam just as I got out of my seat excited.
 
It's not so much playing out from the back, more playing around at the back. It's the same pattern, Griffiths to the centre back, centre back to full back, full back has to go back to the centre back who then passes to the other centre back who in turn passes to the other full back. Eventually one of the full backs has to hit it down the line or it goes back to Griffiths who smacks it up the middle. That's if one of the preceding passes haven't been intercepted. We don't have the physicality to compete for the long balls so we lose possession anyway.

Playing out requires players to be able to take the ball under pressure, on the turn. Create angles and offer options to the man with the ball. We do none of that and seem to be passing responsibility to someone else to make the mistake.

It's insanity from MA to insist on asking players to do things they're not capable of.
 
To be honest I can’t work out what type of players our midfielders are. Normally you can quickly tell if they are creative, defensive, box to box , run with the ball or pass , good in the air of strong in the tackle..
After 20 games I have no idea about Sorensen or Fiorini for example
 
Then again we might win Saturday and some will question my right to sound a bit doubtful about personnel and tactics. I’m sure that’s a juniper 🌳
 
What ever we do to combat the high press will have to be done in the classroom, I doubt we have enough fit uninjured players to get on the grass.

Not been to the EPC, but presume there is a dugout for Sanders to sit in if they do get on grass.
 
I included this in my player ratings. Overall, we are a mess. We have struggled badly against any team that comes to the Bank and plays a high press, yet we stubbornly stick to our guns and play out from the back with no tactics apparently to do anything else.

It doesn't affect us as much away from home as home teams rarely use a high press - the onus is on them to attack. At home it is just too easy for teams to counter our style. This has been going on for at least six months, and our home form has been both appalling as well as frustrating and slightly boring.

Griffiths doesn't help. Watch when he has the ball at his feet how many seconds it takes him to play a 15 yard pass to one of the centre backs. Its at least 3 or 4 seconds - and that gives a high press more than enough time to put the pass receiver under pressure.

Even when the centre backs do have time, the only midfielder who shows for a pass is McGrandles. There is no movement from the other midfielders, so often the only pass available is a long ball to a forward. And we just can't play a long ball, whether from the centre backs, from the full backs, or from Griffiths. We struggled with long balls even when Hopper was fit.

My question is why, when this has been going on through the whole of 2021, we have developed no plan B to play out in a different style? You can tell when Griffiths has to kick long that he is doing it as a total last resort with no planning apart from that silly kick out to the right aiming at Poole's head.

I can just imagine Danny & Nicky's team talk on Monday - probably the easiest tactical session they have ever had to take.

I am puzzled. We have an experienced coaching staff. Another poster mentioned the word "stubborn". Is that it? "My teams play out from the back. Full stop."

This is the best post I have seen here so far.

We are trying to be a footballing side which is a great idea but execution is very poor. Home form is a joke and fact that we are managing something like two shots on target per about 200 mins of football recently means that this Appleton's ,,tiki taka'' is not working. Not at the moment anyway.
As for the answers I don't think I am the right person to look for them. Since it is a public forum though we can talk about for a little while 😉.
Obvious things like right personnel to do the job and as it stands from all our defenders only Monstma looks like good enough on the ball to be suitable for this style tbh.
If we're talking right personnel we have to mention pace. Pace to be able to add width to our game. Pace to simply ,,kill'' other teams with it when opportunity arises. Can't even think why we don't have absolutely any after last transfer window..
Constant movement which creates always some options for the man with the ball.
Automatisms when players know each others movement without looking which can only be created on the training pitch over the time.
Bridcutt being fit as he can beat the pressing and move team from defence to attack very quickly.
Try Sanders as he seems to be this type of player too.
Finally some sort of plan B and people to implement it which I think is the area where we are very short as well.
There is obviously lot more things that can be mention here but at the end of the day it will always be the man in charge to find the answers. It's his responsibility. He works with the team every day. This is what he is paid for He is very highly regarded by many so it's time for him to make things happen. Hope and believe he can do it. I think to give himself a chance to succeed he needs to have a very good January transfer window...
 
What should we be doing?
Playing faster! More Instinct, less over-thinking!

As was alluded to with Griffiths, and it's not just him, players dwell on the ball; it's as though they are trying to not only figure out what the best pass is for them, but what the next pass will be after that, and then after that, and then... Ohh bugger, I need to pass this backwards!!!
It’s as if their individual instinct is being coached out of them. We’re coaching a style that they are not accustomed to, or are incapable of adapting to. So, is the coaching to blame, or the players? Both?